2019 Australian Grand Prix - Melbourne, March 15-17

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Harvester
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Re: 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Melbourne, March 15-17

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Schuttelberg wrote:
Fri Mar 22, 2019 6:50 pm
I read somewhere that the two Ferrari's had their PU's turned town for fear of overheating? People think this is a disaster but I am thankful that there was this issue because it's unfathomable for me that Honda has the same power as the Ferrari when they were nowhere last year. At least this means that once the issues are sorted, the cars have speed.

It is also incredibly exciting that Honda has progressed as much as they have and if Max and RB are to be believed, there's a lot more to come. Even if Horner is giving us 50% of the straight up dope he can give with unbelievable confidence, the Bulls are looking great.

I think Max and Seb can be as good and as special as Lewis on their good days. The reason Lewis has been the standout performer in his Mercedes days is because he has shone on days the car was tough. If these two can just accept that on certain weekends, the cars find their sweet spots, I think we can have a pretty special three way fight like 2010-12.

I personally never believed the gap to Ferrari and Red Bull just like I never believed the BS in testing that Mercedes was half a second off.
Yes you've read somewhere that PU was turned down. However, that is just speculation and there is zero real evidence of that. Speed traps in this case can not give us clear indication if PU was turned down or not.

Jolle
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Re: 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Melbourne, March 15-17

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Schuttelberg wrote:
Fri Mar 22, 2019 6:50 pm
I read somewhere that the two Ferrari's had their PU's turned town for fear of overheating? People think this is a disaster but I am thankful that there was this issue because it's unfathomable for me that Honda has the same power as the Ferrari when they were nowhere last year. At least this means that once the issues are sorted, the cars have speed.

It is also incredibly exciting that Honda has progressed as much as they have and if Max and RB are to be believed, there's a lot more to come. Even if Horner is giving us 50% of the straight up dope he can give with unbelievable confidence, the Bulls are looking great.

I think Max and Seb can be as good and as special as Lewis on their good days. The reason Lewis has been the standout performer in his Mercedes days is because he has shone on days the car was tough. If these two can just accept that on certain weekends, the cars find their sweet spots, I think we can have a pretty special three way fight like 2010-12.

I personally never believed the gap to Ferrari and Red Bull just like I never believed the BS in testing that Mercedes was half a second off.
That is where Hamilton’s strong point is the last couple of years. He just doesn’t make (big) mistakes and rarely is off pace. Where Vettel and Verstappen have off days or silly costly mistakes he doesn’t. This puts a lot of pressure especially on Vettel and Ferrari. Feels like they need to be faster quite a lot to beat him.

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Schuttelberg
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Re: 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Melbourne, March 15-17

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Jolle wrote:
Fri Mar 22, 2019 10:13 pm
Schuttelberg wrote:
Fri Mar 22, 2019 6:50 pm
I read somewhere that the two Ferrari's had their PU's turned town for fear of overheating? People think this is a disaster but I am thankful that there was this issue because it's unfathomable for me that Honda has the same power as the Ferrari when they were nowhere last year. At least this means that once the issues are sorted, the cars have speed.

It is also incredibly exciting that Honda has progressed as much as they have and if Max and RB are to be believed, there's a lot more to come. Even if Horner is giving us 50% of the straight up dope he can give with unbelievable confidence, the Bulls are looking great.

I think Max and Seb can be as good and as special as Lewis on their good days. The reason Lewis has been the standout performer in his Mercedes days is because he has shone on days the car was tough. If these two can just accept that on certain weekends, the cars find their sweet spots, I think we can have a pretty special three way fight like 2010-12.

I personally never believed the gap to Ferrari and Red Bull just like I never believed the BS in testing that Mercedes was half a second off.
That is where Hamilton’s strong point is the last couple of years. He just doesn’t make (big) mistakes and rarely is off pace. Where Vettel and Verstappen have off days or silly costly mistakes he doesn’t. This puts a lot of pressure especially on Vettel and Ferrari. Feels like they need to be faster quite a lot to beat him.
I think you're kind when you say silly. They both have been quite dumb to be honest on occasions.
"Sebastian there's very, you're a member of a very select few.. Stewart, Lauda, Piquet, Senna, Prost, Schumacher, Fangio.. VETTEL!"

