2015 Austrian Grand Prix - 19-21 June

[foxmulder_ms]

What is this squabble about "boring races" or the '"rules"....

Not all races can be classics. Can one enjoy every football game at same level? Can every sports event be at the same level? Please guys...

Rules are there for a reason. What would you guys say if Mercedes was using 8 engines whereas Ferrari using 4 to reach the same points in the championship? Wouldn't Ferrari has done a better job? Without the engine change rules, rich teams will abuse it.

I agree that there is too much regulation regarding development in F1. However, this is different than Hamilton passing the pit line! In some circuits that will be dangerous. As a Hamilton fan, I was disappointed with him not the rules. It is F1 101...

[ChrisDanger]

What is this squabble about "boring races" or the '"rules"....

Not all races can be classics. Can one enjoy every football game at same level? Can every sports event be at the same level? Please guys...

I think there are two elements at play here.

• People like to complain. Some people are never happy. For me simply accepting things the way they are leads to a much more enjoyable experience.

• People expect everything to be awesome all the time. Awesome is an extreme experience, and by that I mean on a continuum of experience awesome is at the one end. You can't have awesome without the rest of the continuum to contrast it with. If everything was always awesome then awesome would become the new average. I think this is actually what's happening. Life is absolutely incredible yet we walk around in a haze of distractions which we then complain about.

[Jef Patat]

Ooooh, a psychological intermezzo

Sorry, couldn't resist. Your post actually holds a lot of truth, no disrespect meant. But remember, this is still the internet, open to everyone's opinion, also idiots, and remember the saying

Don't argue with idiots, they'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience

[f1316]

All the above is true.

But equally, if the rules of the sport are seen to ruin the spectacle, then that's a topic that is likely to get discussed. To extend your analogy, if a player is sent off in the first minute of a football match for raising his arms - which by the letter of the law is a red card - but without any malicious intent, then it's likely pundits/fans might argue that a more nuisanced interpretation of the rule should be applied.

Likewise, if the rule were so draconian that this kind of infraction meant that, not only did the offending player get sent off but the goalkeeper could only use one hand for the rest of the race - in order to strongly disincentivise the use of dangerous play - I think it's likely people would say "well maybe we have to change that rule", because that team can no longer compete, so it completely destroys the sporting aspect.

[Edax]

What is this squabble about "boring races" or the '"rules"....

Not all races can be classics. Can one enjoy every football game at same level? Can every sports event be at the same level? Please guys...

I think there are two elements at play here.

• People like to complain. Some people are never happy. For me simply accepting things the way they are leads to a much more enjoyable experience.

• People expect everything to be awesome all the time. Awesome is an extreme experience, and by that I mean on a continuum of experience awesome is at the one end. You can't have awesome without the rest of the continuum to contrast it with. If everything was always awesome then awesome would become the new average. I think this is actually what's happening. Life is absolutely incredible yet we walk around in a haze of distractions which we then complain about.

Two other elements.

People have a well established tendency to remember stuff selectively. From any given season 5 or 10 years ago you remember the races that you find interesting, not those which were boring. Therefore it is very easy to make the mistake that the season as a whole was much more interesting than now.

People's opinions are easy to steer. During the 24hrs of le mans there were a lot of messages from Porsche to their drivers to save their tires. Nobody seems to bother there. It used to be the same for F1. Yet F1 fans are now regularly infuriated by these kind of messages, because someone deemed it an insult to pure racing.

I think its the same mechanism that when your wife complains about the buzzing sound of your alarm-clock, you suddenly find yourself laying awake at night, listening to that barely audible sound that the thing has been producing for years.

Anyway I for one found the race enjoyable. But then again I'm easily pleased.

[MercedesAMGSpy]

What is this squabble about "boring races" or the '"rules"....

Not all races can be classics. Can one enjoy every football game at same level? Can every sports event be at the same level? Please guys...

Rules are there for a reason. What would you guys say if Mercedes was using 8 engines whereas Ferrari using 4 to reach the same points in the championship? Wouldn't Ferrari has done a better job? Without the engine change rules, rich teams will abuse it.

I agree that there is too much regulation regarding development in F1. However, this is different than Hamilton passing the pit line! In some circuits that will be dangerous. As a Hamilton fan, I was disappointed with him not the rules. It is F1 101...

The difference is that football fans accept that you have some boring games and don't want to change the rules after every match.

[andartop]

But it is the FIA who change the rules in F1 every year, not the fans. This fact alone, to me, is an indication that there is a problem, otherwise why the need to do that? I have been arguing for years that the best strategy to improve competition would be to keep the rules stable for at least a few years at a time (I would suggest 5), so the law of diminishing returns would hinder the progress of the frontrunners in the fairest way, while the midfield would have a chance to catch up by copying proven concepts. How can they go to extremes such as severely limiting testing (the only 'sport' I can think of where competitors are not allowed to practice..) to reduce costs but at the same time radically change fundamental rules every year is beyond me.

With regards to how interesting races are, it would be nice to have an objective tool to quantify this and measure any changes. I have been using the entirely subjective 'yawn' factor. I have personal data since the late 1990's. It shows that whereas I used to never miss a race or quali session, now I don't mind at all doing other things on my Saturdays, and have literally fallen asleep at increasing rates during races. This would have been unthinkable few years back. I don't know the reason, maybe it's because I'm getting old, coffee doesn't work any more, or playstation games are getting too good thus rendering real races boring. But this year's LeMans race had me hooked in front of the screen for most of the 24 hours.

