2019 Canadian Grand Prix - Montreal June 7-9

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Bill_Kar
Bill_Kar
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Re: 2019 Canadian Grand Prix, Montreal June 7-9

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I just heard Leclerc's radio and he asked his engineer if Vettel kept his position, he was told that he didn't and he replied with the f word, clearly frustrated.

Probably it is just me, but considering his main rival is Vettel, I didn't expect him to be that disappointed that he didn't get the win.
Such a team player.

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izzy
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Joined: Sun May 26, 2019 9:28 pm

Re: 2019 Canadian Grand Prix, Montreal June 7-9

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Brake Horse Power wrote:
Sun Jun 09, 2019 10:07 pm
I don't like the penalty. If you talk about pure safety.. If a steward thinks this was unsafe you can also blame Hamilton as he was in full control of his car. He could have braked a second earlier bit he didn't. And it makes sense he didn't because he is a racing driver. But he could have avoided himself being in this 'dangerous' situation.
The stewards said
The stewards reviewed video evidence and determined that Car 5, left the track at turn 3, rejoined the track at turn 4 in an unsafe manner and forced car 44 off track. Car 44 had to take evasive action to avoid a collision.
so they don't think Lewis should have had to brake. There's a whole thing about rejoining the track, that makes it different from if they hadn't left the track

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DiogoBrand
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Re: 2019 Canadian Grand Prix, Montreal June 7-9

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here's a simple question:
After making a mistake on his own, did Sebastian Vettel gain an advantage by not leaving his opponent anywhere to go when he was certainly going to lose the position?
If the answer is yes, you can't criticize the penalty. If the answer is no, you're probably from another planet.

"But Hamilton is always favoured by the FIA".
Sebastian was capable of intentionally hitting another driver's car under a safety car and didn't get a black flag for that, to me that's as favoured as a driver can be.
Last edited by turbof1 on Sun Jun 09, 2019 10:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: singling people out

Brake Horse Power
Brake Horse Power
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Re: 2019 Canadian Grand Prix, Montreal June 7-9

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izzy wrote:
Sun Jun 09, 2019 10:24 pm
Brake Horse Power wrote:
Sun Jun 09, 2019 10:07 pm
I don't like the penalty. If you talk about pure safety.. If a steward thinks this was unsafe you can also blame Hamilton as he was in full control of his car. He could have braked a second earlier bit he didn't. And it makes sense he didn't because he is a racing driver. But he could have avoided himself being in this 'dangerous' situation.
The stewards said
The stewards reviewed video evidence and determined that Car 5, left the track at turn 3, rejoined the track at turn 4 in an unsafe manner and forced car 44 off track. Car 44 had to take evasive action to avoid a collision.
so they don't think Lewis should have had to brake. There's a whole thing about rejoining the track, that makes it different from if they hadn't left the track
Rejoining the track is in my opinion a conscious decision, so if it was a decision to take a risk the penalty would be fair. Now there wasn't much to decide for Vettel was there, and making a racing mistake by missing an corner is not really illegal, the so called rejoining was just an outcome of that mistake which he wasn't able to correct to a much safer state than this.

Mamba
Mamba
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Re: 2019 Canadian Grand Prix, Montreal June 7-9

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Everyone here who is pushing one way or the other regarding *that* penalty should go read what is being said in the media... I'd take the views of ex-racers and former world champions among them over our (yes, myself included) views any day...

GrizzleBoy
GrizzleBoy
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Re: 2019 Canadian Grand Prix, Montreal June 7-9

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henry wrote:
Sun Jun 09, 2019 10:12 pm
It seems to me that we can judge this incident on two criteria. We expect drivers too win either because they are faster or because they use superior race craft in defending or overtaking.

In this incident Vettel wasn’t faster through the corner, he was slow enough that Hamilton would have passed him if there was room. In his words he wasn’t in full control when he rejoined the track, so he wasn’t demonstrating skilful race craft. So in my opinion he deserved to lose the place.
Yep it's as simple as that for me.