Jolle
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Re: 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Melbourne, March 15-17

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Schuttelberg wrote:
Fri Mar 22, 2019 11:02 pm
Jolle wrote:
Fri Mar 22, 2019 10:13 pm
Schuttelberg wrote:
Fri Mar 22, 2019 6:50 pm
I read somewhere that the two Ferrari's had their PU's turned town for fear of overheating? People think this is a disaster but I am thankful that there was this issue because it's unfathomable for me that Honda has the same power as the Ferrari when they were nowhere last year. At least this means that once the issues are sorted, the cars have speed.

It is also incredibly exciting that Honda has progressed as much as they have and if Max and RB are to be believed, there's a lot more to come. Even if Horner is giving us 50% of the straight up dope he can give with unbelievable confidence, the Bulls are looking great.

I think Max and Seb can be as good and as special as Lewis on their good days. The reason Lewis has been the standout performer in his Mercedes days is because he has shone on days the car was tough. If these two can just accept that on certain weekends, the cars find their sweet spots, I think we can have a pretty special three way fight like 2010-12.

I personally never believed the gap to Ferrari and Red Bull just like I never believed the BS in testing that Mercedes was half a second off.
That is where Hamilton’s strong point is the last couple of years. He just doesn’t make (big) mistakes and rarely is off pace. Where Vettel and Verstappen have off days or silly costly mistakes he doesn’t. This puts a lot of pressure especially on Vettel and Ferrari. Feels like they need to be faster quite a lot to beat him.
I think you're kind when you say silly. They both have been quite dumb to be honest on occasions.
It's relative of course. I think that Hamilton introduced this flawlessness into the sport, what Schumacher did with physical endurance and Senna with focus.
If you look at the amount and kind of mistakes that Vettel makes, they are mistakes that Schumacher, Senna, Prost etc etc used to make.

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langedweil
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Re: 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Melbourne, March 15-17

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I feel it’s not really fair to compare the guys in that way, as the merc has had sublime/perfect performance for over 5yrs. Even Seb had a package that was worse in quite a few races, whereas Ves had a package that only matched up in very few races; if you lag behind, you’re gonna have to bring more than 100% to not become a Pedro de la Rosa kinda racer (ok-ish).
With that I don’t want to takeaway anything from Ham, surgically methodical at times, bit messy every now and then as well.
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Sierra117
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Re: 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Melbourne, March 15-17

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langedweil wrote:
Sat Mar 23, 2019 3:23 am
I feel it’s not really fair to compare the guys in that way, as the merc has had sublime/perfect performance for over 5yrs. Even Seb had a package that was worse in quite a few races, whereas Ves had a package that only matched up in very few races; if you lag behind, you’re gonna have to bring more than 100% to not become a Pedro de la Rosa kinda racer (ok-ish).
With that I don’t want to takeaway anything from Ham, surgically methodical at times, bit messy every now and then as well.
I don't think you can say Merc have had had perfect performance for 5 years. Lots of reliability issues last year, some in 2017 amd Hamilton facing issues when battling Rosberg in 2016.
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Schuttelberg
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Re: 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Melbourne, March 15-17

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Jolle wrote:
Fri Mar 22, 2019 11:47 pm
Schuttelberg wrote:
Fri Mar 22, 2019 11:02 pm
Jolle wrote:
Fri Mar 22, 2019 10:13 pm


That is where Hamilton’s strong point is the last couple of years. He just doesn’t make (big) mistakes and rarely is off pace. Where Vettel and Verstappen have off days or silly costly mistakes he doesn’t. This puts a lot of pressure especially on Vettel and Ferrari. Feels like they need to be faster quite a lot to beat him.
I think you're kind when you say silly. They both have been quite dumb to be honest on occasions.
It's relative of course. I think that Hamilton introduced this flawlessness into the sport, what Schumacher did with physical endurance and Senna with focus.
If you look at the amount and kind of mistakes that Vettel makes, they are mistakes that Schumacher, Senna, Prost etc etc used to make.
I think that's a bit far fetched. Schumacher, Vettel, Senna, Hamilton and Alonso for that matter have all had exceptional and flawless years. I actually feel Hamilton's 2012 is his best yet. He was royally shafted by operational failures at McLaren. Ironically, that's what has made Hamilton so successful.

