2020 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, 3-5 July

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e30ernest
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Re: 2020 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, 3-5 July

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McMika98 wrote:
Fri Jul 10, 2020 9:48 am
Fact is lewis missed the inside kerb dunno if it is by design but he then choose to get on the power before he gained control of his car. If he had continued to roll the car even with the same lock they would not touch. He is already taking too much speed and missing the apex and yet on the throttle earlier than he should be knowing full well there was a car to his right who was ahead then.
Its impossible for a driver to lose control of a car in any corner when off throttle unless it is raining.
I was under the impression that he "missed" that apex because he was told by the team that it was critical to avoid the kerbs. In fact, on the footage is wheel was just touching the white line which indicates to me he was making the most out of the track given the limitations of his car at that specific time.

It was all in the exit IMO.

Just_a_fan
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Re: 2020 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, 3-5 July

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McMika98 wrote:
Fri Jul 10, 2020 9:48 am

Its impossible for a driver to lose control of a car in any corner when off throttle unless it is raining.
That's simply wrong, but hey if it helps your hatred of Hamilton, you keep believing it. =D>
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"

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Big Tea
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Re: 2020 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, 3-5 July

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Interview with Horner on Sky, he has just nixed Seb's return to RbR
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Wynters
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Re: 2020 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, 3-5 July

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basti313 wrote:
Fri Jul 10, 2020 8:55 am
And it was "one for the team", without kicking Albon he would have won. Hamilton is a team player.
Hamilton was willing to risk his front suspension and a DNF in order to make sure Bottas got maximum points...

:wtf:
Last edited by Wynters on Fri Jul 10, 2020 10:46 am, edited 1 time in total.

Wynters
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Re: 2020 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, 3-5 July

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McMika98 wrote:
Fri Jul 10, 2020 9:48 am
Its impossible for a driver to lose control of a car in any corner when off throttle unless it is raining.
So Vettel was actually accelerating before the apex when he span into Sainz...

:wtf:

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NathanOlder
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Re: 2020 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, 3-5 July

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Just_a_fan wrote:
Fri Jul 10, 2020 10:05 am
McMika98 wrote:
Fri Jul 10, 2020 9:48 am

Its impossible for a driver to lose control of a car in any corner when off throttle unless it is raining.
That's simply wrong, but hey if it helps your hatred of Hamilton, you keep believing it. =D>
I need to be quicker, you beat me to it again :lol:
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NathanOlder
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Re: 2020 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, 3-5 July

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Wynters wrote:
Fri Jul 10, 2020 10:45 am
McMika98 wrote:
Fri Jul 10, 2020 9:48 am
Its impossible for a driver to lose control of a car in any corner when off throttle unless it is raining.
So Vettel was actually accelerating before the apex when he span into Sainz...

:wtf:
:lol:
GoLandoGo
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New found love for GT racing with Assetto Corsa Competizione on PS4.

McMika98
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Re: 2020 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, 3-5 July

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Wynters wrote:
Fri Jul 10, 2020 10:45 am
McMika98 wrote:
Fri Jul 10, 2020 9:48 am
Its impossible for a driver to lose control of a car in any corner when off throttle unless it is raining.
So Vettel was actually accelerating before the apex when he span into Sainz...

:wtf:
What are you saying? He never lost the car, he just drove into him. He placed the car where he wanted to but it was an error.

basti313
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Re: 2020 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, 3-5 July

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NathanOlder wrote:
Fri Jul 10, 2020 9:20 am
basti313 wrote:
Fri Jul 10, 2020 8:55 am

Seems like you do not know this track or do not know how racing works at all.
The corner is a masterpiece of a corner. It has a changing radius and is hanging to the outside, before it changes to inside. The fastest way here is to break to the apex, apply slight throttle to trigger understeer to the outside apex where full throttle is applied. Throttle is really only slight, every bit of pushing it causes understeer.
A perfect example for this is the pole lap of Bottas this year. You can nicely see how he applies throttle to get the car into understeering, opens the steering to get the car out of understeering before the apex and then corrects the oversteer when he pushes the throttle fully.
Same in the fight Ham vs. Alb. The slight rattle noise from the exhaust once Ham is at the apex is simply slight throttle for understeer.
As said before...it is somewhere between impolite to disrespectful to say a Formula1 driver is not capable of driving this corner in different lines. For myself it is too difficult, I am anywhere in this corner...but not a F1 driver and certainly not Hamilton.
Understeer is just a consequence of picking up the throttle, you have to pick the throttle up before the car is straight as the coner is opening up but continues for a long distance. I wouldn't say they are applying throuttle to trigger understeer. They are simply applying throttle as early as possible for a faster exit, Understeer on the exit is not something that is desired. You are saying the drivers are wanting the car to understeer on the exit ??
Yes, absolutely. It is interesting to get out of turn 4 due to its shape. Of course the sliding with the control of understeer and oversteer is a normal thing for a F1 driver, but for me this corner is impossible.
As you say, you need to get on the throttle early. But in turn 4 you inevitably start sliding on the front wheels as they simply have no load. Usually understeer on the exit would be slow, but here it is different. The radius changes strongly, so you have turned the car nearly completely on the exit. All you need is to get as much throttle applied as possible without overdoing the understeer and ending like Bot in his second Q3 run or maybe better example like Gro in the race.

