2018 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, 31 Aug - 2 Sep

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roon
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Re: 2018 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, 31 Aug - 2 Sep

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I prefer Merc's other type of fake pit stops, the type they practiced in Germany.

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Last edited by roon on Wed Sep 05, 2018 12:08 am, edited 1 time in total.

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subcritical71
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Re: 2018 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, 31 Aug - 2 Sep

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nevill3 wrote:
Tue Sep 04, 2018 9:08 pm
Clearhooter wrote:
Tue Sep 04, 2018 8:24 pm
I just read stewards for the Italian GP have negated Grosjean & HAAS's points for the 2018. Italian GP.... Might even consider it a double DNS ? Seems a floorboard pan wasn't in compliance. I'm sure the FIA wouldn't use coercion. :shock: But I also read today that HAAS is the only team NOT to have agreed to let, who ever Force India will be, back into the fold on their own terms. Coincidence ? A suspicious mind might even read something into the Magnussen's contact. I don't mean to sound suspicious. :roll:
It was Renault that raised an objection that resulted in Haas's exclusion, probably because they had beaten them in the race and had taken 4th in the wcc standings too. Haas had been warned that their T tray was against the rules as described in a technical directive that was issued to clarify a grey area. All the teams were given until the race at Monza to comply but Haas said they needed more time but were not explicitly given permission to run the "illegal" floor but advised they could be excluded if another team decided to complain to the stewards which did indeed happen. They knew the risks but decided to roll the dice and have lost out.
They couldn’t get the new parts in time. They were in a catch-22 situation... race knowing they may be on the receiving end of a protest or not race and be subjected to the F1 penalties for not fielding a car according to the commercial agreements.

Wynters
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Re: Re:

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Jolle wrote:
Tue Sep 04, 2018 7:06 pm
he came back on track after being off with all four wheel in the path of another driver. An offence where someone like Maldonado had a penalty for.
Jolle wrote:
Tue Sep 04, 2018 8:18 pm
And there is a very clear rule how to get back on track after you went outside the lines. It must be done without obstructing another driver or in an unsafe manner.
What would you have suggested Alonso do at the moment he goes all four wheels off? He's already entering a ninety-degree left hander and he's got quite some speed. As I'm sure your aware from watching his onboard, within half-a-second of sliding off he'd settled the car and applied hard left lock and the brakes.

What other options should he have taken? Go straight ahead and into Magnussen's side? Perhaps, instead of turning left, he should've turned right into oncoming traffic? Instead of braking, should he have accelerated and speared across the track? Or perhaps he should've stamped on the brakes and left his car stationary, blocking the track?

Despite many people calling for it, I'm unsure whether Maclaren have mastered 'Teleport' technology (although it might solve their race pace issues).

My favourite bit is the way that Magnusson, despite allegedly being entirely focusses on a perfectly normal qualifying lap, goes defensive in the run up to it, running onto the marbles on the wrong line specifically to bone Alonso.

I'll put a link below, but I'm sure you've already studied it in detail.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5ospLEtsJo
And some nice onboards in general.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_bCXbKgL_w

Wynters
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Re: Re:

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TwanV wrote:
Tue Sep 04, 2018 11:00 pm
There seem to be two camps in play here, one that isn't too keen on "wonderboy hamfisting his way around the field, needs a lesson his privilege is unfair " and one that sees his style and speed as a blessing /answer to boring old F1.
Yes, everyone who doesn't like drivers ramming into other drivers and then blaming everyone but themselves is merely jealous of their money.

You've nailed it, 100%.

As an aside, I'm not sure 'ram anyone near me' is a 'style' that many people in F1 see as a blessing...even in Red Bull. I mean, sure, on highlight vids explosions of Carbon fibre and tyre smoke will appeal to morons but I suspect that they are not really the answer to 'boring old F1'.

Jolle
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Re: Re:

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Wynters wrote:
Wed Sep 05, 2018 12:41 am
Jolle wrote:
Tue Sep 04, 2018 7:06 pm
he came back on track after being off with all four wheel in the path of another driver. An offence where someone like Maldonado had a penalty for.
Jolle wrote:
Tue Sep 04, 2018 8:18 pm
And there is a very clear rule how to get back on track after you went outside the lines. It must be done without obstructing another driver or in an unsafe manner.
What would you have suggested Alonso do at the moment he goes all four wheels off? He's already entering a ninety-degree left hander and he's got quite some speed. As I'm sure your aware from watching his onboard, within half-a-second of sliding off he'd settled the car and applied hard left lock and the brakes.

What other options should he have taken? Go straight ahead and into Magnussen's side? Perhaps, instead of turning left, he should've turned right into oncoming traffic? Instead of braking, should he have accelerated and speared across the track? Or perhaps he should've stamped on the brakes and left his car stationary, blocking the track?

Despite many people calling for it, I'm unsure whether Maclaren have mastered 'Teleport' technology (although it might solve their race pace issues).

My favourite bit is the way that Magnusson, despite allegedly being entirely focusses on a perfectly normal qualifying lap, goes defensive in the run up to it, running onto the marbles on the wrong line specifically to bone Alonso.

