2021 Emilia Romagna Grand Prix - Imola, Apr 16 - 18

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darkpino
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Re: 2021 Emilia Romagna Grand Prix - Imola, Apr 16 - 18

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Haha, a whole message and you respond to 1 line. Well played sir. Should have known not to get in an argument with you or to try to see it from your POV

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Sieper
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Re: 2021 Emilia Romagna Grand Prix - Imola, Apr 16 - 18

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Indeed. Come on 😀
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dans79
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Re: 2021 Emilia Romagna Grand Prix - Imola, Apr 16 - 18

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Sieper wrote:
Thu Apr 22, 2021 10:03 pm
Indeed. Come on 😀
I wasn't arguing, I was correcting incorrect information!
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NathanOlder
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Re: 2021 Emilia Romagna Grand Prix - Imola, Apr 16 - 18

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Phil wrote:
Thu Apr 22, 2021 9:30 pm
Wouter wrote:
Thu Apr 22, 2021 9:01 pm

During qualifying, Max found he couldn't drive over some curbs like he used to. He had to get over it more carefully. Some low curbs were not a problem, but other curbs were a problem. His team then advised him to avoid the curbs that bothered him in the car. He did. Immediately after qualifying they did an extensive search to find out why and luckily for him, they found the problem and were allowed to solve it before the race. That's all I've heard.


Hum yeah...
Completely agree with Phil here. That qualy lap is maximum attack full use of the curbs.

As for the whole qualy conversation, there is always a big thing made of team mate head to heads, as MKlaus was claiming how bad Perez is, I just pointed out he is 1.1 in qualy (and had his race severely comprised by the car in both races so far) against one of the fastest guys on the grid. You don't ever see drivers from other teams being compared like this. If you did then last season Lewis would have beaten Max something like 14.2 but that means nothing. Head to Head in the same team is what matters and like I say, Perez is 1.1 with Max.
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LHamilton
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Re: 2021 Emilia Romagna Grand Prix - Imola, Apr 16 - 18

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Looks like Perez did use more kerb than Verstappen during their respective Q3 run. So there might be something to it.

Verstappens mistake in the second corner lost him quite a bit I must say.


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PlatinumZealot
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Re: 2021 Emilia Romagna Grand Prix - Imola, Apr 16 - 18

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Wouter wrote:
Thu Apr 22, 2021 9:01 pm


During qualifying, Max found he couldn't drive over some curbs like he used to. He had to get over it more carefully. Some low curbs were not a problem, but other curbs were a problem. His team then advised him to avoid the curbs that bothered him in the car. He did. Immediately after qualifying they did an extensive search to find out why and luckily for him, they found the problem and were allowed to solve it before the race. That's all I've heard.
I think this applies for all the cars based on what I saw in free practice. Curbs were damaging floors. Same thing happened last year too.
Cant remember which session this year, but one of the Mercedes was lucky not to break the tea tray the way it deflctedafter striking a curb.

Max probably was scraping the tea tray or somethinv.
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PlatinumZealot
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Re: 2021 Emilia Romagna Grand Prix - Imola, Apr 16 - 18

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Sieper wrote:
Thu Apr 22, 2021 9:39 pm
dans79 wrote:
Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:13 pm
Wouter wrote:
Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:05 pm
Lewis has 44 points and Max has 43 points now.

What is the point of scoring points in your opinion, if you cannot compare them, because after all they are not in the same car?
go back and read the conversation again, we aren't talking about the race. We are talking about comparing drivers in qualifying.

NathanOlder made a comment about qualifying between Sergio & Max.
Sieper made a comment about comparing Max & Lewis.
I responded to Sieper........
He actually didn’t speak about Max. He was talking about “that guy” (even Lewis himself stopped referring to Max as “that guy” after two seasons or so) that was “supposed to be fast”.

I think “that guy” is plenty fast.

