Belgian GP 2007

For ease of use, there is one thread per grand prix where you can discuss everything during that specific GP weekend. You can find these threads here.
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checkered
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Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2007 1:32 pm

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Scuderia_Russ wrote:Can't believe Sato took Button! :roll:
It's great! Sato took

Button, Webber took Kovalainen. I think the big companies have stumbled upon a great marketing strategy ... originally they sure seemed to want to crowd the privateers an small guys out to provide an advertising procession (bad, bad, corporations :lol: ), but this kinda thing provides drama and attention money can't buy. They can still take part in the glory, while being relieved from the pressure of winning ALL THE TIME (sorry for yelling there ...) which is, given there are so many manufacturers involved, frankly unbelievably unrealistic for businesses that generally tend to think ahead. I'm just hoping that it works out and no-one tries to "mess with evolution".

Glad to hear that the experience proved satisfactory to Ogami, Principessa and Tomba. As current tracks go, Spa is a classic indeed and this time there wasn't even rain during the race. Image

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mx_tifoso
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bar555 wrote:How can a team stay focused when.....
-You need more .........
AFAIK, McLaren are a professional team, and surely they must be able to remain "focused" when encountering rough roads. If they can't remain focused at their level, with both of their drivers in the lead for the WDC, then what kind of ship are they running?

I believe RD said that McLaren turn in about $500-600mil per year, and that the $100mil fine will not affect them too much. Besides, they have enough sponsors to help maintain their F1 team.

My point being, that they are focused, 3rd and 4th place results at a circuit where Ferrari was expected by all to dominate. What do you call that?
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Carlos
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Orgami Musahi- Your discription of watching the race turned it from stale television coverage to a spectacle of racing ballet - alive and vital. Can we dare imagine if F1 cars were designed to actually race so those gritty yet elegent corner accents were obvious on the screen?

I dare to hope.

To answer your question. We have seldom seen lap times go down. But everything you highlighted can be had even at lower speeds. Taking a 90 degree corner ( with good sight lines ) at a legal speed of 50 KM, in an ancient MG Sprite relays all you praised. Speed is not a preoccupation - even to a possible devine entity. That first race of creativity had a lap time of 7 Days.

Ogami musashi
Ogami musashi
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yeah i do understand your point, the porsche races were very cool indeed and that's the point: they were all different.

This was that thing i loved, porsche was not less interesting than gp2 and gp2 less interesting than F1, they were all different.

let me express myself on that example as i think this is where auto racing is so interesting by its diversity (while fundamentally running on the same track, the same day).
An F1 car and other series differ on two points(racing wise): frame of driving, and time compression.

frame of driving:

Porsche GT cars are hard to drive, you have to master the car itself first then run it at isane speed.

On the opposite an F1 car (a modern F1) is easy to drive and can be pushed to the limit.

What's the difference? the F1 car , km/h for km/H , will go farther into the limit.

This is like, i ask you to walk in straight line from a point A to a point B.

The Porsche car would be a man that is drunk or have any infirmity preventing him for going straight.
Thus if a competition was held between drunk men, the best would be the one being able to exploit the more its possibilities.

The F1 car would be a man that is an athlete with its almost full potential ready.
If a competition between those men was held, the best would the one that has the best line the best potential.

There's then a difference of competence the porsche driver uses his skills into his car mastering, his frame is thus the car, the F1 driver use his skills on the trajectory, the accelerations, thus the frame is the track.

The drunk man can be the best at controlling the effect of alcohol , he will never go straight then will never be able to be as quick as the athlete, still one can be impressed by skills of achieving some times while drunk.


This is my answer to the "F1 cars are too easy to drive now! pilots don't do nothing!".


The time compression:

What is obvious, is that F1 car run hell faster than anything else on a track.
The best gp2 lap time was 1:59 while F1 were 1:48 (on race).
Clearly than means, in corners, they spend less time in them, they also accelerate faster, and brake later.
With this, the tires react faster than on anything else (a slip angle of 3° gives an F1 car its maximum sideways acceleration).

What that means? first, when a pilot is 0,5 secs ahead of someone he did perform A LOT better.This would, in GT racing, corresponds to a 8 seconds gap or something like that.

