2013 Italian GP - Monza

[iotar__]

I think Mercedes could snatch their first 1-2 here if it's all dry running. I'm sure Hamilton will go with the lowest DF package he can get away with as we have seen in the past. Red Bull will gear for acceleration as they have in the past and Ferrari will be somewhere in between, as they have in the past.

Just pulling from history

Careful, remember 2010?

[dougskullery]

I think Mercedes could snatch their first 1-2 here if it's all dry running. I'm sure Hamilton will go with the lowest DF package he can get away with as we have seen in the past. Red Bull will gear for acceleration as they have in the past and Ferrari will be somewhere in between, as they have in the past.

Just pulling from history

Careful, remember 2010?

2010 was pretty unique though in terms of setup, thanks to the F-duct. Don't think we'll be seeing barn door rear wings at Monza again any time soon!

[f1316]

Actually, didn't Hamilton go with the low downforce setting in 2010 without the f-duct (ie a normal monza setup)? It was button who had a barn door with an f-duct.

I think Ferrari will be strong though. The car's very efficient in a straight line and I think their weakest point - traction - is less of a negative here than Montreal

[raymondu999]

traction - is less of a negative here than Montreal

I don't think the F138 is lacking traction. I'm not sure I agree with the above statement though.

Monza has slower corners, leading onto longer straights, compared to Canada. Traction is more of an issue here than at Canada, if anything.

[beelsebob]

I think Mercedes could snatch their first 1-2 here if it's all dry running. I'm sure Hamilton will go with the lowest DF package he can get away with as we have seen in the past. Red Bull will gear for acceleration as they have in the past and Ferrari will be somewhere in between, as they have in the past.

Just pulling from history

The problem is that it's all change this year (and a little last year) in terms of car strengths. So I don't really think it's valid to draw from history just now. Not saying you're wrong, but I don't really think the evidence is that strong that you're right.

[majki2111]

Just 1 offtopic question: Can you set-up the car to have GREAT traction, but to keep also GREAT max speed?

[raymondu999]

Just 1 offtopic question: Can you set-up the car to have GREAT traction, but to keep also GREAT max speed?

Yes, you can.

[SiLo]

I think Mercedes could snatch their first 1-2 here if it's all dry running. I'm sure Hamilton will go with the lowest DF package he can get away with as we have seen in the past. Red Bull will gear for acceleration as they have in the past and Ferrari will be somewhere in between, as they have in the past.

Just pulling from history

The problem is that it's all change this year (and a little last year) in terms of car strengths. So I don't really think it's valid to draw from history just now. Not saying you're wrong, but I don't really think the evidence is that strong that you're right.

This is true, I was more talking about how the cars are set up and how the teams seem to work though. The only one that's a real unknown is Mercedes because of the tyre wear, but I think they will get it right here.

[Tim.Wright]

Just 1 offtopic question: Can you set-up the car to have GREAT traction, but to keep also GREAT max speed?

If you put all of your downforce on the rear axle and all of the roll stiffness on the front you'd come close.

Only small problem I see with such a setup is the car won't want to turn corners.

[Shrieker]

Small problem eh

Someone mentioned in the spa thread that Merc's heavy starting fuel load was more apparent there because more of the lap was spent on full throttle. I wonder whether that's going to hurt them in the early laps here. If that's the case, they won't score a win even if they qualify very well.

[gray41]

Between Alonso and Vettel for the win?

[majki2111]

Just 1 offtopic question: Can you set-up the car to have GREAT traction, but to keep also GREAT max speed?

Yes, you can.

But there must be compromise. What will you loose?

[McMrocks]

I GUESS that for good traction you don't need much DF in Monza since the traction is needed at pretty low speeds where df doesn't take a big role.

For example the first corner/ chicane: The speed is that low that df isn't THAT important. You should use a very soft setup at least at the rear to get better traction. So you can keep the small RW and thus you don't have a less top speed.

But there are some corners where df is needed for traction ( or rather for a better rear stability): Parabolica, the corner before the Parabolica and the two right handers before that.

edit: keep in mind i didn't say that df doesn't matter at all at the "slow" corners. (slow isn't that slow in Formula 1)

[godlameroso]

The thing is that downforce helps during breaking and getting a good lap requires not just very high top speed but also good breaking for the two chicanes. Sector 1 is all about heavy braking and traction on corner exit, and riding the curbs as much as you can within reason. Then sector two is the two lesmos, the difference between a "high" downforce setup and a "low" downforce setup is about .3 here. Again the important thing is corner exit, the cambers on these turns make it tricky to spot the precise moment to get on the gas, it's easier if you have more downforce. Sector 3 you're going fast enough for the diffuser to do some real work so you can get away with a shallow wing, particularly as sector 3 is all about having the front end work for you.

[beelsebob]

Setting up suspension for the curbs on this track - do you want it soft anyway? Or is there a compromise. Do teams just rely on the bouncy tires to absorb that shock?

I would certainly imagine that you want soft suspension here for several reasons
1) Kerb riding
2) Traction
3) Not many corners that rely on ultimate aero setup, and hence need the car nice and level and stable.