I think Senna, like Hamilton was just gifted. What I admire about Hamilton is his growth and willingness to grow and keep learning. He can come across as very arrogant sometimes but this quality of his shows how strong his values are and at the core he's a humble bloke. To have achieved what he has and still strive to improve shows his relentless pursuit of excellence.

It's pretty fashionable over here to diss Vettel and anyone who wants to know the mentality and strength of his mind needs to see Brazil 2012. It is very easy for keyboard warriors to say all sorts of things about him and how he's weak. I always find these things funny. For a 25 year old to achieve what he did on that day, I think it's bigger than any of the championships he's won.

The conclusion is that all these guys have their highs and lows. Vettel last year resembled a lot of Hamilton in 2011. The bloke hasn't forgotten how to drive (his speed in unquestionable) and I have found the same with Lewis. They both get chastised for even the traffic in our cities. The truth probably lies in the most underrated aspect of our sport which is team work. I think Lewis was awfully managed at McLaren and I think the same is happening for Seb at Ferrari.
"Sebastian there's very, you're a member of a very select few.. Stewart, Lauda, Piquet, Senna, Prost, Schumacher, Fangio.. VETTEL!"

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Phil
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Re: 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Melbourne, March 15-17

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Wow what an excellent post. Very nicely said Schuttelberg. Also couldnt agree more regarding Vettel and Brazil/2012.
Not for nothing, Rosberg's Championship is the only thing that lends credibility to Hamilton's recent success. Otherwise, he'd just be the guy who's had the best car. — bhall II
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Juzh
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Re: 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Melbourne, March 15-17

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Jolle wrote:
Fri Mar 22, 2019 10:13 pm
That is where Hamilton’s strong point is the last couple of years. He just doesn’t make (big) mistakes and rarely is off pace. Where Vettel and Verstappen have off days or silly costly mistakes he doesn’t.
I'm not sure which F1 you were watching, but one thing that can not be denied is that hamilton did have off weekends in the last couple of years where he simply wasn't on the pace. I remember russia in 2017 and canada last year off the top of my head, maybe there were some others. He didn't make any costly mistakes though.

On the other side, verstappen and vettel are pretty much never off the pace, but are more error prone.

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Schuttelberg
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Re: 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Melbourne, March 15-17

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Phil wrote:
Sat Mar 23, 2019 7:58 am
Wow what an excellent post. Very nicely said Schuttelberg. Also couldnt agree more regarding Vettel and Brazil/2012.
Thanks Phil. :D
"Sebastian there's very, you're a member of a very select few.. Stewart, Lauda, Piquet, Senna, Prost, Schumacher, Fangio.. VETTEL!"

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Schuttelberg
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Re: 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Melbourne, March 15-17

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Juzh wrote:
Sat Mar 23, 2019 8:36 am
Jolle wrote:
Fri Mar 22, 2019 10:13 pm
That is where Hamilton’s strong point is the last couple of years. He just doesn’t make (big) mistakes and rarely is off pace. Where Vettel and Verstappen have off days or silly costly mistakes he doesn’t.
I'm not sure which F1 you were watching, but one thing that can not be denied is that hamilton did have off weekends in the last couple of years where he simply wasn't on the pace. I remember russia in 2017 and canada last year off the top of my head, maybe there were some others. He didn't make any costly mistakes though.

On the other side, verstappen and vettel are pretty much never off the pace, but are more error prone.
Vettel was nowhere in Australia last year in comparison to Raikkonen and it was luck that handed him the win. Similarly, Verstappen had a god awful beginning to his 2018 campaign until he got his head in place by Monaco.

All drivers have off days. Lewis generally accepts it (because he's grown up) and collects the points on offer. It reduces the margin he loses to his rivals on his bad days and there are not many.
"Sebastian there's very, you're a member of a very select few.. Stewart, Lauda, Piquet, Senna, Prost, Schumacher, Fangio.. VETTEL!"

