Haas VF-20 Speculation Thread

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jjn9128
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Re: Haas VF-20 Speculation Thread

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Redragon wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 2:39 pm
Non an expert but those strips paintings at the front wing as the fin does help a bit with the airflow? (otherwise would not be painted fragmented, specially on the fin that it is just one element)
No. A paint lip 0.01mm thick is not going to have an appreciable affect on airflow. It is a purely aesthetic consideration.
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GioKer32
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Re: Haas VF-20 Speculation Thread

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jjn9128 wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 3:18 pm
Redragon wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 2:39 pm
Non an expert but those strips paintings at the front wing as the fin does help a bit with the airflow? (otherwise would not be painted fragmented, specially on the fin that it is just one element)
No. A paint lip 0.01mm thick is not going to have an appreciable affect on airflow. It is a purely aesthetic consideration.
I agree, but isn't this texture a bit heavier?

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Redragon
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Re: Haas VF-20 Speculation Thread

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jjn9128 wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 3:18 pm
Redragon wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 2:39 pm
Non an expert but those strips paintings at the front wing as the fin does help a bit with the airflow? (otherwise would not be painted fragmented, specially on the fin that it is just one element)
No. A paint lip 0.01mm thick is not going to have an appreciable affect on airflow. It is a purely aesthetic consideration.
It is what I thought but because on the fin has a strange pattern split in 2 sections and also it is only on airflow areas I thought might had some effect. Thanks

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jjn9128
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Re: Haas VF-20 Speculation Thread

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GioKer32 wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 3:33 pm
I agree, but isn't this texture a bit heavier?
Black/dark paint is heavier than white which is why airliners are all white. I assume gloss has to have some lacquer in it which would make it heavier than a matte finish? I can't imagine over the area of an F1 car the difference in weight is all that great otherwise they'd all be white.
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PlatinumZealot
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Re: Haas VF-20 Speculation Thread

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Keeping the surface slippery so that track dirt and tyre fragments dont stick to it is also why the wings are glossy. The additional weight is neglible compared to these benefits. The front wing is also ballasted so weight from a few microns of paintis not detrimental here.

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Re: Haas VF-20 Speculation Thread

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Forget about the bodywork weight, it's negligible, the front wing itself can be picked up with one hand, even with ballast installed. The heaviest part of the car is the fuel tank, the power unit, and the transmission, some could make a case for the survival cell, but I think 2 people can pick that up without much drama. Every other component can be picked up by one person with two hands.
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jumpingfish
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Re: Haas VF-20 Speculation Thread

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jjn9128 wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 4:24 pm
GioKer32 wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 3:33 pm
I agree, but isn't this texture a bit heavier?
Black/dark paint is heavier than white which is why airliners are all white. I assume gloss has to have some lacquer in it which would make it heavier than a matte finish? I can't imagine over the area of an F1 car the difference in weight is all that great otherwise they'd all be white.
Isn't black color better than white because of black carbon fibre? I'm not sure how relevant and reliable this article is today, but sounds logical (also floors and diffusers are black)
Type of color is very important. Paints are specially developed for carbon fiber, and specially developed for Formula 1. Paint must be light and have good covering properties to save the weight. One of the advantages of having a black car for example is that you need less layers of paint to cover black carbon fiber than a white car, so you save weight, probably worth up to half a tenth of a second per lap. Painting an F1 car white, requires three or four layers and one top coat, and uses around 4 kilos of paint. A black car needs only one base layer and one top coat, so saves around 30% of paint.
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e30ernest
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Re: Haas VF-20 Speculation Thread

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jjn9128 wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 4:24 pm
GioKer32 wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 3:33 pm
I agree, but isn't this texture a bit heavier?
Black/dark paint is heavier than white which is why airliners are all white.
I thought the use of white on aircraft was because white was better at rejecting heat and UV light?

foxmulder_ms
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Re: Haas VF-20 Speculation Thread

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e30ernest wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 6:59 pm
jjn9128 wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 4:24 pm
GioKer32 wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 3:33 pm
I agree, but isn't this texture a bit heavier?
Black/dark paint is heavier than white which is why airliners are all white.
I thought the use of white on aircraft was because white was better at rejecting heat and UV light?