If we are really wanting to go all in on the morality of this situation then ask yourself this question.

Who deserved the win more?

The guy who showed excellent pace all race and applied pressure to force his rival into an error and create an overtaking opportunity?

Or the guy who did well to stay ahead under pressure, but buckled in the end, made a mistake and rightfully should have lost his place but only retained it by controversially putting his car sideways in front of incoming traffic and forcing another car to have to stamp on the brakes in an Acceleration zone to avoid an incident?


If any one of us are honest with ourselves here, the person who actually deserved this win is not the guy who made a mistake and blocked a competitor from taking a place they should have gained due to that mistake.

If we're honest the person and team who did more to win this race was not Ferrari or Vettel.

Whether Seb deserved a penalty is one thing, but did he do all he or ferrari do all they needed to do to win this race on pure merit?

Absolutely not.

He cracked, lost his place and only regained it by clumsily and dangerously being almost sideways in front of incoming traffic.

Did he do what he needed to do to win?

No.

That's why he didn't win, and that's why he didn't automatically deserve to win.

Carl Mccoy
Carl Mccoy
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Re: 2019 Canadian Grand Prix, Montreal June 7-9

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Ferrari was so slow on hards. During Free practice did they check this type of tires at all?

amritc1
amritc1
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Re: 2019 Canadian Grand Prix, Montreal June 7-9

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TAG wrote:
Juzh wrote:
Sun Jun 09, 2019 9:51 pm
Wynters wrote:
Sun Jun 09, 2019 9:42 pm
I don't think he said "If I had gone..." I believe he said "If he had gone..."
I downloaded and listen to whole vettel's radio just now and this is what he said:
"It's his call if he decides to go that way, if he'd gone the inside he'd have gone past me"

So yeah, just the usual clueless people talking BS when they don't check the facts beforehand.
It's a tough loss but take solace man, at least Vettel won Driver of the Race honors.
Driver of the day cutting across. Simple as that.


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Just_a_fan
Just_a_fan
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Re: 2019 Canadian Grand Prix, Montreal June 7-9

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It appears a Ferrari / Vettel fan has been editing Wikipedia:
Emanuele Pirro (born 12 January 1962, in Rome, Italy) Known as the 'destroyer of Formula 1' after his dreadful leading of the Steward's decision whilst penalising Sebastian Vettel at the 2019 Canadian F1 Grand Prix, costing him of victory and the fans a lot of love for the sport.
All racing results of Emanuele have since been revoked, and all future opinions and decisions are invalid.
:lol: :lol:
Being serious, however, he has 5 Le Mans outright wins and 6 Le Mans class wins to his credit. He is certainly a driver with knowledge and understanding, contrary to what some would have us believe.
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"

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TAG
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Location: in a good place

Re: 2019 Canadian Grand Prix, Montreal June 7-9

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GrizzleBoy wrote:
Sun Jun 09, 2019 10:34 pm

Yep it's as simple as that for me.

If we are really wanting to go all in on the morality of this situation then ask yourself this question.

Who deserved the win more?

The guy who showed excellent pace all race and applied pressure to force his rival into an error and create an overtaking opportunity?

Or the guy who did well to stay ahead under pressure, but buckled in the end, made a mistake and rightfully should have lost his place but only retained it by controversially putting his car sideways in front of incoming traffic and forcing another car to have to stamp on the brakes in an Acceleration zone to avoid an incident?


If any one of us are honest with ourselves here, the person who actually deserved this win is not the guy who made a mistake and blocked a competitor from taking a place they should have gained due to that mistake.

If we're honest the person and team who did more to win this race was not Ferrari or Vettel.

Whether Seb deserved a penalty is one thing, but did he do all he or ferrari do all they needed to do to win this race on pure merit?

Absolutely not.

He cracked, lost his place and only regained it by clumsily and dangerously being almost sideways in front of incoming traffic.