I'll put a link below, but I'm sure you've already studied it in detail.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5ospLEtsJo
And some nice onboards in general.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5_bCXbKgL_w
He lockes up, misses the apex and basically the corner all together and instead of opening up the steering he pushed his can in the path of MAG again. If it was not on purpose it was a move of a rookie. Not a skilled two times WC praised all over for his incredible racing skills. His lap was done when he locked up and he knew it. Look at Bottas in the race, first feeling of a lockup and he lets the car roll onto the slipway. No harm done.

cooken
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Re: 2018 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, 31 Aug - 2 Sep

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Not sure if it was posted in here or not but Merc pit wall video is up. In it James discusses the Vettel unsafe release, and says that due to the pit lane width there is more than enough room for two cars side by side and therefore no penalty.

zibby43
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Re: 2018 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, 31 Aug - 2 Sep

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cooken wrote:
Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:00 am
Not sure if it was posted in here or not but Merc pit wall video is up. In it James discusses the Vettel unsafe release, and says that due to the pit lane width there is more than enough room for two cars side by side and therefore no penalty.

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langedweil
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Re: 2018 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, 31 Aug - 2 Sep

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Never read the term ‘petulant’ as much as in this thread. Sad, cuz to me this forum is about a bunch of well educated people with tons of insight.

Anyway, personally I’m all up for more wheel-banging-road-rage racing instead of a bunch of nursing robots without any hunger for being the hero of the day .. it’s hardcore racing, no hoolahoop-contest.
But hey, it’s just my opinion ..
Sunshine is just a choice ...

GrandAxe
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Re: 2018 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, 31 Aug - 2 Sep

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If "more wheel-banging-road-rage racing" is a "blessing /answer to boring old F1", then we might as well bring back Maldonado.

The sort of awe inspiring finesse the top drivers show while doing hardcore stuff is where real beauty lies. More importantly, there isn't much admiration to be gained for fowl mouthed tirades when kids might be watching. Worse is being an anti-competitor who throws away their own points in a fit of rage to "teach others a lesson".

If its deviation we want, then I'm sure drivers like Kimi, Alonso and Lewis provide enough; Lewis with his fake bad boy attitude, Kimi cooler than ice and Alonso with his stud bull outlook. Thing is, all three drive pretty well, with respect for others and for the sport.
Last edited by GrandAxe on Wed Sep 05, 2018 8:21 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Andres125sx
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Re: Re:

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Jolle wrote:
Tue Sep 04, 2018 7:06 pm
Andres125sx wrote:
Tue Sep 04, 2018 7:00 pm
Jolle wrote:
Tue Sep 04, 2018 6:52 pm


so..... breaking the rules in some kind of payback karma kinda way is allowed? or just if your name is Alonso? or not Max?
What rule did he break man? :roll:

Alonso went a bit long, but since there´re two consecutive corners keeping the outside is completely viable as it´s the inside for next corner, and that´s what he did
he came back on track after being off with all four wheel in the path of another driver. An offence where someone like Maldonado had a penalty for.
You surely must be kidding.... #-o

Wynters
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Re: Re:

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Andres125sx wrote:
Wed Sep 05, 2018 8:09 am
he came back on track after being off with all four wheel in the path of another driver. An offence where someone like Maldonado had a penalty for.
Maldonado was off track and then accelerated into the sidepod of a car that was in front of him.
Jolle wrote:
Wed Sep 05, 2018 1:14 am
He lockes up, misses the apex and basically the corner all together and instead of opening up the steering he pushed his can in the path of MAG again. If it was not on purpose it was a move of a rookie. Not a skilled two times WC praised all over for his incredible racing skills. His lap was done when he locked up and he knew it. Look at Bottas in the race, first feeling of a lockup and he lets the car roll onto the slipway. No harm done.
Misses the apex? Of course he 'misses the apex', Magnusson is on the apex. If Alsonso hadn't 'missed the apex' he'd be literally sitting on a Haas front wing. You can see that Alonso makes the ninety degree turn, with his car still on the track, and then he steers off the track. Why? Because he has Magnusson on the inside and if Alonso stays on the tarmac than Magnusson will steer into him. As they transition between the corners, Magnusson leaves slightly more than two tyres' width between his left front and the edge of the track and there was no guarantee he was going to leave even that sliver given his history of 'defending'.

I'd also note that your initial point was not that Alonso should've driven off the track earlier, but that, once he was off, he shouldn't have come back on.

If you honestly can't see the difference between steering around another car and ramming into another car then I think we'll just have to agree to differ.

foxmulder_ms
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Re: 2018 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, 31 Aug - 2 Sep

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langedweil wrote:
Wed Sep 05, 2018 4:43 am
Never read the term ‘petulant’ as much as in this thread. Sad, cuz to me this forum is about a bunch of well educated people with tons of insight.

Anyway, personally I’m all up for more wheel-banging-road-rage racing instead of a bunch of nursing robots without any hunger for being the hero of the day .. it’s hardcore racing, no hoolahoop-contest.
But hey, it’s just my opinion ..

"wheel-banging-road-rage racing" does not require talent. It just requires one to not care about accidents. I can do it.

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TAG
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Re: 2018 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, 31 Aug - 2 Sep

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langedweil wrote:
Wed Sep 05, 2018 4:43 am
Never read the term ‘petulant’ as much as in this thread. Sad, cuz to me this forum is about a bunch of well educated people with tons of insight.
Let's be very clear, I said obstinate. :)
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dans79
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Re: 2018 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, 31 Aug - 2 Sep

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foxmulder_ms wrote:
Wed Sep 05, 2018 1:50 pm
"wheel-banging-road-rage racing" does not require talent. It just requires one to not care about accidents. I can do it.
It also requires a lot less skill!
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Morteza
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Re: 2018 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, 31 Aug - 2 Sep

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Thought you guys would like to hear what Rosberg thought about the race
"A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool."~William Shakespeare