2019 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, August 2-4

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SiLo
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Re: 2019 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, August 2-4

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I think the team have been doing that. It seems Bottas and Hamilton are extracting very similar amounts from the car, which leads me to believe they are looking more towards the race these days. I think they know their value in being so much faster on race day is worth more than 1-2 positions on the grid at the start of the race.
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digitalrurouni
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Re: 2019 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, August 2-4

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Been wondering about qualifying. Yeah Hamilton is a 1 lap monster but he's recently been starting on the second row and still winning races. Has to be setup but probably Mercedes has been chipping away at their car's vulnerability of bring follow another car during the race. Seemed like other than brake and PU temperature management the Mercedes was able to be right on the gearbox of the Red Bull. Is that a sign of things to come or is it just an anomaly for this race?

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GPR-A
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Re: 2019 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, August 2-4

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Answer to that question, in my hunch, lies in their reliability issues of Spec 2. Due which, they probably aren't running their ultimate Q3 mode, which has brought them closer to the chasing pack, but because their race modes are still more powerful and no one else runs their Q3 modes in races, they are way more quicker in races. Of course their chassis stands apart.

drunkf1fan
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Re: 2019 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, August 2-4

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djones wrote:
Fri Aug 09, 2019 12:56 pm
Has it been said in any interviews that Hamilton is setting his car up for the races this season?

It seems strange that his qualifying has been poor, yet race pace generally second to none. This particular race being a perfect example of that.
Hamilton has absolutely always set up for race pace. His team mates often set up for qualifying. Look at Schumacher vs Rosberg, Rosberg won pretty convincingly in qualifying but races Schumacher usually made up more places. Against Ham same deal. In 2014 Rosberg setup for qualifying, beat Hamilton but got crushed in races. In 2015 Rosberg having lost the title despite the mechanical issues for Ham in Australia, errm, Germany and Hungary in quali was it, and particularly his loss in hungary (twice unable to pass with WAY fresher tires and burning out that previous set) he setup more for race pace. Ham beat him 12-2 in qualifying up to that end of the season run when everyone including people in a coma could see the season was over. Ham still bashed him in races because he's simply the faster driver.

Rosberg in 2016 went back to setting up for qualifying because the only way he's going to beat Ham is being first to T1 at any track with difficult passing such that Hamilton can't get past despite being faster, and mechanical issues. Basically Rosberg needed to be in the fight with the potential to qualify and win some races from pole to take advantage of bad luck and that worked out for him.

Bottas is a qualifier, full stop, horrible tire wear this far into his career, ouch. Even Toto stated he has a problem with tire wear, it's presumably his style and it isn't changing (he's had plenty of time and more than enough video/data/watching of Hamilton to simply attempt to copy him). Bottas was always faster in qualifying and less fast in races.

2017, Ham vs Bottas was 13 v 7, but Bottas beat Ham in Bahrain, Russia, Monaco, Austria, Hungary and Abu Dhabi.
2018 15 vs 6, Bottas beat Ham in Bahrain, China, Canada, Austria, Germany (meh, technical issues), Russia. He didn't run in Q3 in Spa so kind of a wash there really.
2019 6 vs 5, Bottas beating him in China, Baku, Spain, Austria and Silverstone.

It's close but in reality in 2018 it was 9 vs 1 in the final 10 races and in 2017 it was 7 vs 2 from Spa onwards. Every season will be relatively close with small gaps that can swing the other way next year or on a bad lap. But realistically Bottas is just way closer in qualifying on a lot of the tracks that come earlier in the year and Hamilton has more better tracks for him in the second half of the year.

Ham sets up purely for races, Bottas is much more about qualifying, Hamilton will very very likely dominate in qualifying in the second half of the season.

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Sierra117
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Re: 2019 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, August 2-4

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Also Hamilton has mentioned a few times post quali how he has better race pace. He said that after austria q3 too.
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ringo
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Re: 2019 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, August 2-4

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I think he realized the value of race pace going up against Jenson Button.
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LM10
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Re: 2019 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, August 2-4

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drunkf1fan wrote:
Fri Aug 09, 2019 2:23 pm
djones wrote:
Fri Aug 09, 2019 12:56 pm
Has it been said in any interviews that Hamilton is setting his car up for the races this season?

It seems strange that his qualifying has been poor, yet race pace generally second to none. This particular race being a perfect example of that.
Hamilton has absolutely always set up for race pace. His team mates often set up for qualifying. Look at Schumacher vs Rosberg, Rosberg won pretty convincingly in qualifying but races Schumacher usually made up more places. Against Ham same deal. In 2014 Rosberg setup for qualifying, beat Hamilton but got crushed in races. In 2015 Rosberg having lost the title despite the mechanical issues for Ham in Australia, errm, Germany and Hungary in quali was it, and particularly his loss in hungary (twice unable to pass with WAY fresher tires and burning out that previous set) he setup more for race pace. Ham beat him 12-2 in qualifying up to that end of the season run when everyone including people in a coma could see the season was over. Ham still bashed him in races because he's simply the faster driver.