Did he do what he needed to do to win?

No.

That's why he didn't win, and that's why he didn't automatically deserve to win.
This is a beautiful post. I certainly am not a decent enough human being to have so eloquently and free of malice, pushing people's button's and rubbing it in their face. The moderators should give you some kind of award here. Seriously, it's a beautiful post that will make me strive to be more like this in the future.
माकडाच्या हाती कोलीत

Just_a_fan
Just_a_fan
642
Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2010 7:37 pm

Re: 2019 Canadian Grand Prix, Montreal June 7-9

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Mamba wrote:
Sun Jun 09, 2019 10:33 pm
Everyone here who is pushing one way or the other regarding *that* penalty should go read what is being said in the media... I'd take the views of ex-racers and former world champions among them over our (yes, myself included) views any day...
Pirro is an ex-racer who had more success than many of the ex-racer pundits. You don't win Le Mans several times by being a rubbish driver, that's for sure.
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"

3jawchuck
3jawchuck
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Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2015 7:57 am

Re: 2019 Canadian Grand Prix, Montreal June 7-9

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There's been a series of vandalistic edits on that page. All being reverted as they are spotted.

The worst thing about sports is often the fans to be honest. A crappy decision just beings out the worst even more so.

Jolle
Jolle
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Joined: Wed Jan 29, 2014 9:58 pm
Location: Dordrecht

Re: 2019 Canadian Grand Prix, Montreal June 7-9

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Brake Horse Power wrote:
Sun Jun 09, 2019 10:33 pm
izzy wrote:
Sun Jun 09, 2019 10:24 pm
Brake Horse Power wrote:
Sun Jun 09, 2019 10:07 pm
I don't like the penalty. If you talk about pure safety.. If a steward thinks this was unsafe you can also blame Hamilton as he was in full control of his car. He could have braked a second earlier bit he didn't. And it makes sense he didn't because he is a racing driver. But he could have avoided himself being in this 'dangerous' situation.
The stewards said
The stewards reviewed video evidence and determined that Car 5, left the track at turn 3, rejoined the track at turn 4 in an unsafe manner and forced car 44 off track. Car 44 had to take evasive action to avoid a collision.
so they don't think Lewis should have had to brake. There's a whole thing about rejoining the track, that makes it different from if they hadn't left the track
Rejoining the track is in my opinion a conscious decision, so if it was a decision to take a risk the penalty would be fair. Now there wasn't much to decide for Vettel was there, and making a racing mistake by missing an corner is not really illegal, the so called rejoining was just an outcome of that mistake which he wasn't able to correct to a much safer state than this.
I looked to the onboard with teamradio,

what happened: Vettel goes off, goes off the trottle, comes back on the track regains enough control to put his foot down again when there is more then a car's wide to the wall and then squeezes, while he's giving it full power, towards the wall with Hamilton already besides him.

clear penalty.

amritc1
amritc1
0
Joined: Wed Feb 20, 2019 5:17 am

2019 Canadian Grand Prix, Montreal June 7-9

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I’m gonna drive through the grand stand next time I’m racing. And will move my board from last to first. Because I can’t take the pressure.


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Brake Horse Power
Brake Horse Power
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Re: 2019 Canadian Grand Prix, Montreal June 7-9

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@TAG and Grizzle

:roll: Yes because the one who deserves most always needs to win :roll:

I think it is quite a 'coloured' post, and I wonder which alternative is suggested for Vettel to have done in that situation? Park his car in the grass, put on his blinker and rejoin when there is a 10 second gap?

Anyway, I was amazed again by the pitstops. I would have expected Hamilton to try an undercut, which he didn't. Letting Vettel pit first was a class decision by Ferrari. But than they messed up I think.
At some point I think Leclerc could have pitted and possibly get in front of Hamilton, but they kept him out and he lost way too much time. I think their reason was they hoped for a safety car which didn't come.