If we want to actually discuss qualy, fine. Last race Checo got stuck in Q2 even with 2 tries and Max was through in 1 try on a track that was quickly building up speed. This time around Max obviously made a quite big error, but still it was only a few hundreds of a second between them. There were some mitigating factors (missed FP2, switched to yellow for Q2 (Perez was red red red in each Q session) and he had a wheelbearing issue, none of which “guy” was hiding behind, just owned up to the mistake and went on with racing. Fast. Not supposedly fast.
Checo said he made an error too.
That's qualifying. The fastest guy usually makes the least errors.
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PlatinumZealot
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Re: 2021 Emilia Romagna Grand Prix - Imola, Apr 16 - 18

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LHamilton wrote:
Fri Apr 23, 2021 3:01 am
Looks like Perez did use more kerb than Verstappen during their respective Q3 run. So there might be something to it.

Verstappens mistake in the second corner lost him quite a bit I must say.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zhEMuDNGy7I
Maybe lost one tenth or so. But Sergio was sloppy on braking in the middle sector.

Max looks way more confident on the brakes and was able to claw back some time after 50seconds into the video

Sergio is also a very late breaker but it will take some time for him to match Max in confidence.

Very close between the two here.

Of the suspension issue, wasnt it Sergio Perez who had the steering wheel pulling to one side on its own? Was that power steering?
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_cerber1
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Re: 2021 Emilia Romagna Grand Prix - Imola, Apr 16 - 18

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Baby Lando =D>

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NathanOlder
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Re: 2021 Emilia Romagna Grand Prix - Imola, Apr 16 - 18

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LHamilton wrote:
Fri Apr 23, 2021 3:01 am
Looks like Perez did use more kerb than Verstappen during their respective Q3 run. So there might be something to it.

Verstappens mistake in the second corner lost him quite a bit I must say.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zhEMuDNGy7I
Perez used more ?

I see they were using the same through
Tamburello, entry and mid, but max goes wider on exit and loses time.
Villeneuve same amount on way through but Sergio uses a tiny bit more of the exit curb.
Tosa they use the same.
Piratella they use the same.
Acque Minerale Max used more on exit (thats a very nasty curb)
Variante Alta Max used more on enty , mid and exit (they are the most brutal curbs on the circuit)
Rivazza both drivers use the same amount

So I see Max using more overall and more on all the nasty curbs. So I don't believe he held off the curbs in qualifying.
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maxxer
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Re: 2021 Emilia Romagna Grand Prix - Imola, Apr 16 - 18

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NathanOlder wrote:
Fri Apr 23, 2021 7:56 am
LHamilton wrote:
Fri Apr 23, 2021 3:01 am
Looks like Perez did use more kerb than Verstappen during their respective Q3 run. So there might be something to it.

Verstappens mistake in the second corner lost him quite a bit I must say.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zhEMuDNGy7I
Perez used more ?

I see they were using the same through
Tamburello, entry and mid, but max goes wider on exit and loses time.
Villeneuve same amount on way through but Sergio uses a tiny bit more of the exit curb.
Tosa they use the same.
Piratella they use the same.
Acque Minerale Max used more on exit (thats a very nasty curb)
Variante Alta Max used more on enty , mid and exit (they are the most brutal curbs on the circuit)
Rivazza both drivers use the same amount

So I see Max using more overall and more on all the nasty curbs. So I don't believe he held off the curbs in qualifying.
Yes i only saw the mistake Max made which cost himm some.
Also i dont think these cars would last long with a broken wheelbearing the bearing would overheat in no time and lockup
Love the sounds of the Honda engines though

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NathanOlder
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Re: 2021 Emilia Romagna Grand Prix - Imola, Apr 16 - 18

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maxxer wrote:
Fri Apr 23, 2021 10:07 am
NathanOlder wrote:
Fri Apr 23, 2021 7:56 am
LHamilton wrote:
Fri Apr 23, 2021 3:01 am
Looks like Perez did use more kerb than Verstappen during their respective Q3 run. So there might be something to it.