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Capharol
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Re: 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Melbourne, March 15-17

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Interesting comparison
Speed trap Merc and RB win speed, Ferrari loses
T1 speed, Ferrari loses big, Merc just a bit, RB almost equal to last year
T2 speed All loses but Ferrari and Merc more then RB
Finish line speed, RB the biggest gainer compared to 2018, Ferrari loses speed again, Merc gains a bit

and watch the McLaren and Toro Rosso :wtf:
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Carl Mccoy
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Re: 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Melbourne, March 15-17

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Capharol wrote:
Sat Mar 23, 2019 1:19 pm
Interesting comparison
Speed trap Merc and RB win speed, Ferrari loses
T1 speed, Ferrari loses big, Merc just a bit, RB almost equal to last year
T2 speed All loses but Ferrari and Merc more then RB
Finish line speed, RB the biggest gainer compared to 2018, Ferrari loses speed again, Merc gains a bit

and watch the McLaren and Toro Rosso :wtf:
https://i.imgur.com/5SVttzx.jpg
But Alfa and Hass gain :-) Something wrong with factory cars

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Juzh
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Re: 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Melbourne, March 15-17

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Schuttelberg wrote:
Sat Mar 23, 2019 11:03 am
Juzh wrote:
Sat Mar 23, 2019 8:36 am
Jolle wrote:
Fri Mar 22, 2019 10:13 pm
That is where Hamilton’s strong point is the last couple of years. He just doesn’t make (big) mistakes and rarely is off pace. Where Vettel and Verstappen have off days or silly costly mistakes he doesn’t.
I'm not sure which F1 you were watching, but one thing that can not be denied is that hamilton did have off weekends in the last couple of years where he simply wasn't on the pace. I remember russia in 2017 and canada last year off the top of my head, maybe there were some others. He didn't make any costly mistakes though.

On the other side, verstappen and vettel are pretty much never off the pace, but are more error prone.
Vettel was nowhere in Australia last year in comparison to Raikkonen and it was luck that handed him the win. Similarly, Verstappen had a god awful beginning to his 2018 campaign until he got his head in place by Monaco.

All drivers have off days. Lewis generally accepts it (because he's grown up) and collects the points on offer. It reduces the margin he loses to his rivals on his bad days and there are not many.
"nowhere" as in still able to win the race. Raikkonen wasn't really that much faster, and if there were no SC him and vettel would probably be a few seconds apart at the end of the race.

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GPR-A
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Re: 2019 Australian Grand Prix - Melbourne, March 15-17

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Juzh wrote:
Sat Mar 23, 2019 2:12 pm
Schuttelberg wrote:
Sat Mar 23, 2019 11:03 am
Juzh wrote:
Sat Mar 23, 2019 8:36 am

I'm not sure which F1 you were watching, but one thing that can not be denied is that hamilton did have off weekends in the last couple of years where he simply wasn't on the pace. I remember russia in 2017 and canada last year off the top of my head, maybe there were some others. He didn't make any costly mistakes though.

On the other side, verstappen and vettel are pretty much never off the pace, but are more error prone.
Vettel was nowhere in Australia last year in comparison to Raikkonen and it was luck that handed him the win. Similarly, Verstappen had a god awful beginning to his 2018 campaign until he got his head in place by Monaco.

All drivers have off days. Lewis generally accepts it (because he's grown up) and collects the points on offer. It reduces the margin he loses to his rivals on his bad days and there are not many.
"nowhere" as in still able to win the race. Raikkonen wasn't really that much faster, and if there were no SC him and vettel would probably be a few seconds apart at the end of the race.
Aren't we all are experienced now to understand that, race is not the place to measure the relative speed of either cars or drivers? There are so many variables that make a car either faster or slower. We all know this.
The only guy who never has had off weekends or off the pace on any weekend, was Alonso. The closest that comes is Hamilton. The off weekends that we talk about in Hamilton's case, IMO, is where he doesn't try to overreact to a situation where the car and him are not in exact sync, whereby reduce the chances of making costly mistakes. The other drivers either overdrive in a difficult situation, leading to major mistakes OR simply, mentally not always in control of the situations.