Second when they make a mistake, the mistake cost them less time (because they spend less time in the corner)...except if they slow down!!
A slow down in F1 cost more in gap than in any other racing series.
That"s why on TV you see replays of pilot running a bit wide.
If you look at the other series, you'll see that anytime and nobody notices it, in F1 running wide costs you a lot of time.

The rate of change of the state of the cars is also so fast that it requires a lot of fast decisional processes for the pilot.
F1 pilot are brain-shaped, their brains are trained to think a certain way which goes as far as re defining some unconscious processes.

The blasting accelerations (both in cornering and braking/accelerating) associated with speed means that you can have a lot of cornering speeds.
This was obvious at spa.
You can turn 20km/h slower at the apex than your competitor and still being the quickest in this corner (because of braking/accelerating possibilities, and the cornering transient performance).


Well i'll stop here, what is want to say is that speed brings a lot of physical consequences that make the driving of a current F1 car totaly different of the one of a Gp2.

So imagine the rest...


In 92 the cars were not in this way, this different now, but i think if you want to see that, then GP2 is good.

That's why i want to see F1 cars being fast in corners, braking supra late, accelerating like hell and being missiles in lines.
Just so that F1 is different (like nascar is different from IRL).

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Carlos
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Thank you Ogami Musahi for the posts of yesterday and today. So very, enjoyable. It renews my spirit and my pleasure in F1.

Regards Carlos
(small edit)

DaveKillens
DaveKillens
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First off, congratulations to the Kimi fans on his win. Well done from the Iceman.
It was very pleasing to see Sutil show his talents, and finish ahead of the SA guys.

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Principessa
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Joined: Fri Aug 12, 2005 1:36 pm
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Sutil was so good at Spa-Francorchamps because we wished him good luck when we ran into him at his hotel :P

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Principessa
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Joined: Fri Aug 12, 2005 1:36 pm
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:arrow: http://www.f1technical.net/gallery/v/Ev ... amps+2007/

I'm putting some pictures we took online from Spa-Francorchamps...so you can check them via that link in our gallery :wink:

More pictures will follow in the coming days.

Let us know if you like them?!

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HKS
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Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2007 5:37 am

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Principessa wrote:

Pictures of our weekend will be online tomorrow and on Tuesday, but at the moment we're extremely tired and of course there is work and "school "

tomorrow :wink: !

"You go to school to partice, practice makes a man perfect, nobody is perfect then why to go to school"

:lol:

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Carlos
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My favourite Spa Photo: Thanks Principessa. Almost like going to the race.
http://www.f1technical.net/gallery/v/Ev ... d.JPG.html

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Principessa
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I've added more pictures from our Spa-Francorchamps weekend: http://www.f1technical.net/gallery/v/Ev ... ?g2_page=1

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Rob W
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Joined: Fri Aug 18, 2006 2:28 am

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Ogami musashi wrote:The rate of change of the state of the cars is also so fast that it requires a lot of fast decisional processes for the pilot.
F1 pilot are brain-shaped, their brains are trained to think a certain way which goes as far as re defining some unconscious processes. ...
Very enjoyable posts over the past few days Oagami. 8)

Cheers!

Rob W

Mikey_s
Mikey_s
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I was there too, not a great race, but Spa Francorchamps is such a great circuit. TV does it no justice, in fact I think the same applies to most circuits.

The drop from La Source to Eau Rouge and the climb from Eau Rouge to Radillon is awesome - it is such a hilly circuit; just glorious! I am completely unsurprised that the drivers love it.

I am sooooo jealous of Principessa and Tomba having pit lane access! I probably saw you guys from my seat - some of your pics look like they were taken when i was taking some of mine! I was in the grandstand opposite the Ferrari and McLaren pits... example;
http://img174.imageshack.us/img174/5133/img0372vm9.jpg

I had a great seat for the start and the pit stops, but unfortunately didn't get to see much "action"

http://img393.imageshack.us/img393/9043/img0402ws0.jpg

Happy to post more if anyone is interested...
Mike

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Steven
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Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2002 5:32 pm
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Mikey_s wrote:I am sooooo jealous of Principessa and Tomba having pit lane access! I probably saw you guys from my seat
Well Mikey_s, we didn't have pit access, we just visited the pitwalk on thursday. All other pics were taken from everywhere around the circuit ;)

bar555
bar555
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Mikey_s wrote : Happy to post more if anyone is interested...

of course , post more , as much as you can .Thanks in advance