Ferrari SF1000

A place to discuss the characteristics of the cars in Formula One, both current as well as historical. Laptimes, driver worshipping and team chatter does not belong here.
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MtthsMlw
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Re: Ferrari SF1000

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The car must be insanely draggy not just down on power.
S1
P19 Vet 314
P20 Lec 314

Both Alfas fastest btw with 325km/h

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JordanMugen
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Re: Ferrari SF1000

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Pany wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 2:15 pm
You alldon't understand. After 3 years fo lost battles against mercedes, last year decided tactically to switch and ancicipate car development for 2021 with total new rules from zero, the same Renault did. That's it.
If true, how come SF1000 seems to be a radically different car to SF90? It now runs high downforce instead of low downforce. It does not seem like a mere SF90B to me, at least not in aerodynamic concept even if it physically reuses the same or similar structural and chassis components.
jumpingfish wrote:
Wed Jul 01, 2020 12:30 pm
26 February 2020
At the SF1000’s launch, Mattia Binotto revealed that Ferrari had created the SF1000 with the aim of “trying to look for maximum aero performance and maximise the downforce level”. And Leclerc confirmed that it was mission accomplished on that front, when asked where the car was best.
“I think the biggest strength is the speed around the corners. I think on that, we have achieved our goal. Then we need to wait and see for the overall performance of the car, but… we are going around the corners quicker than we did last year, so that's positive. But we need to keep working on this car to unlock a bit more performance.”
https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/arti ... pMI4K.html

TheFluffy
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Re: Ferrari SF1000

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Guys I don't think we need to panic after today... poor performance was expected for these few races. Just commentators, media and some of us somewhat expected them to take the sandbags off. The matter of the fact is they based their design of SF1000 on the SF90 but focused on adding maximum downforce while sacrificing efficiency.

Isolating today's performance, it is a combination of the weather conditions and poor qualifying setup that caused them to struggle that much. I absolutely do not believe today is a true reflection on how bad they are (as proven from their superior race pace compared to midfield) Think about it, I believe Red Bull's time is more or less same with their last year's time so it reflects on the conditions making some cars to not truly show their improvements.

Of course, this is part of a bigger issue of their lack of correlation. And hopefully the upgrade will put them on the right track. I think they most likely will now try to pursue the same level of downforce while extremely making it a lot less draggy. Cuz being slowest on the straights is definite alarming but their cornering speeds aren't bad.

ncx
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Re: Ferrari SF1000

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LEC, last year pole lap vs today Q3 comparison from turn 1 to turn 4.
Acceleration is quite similar until speeds at which drag becomes very relevant. I don't think it's straightforward to determine how much of the deficit is due to higher drag or lower power. In the corners the SF1000 behaves better, suggesting a significantly higher downforce; that may have been achieved in an aero inefficient way.

Image

(It seems to me that this has not been posted yet. Otherwise, apologies.)

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Unf
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Re: Ferrari SF1000

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They lost a lot of speed and gain almost no in turns... such a crap.

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subcritical71
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Re: Ferrari SF1000

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ncx wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:32 pm
LEC, last year pole lap vs today Q3 comparison from turn 1 to turn 4.
Acceleration is quite similar until speeds at which drag becomes very relevant. I don't think it's straightforward to determine how much of the deficit is due to higher drag or lower power. In the corners the SF1000 behaves better, suggesting a significantly higher downforce; that may have been achieved in an aero inefficient way.

https://www.formulapassion.it/wp-c ... x432.jpg

(It seems to me that this has not been posted yet. Otherwise, apologies.)
Could they have got the gearing wrong?!? I haven't seen rpm traces but I'm a bit skeptical that this is all down to aero.

TimW
TimW
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Re: Ferrari SF1000

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ncx wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:32 pm
LEC, last year pole lap vs today Q3 comparison from turn 1 to turn 4.
Acceleration is quite similar until speeds at which drag becomes very relevant. ...
Or at speeds at which fuel flow limits become relevant.....