The core point is, that throttle is slightly applied at the apex, otherwise you do not get out of this turn well. The understeer we see is intended and controlled.
Wynters wrote:
Fri Jul 10, 2020 10:43 am
basti313 wrote:
Fri Jul 10, 2020 8:55 am
And it was "one for the team", without kicking Albon he would have won. Hamilton is a team player.
Hamilton was willing to risk his front suspension and a DNF in order to make sure Bottas got maximum points...

:wtf:
No, this is not what I am saying. Read again.
Hamilton intended to run Albon wide as usual. This was his intention. But in the end he took one for the team. Nothing wrong with that, although it was certainly not his intention, but a calculated risk in his hard racing.

basti313
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Re: 2020 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, 3-5 July

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McMika98 wrote:
Fri Jul 10, 2020 11:49 am
Wynters wrote:
Fri Jul 10, 2020 10:45 am
McMika98 wrote:
Fri Jul 10, 2020 9:48 am
Its impossible for a driver to lose control of a car in any corner when off throttle unless it is raining.
So Vettel was actually accelerating before the apex when he span into Sainz...

:wtf:
What are you saying? He never lost the car, he just drove into him. He placed the car where he wanted to but it was an error.
??? He was much too late on the brake, the car was not at all where he wanted it to be. Something was not ok, like tire or brake temp, but this was a simple error. The problem was, that other cars were around...otherwise he would have simply gone wide on the exit like many others in this corner.

Wynters
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Re: 2020 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, 3-5 July

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McMika98 wrote:
Fri Jul 10, 2020 11:49 am
Wynters wrote:
Fri Jul 10, 2020 10:45 am
McMika98 wrote:
Fri Jul 10, 2020 9:48 am
Its impossible for a driver to lose control of a car in any corner when off throttle unless it is raining.
So Vettel was actually accelerating before the apex when he span into Sainz...

:wtf:
What are you saying? He never lost the car, he just drove into him. He placed the car where he wanted to but it was an error.
You can see Vettel applying opposite lock before he even reaches Sainz.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cF9tj6DSlJg
Just as the timer hits 0:51.

McMika98
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Re: 2020 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, 3-5 July

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To clarify by losing the car I mean to go on a spin without external force and by own volition. Hamilton lost his car at the corner, Vettel just misjudged the attack which was never there just like Hamilton did in Brazil. These old timers are losing it, last year they racketeering highest penalty points.

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Phil
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Re: 2020 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, 3-5 July

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Apparently, Mercedes have shown evidence (according to ORF) that Lewis was almost at full lock and that he did not accelerate at the incident that led to the contact with Albon.
Not for nothing, Rosberg's Championship is the only thing that lends credibility to Hamilton's recent success. Otherwise, he'd just be the guy who's had the best car. — bhall II
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sosic2121
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Re: 2020 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, 3-5 July

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Phil wrote:
Fri Jul 10, 2020 1:17 pm
Apparently, Mercedes have shown evidence (according to ORF) that Lewis was almost at full lock and that he did not accelerate at the incident that led to the contact with Albon.
Does not matter. Nico Rosberg was on full lock(the real full lock) and still received a penalty.

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Phil
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Re: 2020 Austrian Grand Prix - Spielberg, 3-5 July

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I didnt mean to spark the discussion again and i dont think Mercedes supplied the data other than to educate those that felt there was some intent to push Albon wide.
Not for nothing, Rosberg's Championship is the only thing that lends credibility to Hamilton's recent success. Otherwise, he'd just be the guy who's had the best car. — bhall II
#Team44 supporter