2017 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, 28-30 July

For ease of use, there is one thread per grand prix where you can discuss everything during that specific GP weekend. You can find these threads here.
Juzh
430
Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2012 7:45 am

Re: 2017 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, 28-30 July

Post by Juzh » Tue Jul 18, 2017 9:13 pm

I predict utterly ridiculous laptimes. Last year best combined sectors by hamilton were 1:19.2, on a damp track. If new surface that was put down last year has not degraded much and If conditions are optimal I'd say around 1:15.0 for pole.
We'll know more after FP1 already.

TAG
109
User avatar
Joined: Tue Dec 09, 2014 3:18 pm
Location: in a good place

Re: 2017 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, 28-30 July

Post by TAG » Tue Jul 18, 2017 10:07 pm

TAG wrote:
Tue Jul 18, 2017 5:21 pm
Any confirmation from Pirelli yet about tire choices they'll be bringing? I'm sure we're gonna see the US be the en vouge tire of the day unless there's rain. US, SS, SS?
I dug a little.

Image
Countdown to 91: 8 more victories ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Just_a_fan
486
Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2010 7:37 pm

Re: 2017 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, 28-30 July

Post by Just_a_fan » Tue Jul 18, 2017 10:22 pm

ChrisDanger wrote:
Tue Jul 18, 2017 4:55 pm
Interestingly, Hamilton went into this round last year one point behind in the championship after not leading all year, won the race, but then went on to not win the championship.

Could history repeat itself?
Wishful thinking? :wink:
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"

iotar__
5
User avatar
Joined: Fri Sep 28, 2012 11:31 am

Re: 2017 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, 28-30 July

Post by iotar__ » Tue Jul 18, 2017 11:05 pm

Why would a max downforce track with mid-low corners and one small straight be bad for Ferrari :? ? They have no excuses to be slower here.
dren wrote:
Tue Jul 18, 2017 9:01 pm
It looks like the turning point of Mercedes out developing Ferrari has happened. I expect Mercedes to walk the race.
When did this out-developing happen? They were very close in Canada, slower in Q but comparable in the race in Baku, had practically identical pace in Austria and were behind in GB, hard to say how much with Raikkonen a leading car. You might speculate about oil or floor tricks or Merc fixing their problems but cars are still close.

Moose
126
Joined: Fri Oct 03, 2014 6:41 pm

Re: 2017 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, 28-30 July

Post by Moose » Wed Jul 19, 2017 1:51 am

iotar__ wrote:
Tue Jul 18, 2017 11:05 pm
When did this out-developing happen?
At the point where the slope of the red line on this graph goes from 30/race to 24/race, and the slope of the turquoise line goes from 32/race to 36/race.
Image

That is - Spain.

You can also see from that graph that RedBull made a leap ahead of Force India in Spain.

PlatinumZealot
356
User avatar
Joined: Thu Jun 12, 2008 2:45 am

Re: 2017 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, 28-30 July

Post by PlatinumZealot » Wed Jul 19, 2017 3:07 am

Are you an accountant by chance, Moose? :wink: Because only an accountant would use a the championship points to conclude car development!

The Mercedes hasn't any upgrades since Baku confirmed by the drivers. Any differences in speed is down to set up and mapping.
"The true champions are also great men. They are capable of making difficult decisions, of admitting their mistakes and of pushing harder than before when they get up from a fall."

- Ferrari chairman Sergio Marchionne

Sevach
809
Joined: Thu Jun 07, 2012 4:00 pm

Re: 2017 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, 28-30 July

Post by Sevach » Wed Jul 19, 2017 7:25 am

PlatinumZealot wrote:
Wed Jul 19, 2017 3:07 am
Are you an accountant by chance, Moose? :wink: Because only an accountant would use a the championship points to conclude car development!

The Mercedes hasn't any upgrades since Baku confirmed by the drivers. Any differences in speed is down to set up and mapping.
I'm pretty sure they had a new engine spec in Silverstone...