But agree, part of the top speed deficit is definitely due to drag. Hope their race pace and (hopefully) improved tire wear makes them more competitive in the race.

wowgr8
wowgr8
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Re: Ferrari SF1000

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TheFluffy wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 5:29 pm
Guys I don't think we need to panic after today... poor performance was expected for these few races. Just commentators, media and some of us somewhat expected them to take the sandbags off. The matter of the fact is they based their design of SF1000 on the SF90 but focused on adding maximum downforce while sacrificing efficiency.

Isolating today's performance, it is a combination of the weather conditions and poor qualifying setup that caused them to struggle that much. I absolutely do not believe today is a true reflection on how bad they are (as proven from their superior race pace compared to midfield) Think about it, I believe Red Bull's time is more or less same with their last year's time so it reflects on the conditions making some cars to not truly show their improvements.

Of course, this is part of a bigger issue of their lack of correlation. And hopefully the upgrade will put them on the right track. I think they most likely will now try to pursue the same level of downforce while extremely making it a lot less draggy. Cuz being slowest on the straights is definite alarming but their cornering speeds aren't bad.
Well said, the part about them adding downforce without sacrificing efficiency is right on the money, they didn't do a 180 on the concept like some people think they did (which makes some of their supposed cornering gains impressive)

NoDivergence
NoDivergence
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Re: Ferrari SF1000

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Impressive? They're the only team when a time slower than 2018. The only team

Marble
Marble
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Re: Ferrari SF1000

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IvailoStefanovBG
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Location: Bulgaria

Re: Ferrari SF1000

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ncx wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:32 pm
LEC, last year pole lap vs today Q3 comparison from turn 1 to turn 4.
Acceleration is quite similar until speeds at which drag becomes very relevant. I don't think it's straightforward to determine how much of the deficit is due to higher drag or lower power. In the corners the SF1000 behaves better, suggesting a significantly higher downforce; that may have been achieved in an aero inefficient way.

https://www.formulapassion.it/wp-c ... x432.jpg

(It seems to me that this has not been posted yet. Otherwise, apologies.)
This can also mean less electrical energy to power MGUK....

toraabe
toraabe
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Re: Ferrari SF1000

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It could also be mapping of the mgu k. How it is deployed...... But the car is less efficient and too draggy in comparison to the others relative to engine power.

Flanker27
Flanker27
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Re: Ferrari SF1000

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ncx wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:32 pm
LEC, last year pole lap vs today Q3 comparison from turn 1 to turn 4.
Acceleration is quite similar until speeds at which drag becomes very relevant. I don't think it's straightforward to determine how much of the deficit is due to higher drag or lower power. In the corners the SF1000 behaves better, suggesting a significantly higher downforce; that may have been achieved in an aero inefficient way.

https://www.formulapassion.it/wp-c ... x432.jpg

(It seems to me that this has not been posted yet. Otherwise, apologies.)
In the article of FormulaPassion, they analyze that graphic and say that the there is ALSO an engine problem (together with a drag problem). They suggest that they have less torque and so are forced to use all the hybrid part too early in comparison to last year, so they are missing it later.

Mansell89
Mansell89
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Re: Ferrari SF1000

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Guys how do we think the higher downforce model this season will help the Ferrari tyres in the race?

Will it be a positive or a negative?

The car looks pretty smooth across the lap in general I thought so they may be able to race pretty well is my gut feeling, but I don’t have the technical knowledge to back that up.

Any thoughts?

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MtthsMlw
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Location: Germany

Re: Ferrari SF1000

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ncx wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:32 pm
LEC, last year pole lap vs today Q3 comparison from turn 1 to turn 4.
Acceleration is quite similar until speeds at which drag becomes very relevant. I don't think it's straightforward to determine how much of the deficit is due to higher drag or lower power. In the corners the SF1000 behaves better, suggesting a significantly higher downforce; that may have been achieved in an aero inefficient way.

https://www.formulapassion.it/wp-c ... x432.jpg

(It seems to me that this has not been posted yet. Otherwise, apologies.)
I tend to agree that it's mostly aero that slows them on the straights. The gap for example to Merc gets bigger the higher the speed. Drag is proportional to speed squared.
After the TDs last year, that might or might not clamped down possible engine trickery, we still saw the SF90 pull away on the straights shown in graphs like this.
Reminds me a bit of the Williams in recent years. Powerful engine but often slowest in the speed traps.