[djos]

And let's not forget that Ricciardo started from 18th one place behind Kyvat and raced his way into the points. Kyvat was nowhere.

Kvyat had to change its front-wing in the first laps and he also had some damages which couldnt be repaired. All the race was compromised after that because the car was difficult to handle.

Perhaps he should have done a better job of staying out of trouble then?

[djos]

What is this squabble about "boring races" or the '"rules"....

Not all races can be classics. Can one enjoy every football game at same level? Can every sports event be at the same level? Please guys...

I think there are two elements at play here.

• People like to complain. Some people are never happy. For me simply accepting things the way they are leads to a much more enjoyable experience.

• People expect everything to be awesome all the time. Awesome is an extreme experience, and by that I mean on a continuum of experience awesome is at the one end. You can't have awesome without the rest of the continuum to contrast it with. If everything was always awesome then awesome would become the new average. I think this is actually what's happening. Life is absolutely incredible yet we walk around in a haze of distractions which we then complain about.

Two other elements.

People have a well established tendency to remember stuff selectively. From any given season 5 or 10 years ago you remember the races that you find interesting, not those which were boring. Therefore it is very easy to make the mistake that the season as a whole was much more interesting than now.

People's opinions are easy to steer. During the 24hrs of le mans there were a lot of messages from Porsche to their drivers to save their tires. Nobody seems to bother there. It used to be the same for F1. Yet F1 fans are now regularly infuriated by these kind of messages, because someone deemed it an insult to pure racing.

I think its the same mechanism that when your wife complains about the buzzing sound of your alarm-clock, you suddenly find yourself laying awake at night, listening to that barely audible sound that the thing has been producing for years.

Anyway I for one found the race enjoyable. But then again I'm easily pleased.

The difference is that we expect tire saving in an endurance race, not in a sprint race.

Tbh tho I didn't find this race boring, in fact imo it was one of the better races so far this year.

[iHpled]

New angle of the crash between Kimi and Alonso. Alonso really close to Kimi.

[Emmcee]

Ricciardo had that 5 second penalty aswell were the team couldn't do anything to the car so it's like kvyat who had the wing change, you can change a wing in 5 seconds so that IMO makes Daniels drive look better than it was. I know kvyat had damage but it was only a front wing issue, couldn't have done much damage. I agree kvyat is doing well and I knew he would but 2 races of having "better luck" doesn't make him better than ricciardo dowcing a 4x champ who was hailed as good as senna if not better. Anyway Hamilton won in Austria not Rosberg.



Lmao wtf?

[djos]

Lol

[PlatinumZealot]

Diss!! haha

[sgth0mas]

Ricciardo had that 5 second penalty aswell were the team couldn't do anything to the car so it's like kvyat who had the wing change, you can change a wing in 5 seconds so that IMO makes Daniels drive look better than it was. I know kvyat had damage but it was only a front wing issue, couldn't have done much damage. I agree kvyat is doing well and I knew he would but 2 races of having "better luck" doesn't make him better than ricciardo dowcing a 4x champ who was hailed as good as senna if not better. Anyway Hamilton won in Austria not Rosberg.

http://www.thisisf1.com/wp-content/uplo ... elberg.jpg

Lmao wtf?

Wait you think daniels 5s makes his drive better than a collision, front wing replacement and completing 99% of the race with a damaged car? You dont think maybe he also lost more than a few seconds on the first lap? You think a car with damaged bodywork handles as well as an undamaged car?

This is the textbook definition of driver bias. "My drivers $5 is worth more than the other drivers $10 because its his!!!" This willing avoidance of fact is what makes these race discussions so unbearable.

[Emmcee]

Ricciardo had that 5 second penalty aswell were the team couldn't do anything to the car so it's like kvyat who had the wing change, you can change a wing in 5 seconds so that IMO makes Daniels drive look better than it was. I know kvyat had damage but it was only a front wing issue, couldn't have done much damage. I agree kvyat is doing well and I knew he would but 2 races of having "better luck" doesn't make him better than ricciardo dowcing a 4x champ who was hailed as good as senna if not better. Anyway Hamilton won in Austria not Rosberg.

http://www.thisisf1.com/wp-content/uplo ... elberg.jpg

Lmao wtf?

Wait you think daniels 5s makes his drive better than a collision, front wing replacement and completing 99% of the race with a damaged car? You dont think maybe he also lost more than a few seconds on the first lap? You think a car with damaged bodywork handles as well as an undamaged car?

This is the textbook definition of driver bias. "My drivers $5 is worth more than the other drivers $10 because its his!!!" This willing avoidance of fact is what makes these race discussions so unbearable.

Kvyat didnt loose much time on the first lap at all and how do you know the extent of the cars damage? How is my opinion biased? Concidering ricciardos fastest lap was 1:11.689 and Kvyats was 1:12.316 and is what faster than verstappen's fastest lap and faster than Perez,Hulkenberg and grosjean just to name a few. Love the attitude btw, might need to do some research before jumping down people's throats with wild accusations.