ChrisDanger
44
Joined: Wed Mar 30, 2011 8:59 am

Re: 2017 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, 28-30 July

Post by ChrisDanger » Wed Jul 19, 2017 7:35 am

Just_a_fan wrote:
Tue Jul 18, 2017 10:22 pm
ChrisDanger wrote:
Tue Jul 18, 2017 4:55 pm
Interestingly, Hamilton went into this round last year one point behind in the championship after not leading all year, won the race, but then went on to not win the championship.

Could history repeat itself?
Wishful thinking? :wink:
Ha, no, I'm expecting another Hamilton WDC (although nothing is certain), and I'm not bothered either way. I just noticed the same pattern (of being a single point behind, not having led all year) and thought it was interesting.

Vasconia
39
User avatar
Joined: Thu Aug 30, 2012 9:45 am
Location: Basque Country

Re: 2017 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, 28-30 July

Post by Vasconia » Wed Jul 19, 2017 7:41 am

Sevach wrote:
Wed Jul 19, 2017 7:25 am
PlatinumZealot wrote:
Wed Jul 19, 2017 3:07 am
Are you an accountant by chance, Moose? :wink: Because only an accountant would use a the championship points to conclude car development!

The Mercedes hasn't any upgrades since Baku confirmed by the drivers. Any differences in speed is down to set up and mapping.
I'm pretty sure they had a new engine spec in Silverstone...
Both teams had a new specification but If I am not wrong Ferrari´s specification was not complete.

Ferrari should be strong here and fight for the victory. Before Spain/Canada I would say that this was a Ferrari track but now I don´t know what to expect. Anyway being PU less important they should be strong here. I am curious to see how strong can RB be here.

3 teams for the victory? this would be awesome.

I do hope that Carlos Sainz and Alonso will have a troubless race, finally. Both cars should strong here, maybe the best track of the season for them.

ChrisDanger
44
Joined: Wed Mar 30, 2011 8:59 am

Re: 2017 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, 28-30 July

Post by ChrisDanger » Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:35 am

Finally Pirelli come to the game.

Image

basti313
40
Joined: Sat Feb 22, 2014 1:49 pm

Re: 2017 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, 28-30 July

Post by basti313 » Wed Jul 19, 2017 9:54 am

iotar__ wrote:
Tue Jul 18, 2017 11:05 pm
Why would a max downforce track with mid-low corners and one small straight be bad for Ferrari :? ? They have no excuses to be slower here.
We saw in Silverstone, that Ferrari is far behind in the acceleration out of medium to fast corners. It was the worst in Maggots. Here you have turn 3, 11 and 14 which show a similar speed and these will hurt Ferrari a lot as they are all in front of the straight parts of the track. I do not see how you can overcome this in a car that is more or less similar, maybe a bit ahead in the other corners.
We have seen this in the blown diffuser times: These are on-throttle corners and McLaren was quite strong there even in seasons where the Bulls were flying away in Q on other tracks. How you get out of these fast corners is really a game changer in Hungary.
PlatinumZealot wrote:
Wed Jul 19, 2017 3:07 am
Are you an accountant by chance, Moose? :wink: Because only an accountant would use a the championship points to conclude car development!

The Mercedes hasn't any upgrades since Baku confirmed by the drivers. Any differences in speed is down to set up and mapping.
Well, it looks like this is more than enough. :mrgreen:
ChrisDanger wrote:
Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:35 am
Finally Pirelli come to the game.
Again much too hard...we know that the Soft has nearly double the lifetime than last year. Last year Vet and Rai did competitive 28lap runs, Ric even 37 laps on the Soft. This will be an easy 1-Stop this year.

GPR-A
167
User avatar
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2014 8:00 am

Re: 2017 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, 28-30 July

Post by GPR-A » Wed Jul 19, 2017 10:30 am

basti313 wrote:
Wed Jul 19, 2017 9:54 am
ChrisDanger wrote:
Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:35 am
Finally Pirelli come to the game.
Again much too hard...we know that the Soft has nearly double the lifetime than last year. Last year Vet and Rai did competitive 28lap runs, Ric even 37 laps on the Soft. This will be an easy 1-Stop this year.
People need to be careful in asking for fast degrading tyres. One of the headaches that fast degrading tyres is the inability to follow the cars closely. Neither Australia would be possible and nor Baku (last stint) and Spain.