Verstappens mistake in the second corner lost him quite a bit I must say.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zhEMuDNGy7I
Perez used more ?

I see they were using the same through
Tamburello, entry and mid, but max goes wider on exit and loses time.
Villeneuve same amount on way through but Sergio uses a tiny bit more of the exit curb.
Tosa they use the same.
Piratella they use the same.
Acque Minerale Max used more on exit (thats a very nasty curb)
Variante Alta Max used more on enty , mid and exit (they are the most brutal curbs on the circuit)
Rivazza both drivers use the same amount

So I see Max using more overall and more on all the nasty curbs. So I don't believe he held off the curbs in qualifying.
Yes i only saw the mistake Max made which cost himm some.
Also i dont think these cars would last long with a broken wheelbearing the bearing would overheat in no time and lockup
Love the sounds of the Honda engines though
Yes 100% its a unique sound, and a great sound at that!
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Sieper
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Re: 2021 Emilia Romagna Grand Prix - Imola, Apr 16 - 18

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PlatinumZealot wrote:
Fri Apr 23, 2021 3:09 am
Sieper wrote:
Thu Apr 22, 2021 9:39 pm
dans79 wrote:
Thu Apr 22, 2021 7:13 pm


go back and read the conversation again, we aren't talking about the race. We are talking about comparing drivers in qualifying.

NathanOlder made a comment about qualifying between Sergio & Max.
Sieper made a comment about comparing Max & Lewis.
I responded to Sieper........
He actually didn’t speak about Max. He was talking about “that guy” (even Lewis himself stopped referring to Max as “that guy” after two seasons or so) that was “supposed to be fast”.

I think “that guy” is plenty fast.

If we want to actually discuss qualy, fine. Last race Checo got stuck in Q2 even with 2 tries and Max was through in 1 try on a track that was quickly building up speed. This time around Max obviously made a quite big error, but still it was only a few hundreds of a second between them. There were some mitigating factors (missed FP2, switched to yellow for Q2 (Perez was red red red in each Q session) and he had a wheelbearing issue, none of which “guy” was hiding behind, just owned up to the mistake and went on with racing. Fast. Not supposedly fast.
Checo said he made an error too.
That's qualifying. The fastest guy usually makes the least errors.
Lewis won the qualy! Only to fall for this not making the least errors trap the next day. A difficult business, this racing.

Being slow or fast is not always down to not making errors, Checo in Bahrein made no gross errors (not even by his own admission) and still he got stuck in Q2. Max made a visibly large error and still finished in neigh on the same time (but in third) It is all a balance of speed, risk, error mitigating etc. Very easy to sit here and judge. Especially if one is really searching for things. A balanced view in these race threads has been far and between.
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NathanOlder
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Re: 2021 Emilia Romagna Grand Prix - Imola, Apr 16 - 18

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Very true. I still felt sorry for Perez in Bahrain as he was only 3 tenths off Max in Q2. Max made it through in around 7th place, but Sergio went out. Which to the untrained eye looks far worse than his performance actually was.
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Juzh
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Re: 2021 Emilia Romagna Grand Prix - Imola, Apr 16 - 18

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PlatinumZealot wrote:
Fri Apr 23, 2021 3:17 am
LHamilton wrote:
Fri Apr 23, 2021 3:01 am
Looks like Perez did use more kerb than Verstappen during their respective Q3 run. So there might be something to it.

Verstappens mistake in the second corner lost him quite a bit I must say.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zhEMuDNGy7I
Maybe lost one tenth or so. But Sergio was sloppy on braking in the middle sector.
It was made pretty obvious on weekend debrief that Verstappen lost at least 0.2s with that mistake (compared to hamilton). He goes from being 0.1s ahead down to 0.2s behind after mistake.

(ignore smedley pointing somewhere else on this pic)
Image
dotted horizontal lines are +-1 tenth of second. horizontal green line is hamilton's laptime and blue line going up and down is verstappen relative to hamilton.