Weight too.

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: Haas VF-20 Speculation Thread

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So with the advent of next generation passenger planes made of carbon fibre we should expect majority black paint is what some of you are saying?

Boeing 787 dreamliner

Image

I think UV reflection theory is more convincing.

Or maybe because white paint is just cheap. Lol

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Holm86
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Re: Haas VF-20 Speculation Thread

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I doubt planes will ever be mostly black, weight is a huge factor, but so is heat rejection.

Pepsi cola once made a marketing stunt, where they painted a Concorde in blue, and it wasn't able to fly at its cruise speed for more that 20 minutes, because the fuselage got too hot.

I know that modern airlines doesn't fly at supersonic speeds, but they spend s lot of time on the ground, with their engines turned off, and the engines drives the air-conditioning. So think of a black 787 sitting in the Dubai heat for a couple of hours, and then boarding it :oops:

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Holm86
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Re: Haas VF-20 Speculation Thread

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And yes, you would never have a bare carbon airplane, as you would need some sort of UV blocker 😊

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: Haas VF-20 Speculation Thread

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Holm86 wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 10:49 pm
I doubt planes will ever be mostly black, weight is a huge factor, but so is heat rejection.

Pepsi cola once made a marketing stunt, where they painted a Concorde in blue, and it wasn't able to fly at its cruise speed for more that 20 minutes, because the fuselage got too hot.

I know that modern airlines doesn't fly at supersonic speeds, but they spend s lot of time on the ground, with their engines turned off, and the engines drives the air-conditioning. So think of a black 787 sitting in the Dubai heat for a couple of hours, and then boarding it :oops:
Are you srue there was not more to the story? Ha

Image


The concorde goes supersonic... But i dont see any increase in radiation from the sun there...
Possibly the blue paint was not a high performing paint?

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Holm86
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Re: Haas VF-20 Speculation Thread

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PlatinumZealot wrote:
Sun Feb 09, 2020 12:16 am
Holm86 wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 10:49 pm
I doubt planes will ever be mostly black, weight is a huge factor, but so is heat rejection.

Pepsi cola once made a marketing stunt, where they painted a Concorde in blue, and it wasn't able to fly at its cruise speed for more that 20 minutes, because the fuselage got too hot.

I know that modern airlines doesn't fly at supersonic speeds, but they spend s lot of time on the ground, with their engines turned off, and the engines drives the air-conditioning. So think of a black 787 sitting in the Dubai heat for a couple of hours, and then boarding it :oops:
Are you srue there was not more to the story? Ha

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/ ... 37-7H4.jpg


The concorde goes supersonic... But i dont see any increase in radiation from the sun there...
Possibly the blue paint was not a high performing paint?
https://simpleflying.com/air-france-pep ... -concorde/

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: Haas VF-20 Speculation Thread

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I still dont buy it. :?

The blackbird is black. And it flies to the edge of space. Granted it has titanium skin.

How would the speed of the plane affect the radiation from the sun? It actually shouldn't.
There is skin friction. That increases as you go faster. But the colour of the paint shouldnt affect that.
What might be the real reason, is that to go at supersonic speeds the planes generally have to fly at a higher altitude where the air is less dense to reduce drag . Less atmosphere means greater radiation from the sun of course.

It was not said if this Pepsi paint was a special paint or just regular schmegular blue paint. Of course the factory white must have been very expensive. Would Concorde really remove this expensive paint to cover the plane in some cheap blue pepsi paint? Likely not. Perhaps the blue paint is not even paint at all. Perhaps it was a vynil wrap! Of course whatever material, an additional layer, would reduce the heat transfer coefficient from the skin of the plane hurting cooling.

Still not convinced it was the blue colour. I feel there is more to it than that.