Durable tyres allow the drivers to push hard and for longer. If the tyres start degrading faster, drivers have to give up fighting and once again, Pirelli would be blamed for the tyres that doesn't allow close racing. Once again, as I always do, I call for mandatory, minimum 2 pit stops, just like mandatory 2 compounds are required in a race.

henry
240
User avatar
Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2004 7:49 pm
Location: England

Re: 2017 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, 28-30 July

Post by henry » Wed Jul 19, 2017 10:42 am

PlatinumZealot wrote:
Wed Jul 19, 2017 3:07 am

The Mercedes hasn't any upgrades since Baku confirmed by the drivers. Any differences in speed is down to set up and mapping.
And that isn't development?
Fortune favours the prepared; she has no favourites and takes no sides.
Truth is confirmed by inspection and delay; falsehood by haste and uncertainty : Tacitus

basti313
40
Joined: Sat Feb 22, 2014 1:49 pm

Re: 2017 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, 28-30 July

Post by basti313 » Wed Jul 19, 2017 11:27 am

GPR-A wrote:
Wed Jul 19, 2017 10:30 am
basti313 wrote:
Wed Jul 19, 2017 9:54 am
ChrisDanger wrote:
Wed Jul 19, 2017 8:35 am
Finally Pirelli come to the game.
Again much too hard...we know that the Soft has nearly double the lifetime than last year. Last year Vet and Rai did competitive 28lap runs, Ric even 37 laps on the Soft. This will be an easy 1-Stop this year.
People need to be careful in asking for fast degrading tyres. One of the headaches that fast degrading tyres is the inability to follow the cars closely. Neither Australia would be possible and nor Baku (last stint) and Spain.

Durable tyres allow the drivers to push hard and for longer. If the tyres start degrading faster, drivers have to give up fighting and once again, Pirelli would be blamed for the tyres that doesn't allow close racing. Once again, as I always do, I call for mandatory, minimum 2 pit stops, just like mandatory 2 compounds are required in a race.
I totally agree. But a mandatory 2 stop on deg less tires would give strategy "action", no overtaking. I think this more or less similar to degrading tires. So yes, one has to choose...overtaking or some strategy action in the pits.

Spoutnik
3
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2015 6:02 pm

Re: 2017 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, 28-30 July

Post by Spoutnik » Wed Jul 19, 2017 1:55 pm

iotar__ wrote:
Tue Jul 18, 2017 11:05 pm
Why would a max downforce track with mid-low corners and one small straight be bad for Ferrari :? ? They have no excuses to be slower here.
dren wrote:
Tue Jul 18, 2017 9:01 pm
It looks like the turning point of Mercedes out developing Ferrari has happened. I expect Mercedes to walk the race.
When did this out-developing happen? They were very close in Canada, slower in Q but comparable in the race in Baku, had practically identical pace in Austria and were behind in GB, hard to say how much with Raikkonen a leading car. You might speculate about oil or floor tricks or Merc fixing their problems but cars are still close.
Since the Spanish GP Mercedes is clearly ahead (bar the Monaco GP). In Baku Ferrari was nowhere near Hamilton pace in race or in qualy and without the trouble on the first corner and the epic race it would have been an easy 1-2 for Mercedes. In Canada they were not close again Hamilton battered them in qualy and Vettel was by quite a small margin in front of Bottas in Q3. In race the RB had a better pace overall (Verstappen 1st stint before the DNF). In Austria couldn't beat Bottas in qualy, and on race pace, the first stint Bottas was clearly faster and that was the opposite on the second stint (but we heard on Canal + that Merc pushed too much the gearbox settings and they change the gearbox of Lewis for this reason, but they thought for Bottas it will be fine but as Toto said "it was on the edge" so maybe they turn down everything on the last stint + that's why Bottas changed of gearbox at Silverstone). About Silverstone I think Ferrari were never close (long run pace and qualy pace), and it was more about damage limitation all the weekend. When someone who start in the 9th place finish between your cars (without the puncture) there is a problem.
"The Nissan hasn't so much ride height...the only way for them to make sparks" © H.Pescarolo LeMans2015