Rosberg in 2016 went back to setting up for qualifying because the only way he's going to beat Ham is being first to T1 at any track with difficult passing such that Hamilton can't get past despite being faster, and mechanical issues. Basically Rosberg needed to be in the fight with the potential to qualify and win some races from pole to take advantage of bad luck and that worked out for him.

Bottas is a qualifier, full stop, horrible tire wear this far into his career, ouch. Even Toto stated he has a problem with tire wear, it's presumably his style and it isn't changing (he's had plenty of time and more than enough video/data/watching of Hamilton to simply attempt to copy him). Bottas was always faster in qualifying and less fast in races.

2017, Ham vs Bottas was 13 v 7, but Bottas beat Ham in Bahrain, Russia, Monaco, Austria, Hungary and Abu Dhabi.
2018 15 vs 6, Bottas beat Ham in Bahrain, China, Canada, Austria, Germany (meh, technical issues), Russia. He didn't run in Q3 in Spa so kind of a wash there really.
2019 6 vs 5, Bottas beating him in China, Baku, Spain, Austria and Silverstone.

It's close but in reality in 2018 it was 9 vs 1 in the final 10 races and in 2017 it was 7 vs 2 from Spa onwards. Every season will be relatively close with small gaps that can swing the other way next year or on a bad lap. But realistically Bottas is just way closer in qualifying on a lot of the tracks that come earlier in the year and Hamilton has more better tracks for him in the second half of the year.

Ham sets up purely for races, Bottas is much more about qualifying, Hamilton will very very likely dominate in qualifying in the second half of the season.
You’re talking like you have first hand info. Don’t understand how you can imply such things just by looking at who was/is faster in qualifying. I think there are much more factors to take into account other than “driver x wins qualifying over driver y so driver x must set up for qualifying”.

dans79
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Re: 2019 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, August 2-4

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LM10 wrote:
Sat Aug 10, 2019 5:58 pm
You’re talking like you have first hand info. Don’t understand how you can imply such things just by looking at who was/is faster in qualifying. I think there are much more factors to take into account other than “driver x wins qualifying over driver y so driver x must set up for qualifying”.
you don't need first-hand knowledge. all you need to do is listen to the drivers the team principals and other members of the pit lane. Then take into account various trends that show up. When you have two and a half years worth of races to draw info from, it gets pretty easy to see.
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Pyrone89
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Re: 2019 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, August 2-4

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Ahh, he lost in quali so it must be a set-up or car thing? Perhaps other drivers just did a better job?
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TAG
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Re: 2019 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, August 2-4

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Pyrone89 wrote:
Sat Aug 10, 2019 11:15 pm
Ahh, he lost in quali so it must be a set-up or car thing? Perhaps other drivers just did a better job?
Post qualifying in Silverstone Hamilton said he didn't want to move the set up because it worked so well on Friday race pace. It's not a secret, and in this case it worked. Bottas has always been a strong qualifier, certainly no shame in losing out on pole here or there to him.
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Hammerfist
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Re: 2019 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, August 2-4

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digitalrurouni wrote:
Fri Aug 09, 2019 1:28 pm
Been wondering about qualifying. Yeah Hamilton is a 1 lap monster but he's recently been starting on the second row and still winning races. Has to be setup but probably Mercedes has been chipping away at their car's vulnerability of bring follow another car during the race. Seemed like other than brake and PU temperature management the Mercedes was able to be right on the gearbox of the Red Bull. Is that a sign of things to come or is it just an anomaly for this race?

He couldn't stay on Max's gearbox for too long though. In the first stint hamilton could only stay 2 seconds behind before they decided to close in and force Verstappen to pit and avoid getting undercut. And Bottas could not stay close enough to Raikonnen and never passed him. The Merc is still not a good car to be following others in.

mclaren113
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Re: 2019 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, August 2-4

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Anybody knows engine situation by driver after the Hungarian GP?

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TAG
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Re: 2019 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, August 2-4

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mclaren113 wrote:
Sun Aug 11, 2019 4:01 pm
Anybody knows engine situation by driver after the Hungarian GP?
https://maxf1.net/en/2019-f1-power-unit-elements-usage/
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mclaren113
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Re: 2019 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, August 2-4

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TAG wrote:
Sun Aug 11, 2019 4:21 pm
mclaren113 wrote:
Sun Aug 11, 2019 4:01 pm
Anybody knows engine situation by driver after the Hungarian GP?
https://maxf1.net/en/2019-f1-power-unit-elements-usage/
Thank you

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Wouter
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Re: 2019 Hungarian Grand Prix - Hungaroring, August 2-4

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mclaren113 wrote:
Sun Aug 11, 2019 5:15 pm
TAG wrote:
Sun Aug 11, 2019 4:21 pm
mclaren113 wrote:
Sun Aug 11, 2019 4:01 pm
Anybody knows engine situation by driver after the Hungarian GP?
https://maxf1.net/en/2019-f1-power-unit-elements-usage/
Thank you
This is not after but prior de Hungarian GP.

2019 F1 Power Unit elements usage – Hungarian GP

Status: Prior 2019 Hungarian GP
Ricciardo, Norris and Bottas got new PU elements.

https://www.fia.com/events/fia-formula- ... ormation11