Variante: my F1 car

Post here information about your own engineering projects, including but not limited to building your own car or designing a virtual car through CAD.
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variante
131
Joined: 09 Apr 2012, 11:36
Location: Monza

Re: Variante: my F1 car

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the KVRC car is 95% different. It will be a quite conventional car. My old car wouldn't perform well in the CFD since it needs fine aero tuning, with all those innovations.

astracrazy
31
Joined: 04 Mar 2009, 16:04

Re: Variante: my F1 car

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so i run a quick test on his nose for him.

velocity: 75 m/s
Lift: 196N
Drag: 94N

here is a few pics
Image
Image
Image - the blue bits must just be impurities

wesley123
204
Joined: 23 Feb 2008, 17:55

Re: Variante: my F1 car

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Would be col if you could compare this to a regular high nose, and a nose like that without the bend in the underside, because I believe that nose is just draggy
"Bite my shiny metal ass" - Bender

astracrazy
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Joined: 04 Mar 2009, 16:04

Re: Variante: my F1 car

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i think the bend under the nose is the problem, if it was a lot flatter (like brawn style) you should get downforce not lift

wesley123
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Joined: 23 Feb 2008, 17:55

Re: Variante: my F1 car

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I dont really know, because such shape on the underside of the nose was applied in the LMP's for multiple years. They all had a diffuser on each side of the tub and a flat plane in the center as it didnt have the raised footbox, and they all carried the same shape.

but would be lovely to see how it works compared to a regular low nose, high nose and maybe some other varieties
"Bite my shiny metal ass" - Bender

CottrellGP
4
Joined: 02 Sep 2011, 01:48

Re: Variante: my F1 car

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[quote="astracrazy"]so i run a quick test on his nose for him.

velocity: 75 m/s
Lift: 196N
Drag: 94N

Can i ask hat programs are used here?
Dan Cottrell

Master Of Innovation!

astracrazy
31
Joined: 04 Mar 2009, 16:04

Re: Variante: my F1 car

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CottrellGP wrote:
astracrazy wrote:so i run a quick test on his nose for him.

velocity: 75 m/s
Lift: 196N
Drag: 94N
Can i ask hat programs are used here?
solidworks. a novice on it but can do the basic stuff

i think a more diagonal approach under the nose would work better and removing the channels

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variante
131
Joined: 09 Apr 2012, 11:36
Location: Monza

Re: Variante: my F1 car

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ok, you are going to laugh to what i'm going to say...
I have just tried to build a an actual model of that nose, similar to those built by PaulB (not as good, of course). I used a scale of 1/10, a velocity of less than 5m/s, and it came out that it was producing something like 0,08N of downforce.
The method i used is not that much "scientific", but it just does not seem like the model would ever create lift.

However, thanks to astracrazy, i now understand how that nose behaves at high speed...very inefficiently. If anyone has a bit of experience with this kind of design, or any idea... opinion are welcomed

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N12ck
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Joined: 19 Dec 2010, 19:10

Re: Variante: my F1 car

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variante wrote:ok, you are going to laugh to what i'm going to say...
I have just tried to build a an actual model of that nose, similar to those built by PaulB (not as good, of course). I used a scale of 1/10, a velocity of less than 5m/s, and it came out that it was producing something like 0,08N of downforce.
The method i used is not that much "scientific", but it just does not seem like the model would ever create lift.

However, thanks to astracrazy, i now understand how that nose behaves at high speed...very inefficiently. If anyone has a bit of experience with this kind of design, or any idea... opinion are welcomed
to be honest the CFD data makes sense, if you look at your 'wing shaped nose' and look at it closely, the upper side has a larger surface area than the under side, the reason wings make low pressure on the under side is that the air has more surface area to cover than the upper side so if the upper side has more surface area than the under side then it is more likely it will create lift rather than downforce

Yours has a splitter so a big chunk of that surface area has been removed,
Budding F1 Engineer

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variante
131
Joined: 09 Apr 2012, 11:36
Location: Monza

Re: Variante: my F1 car

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i'm not saying that the analysis is wrong, infact it helped me a lot to understand air behaviour at high velocity.
N12ck wrote: the upper side has a larger surface area than the under side, the reason wings make low pressure on the under side is that the air has more surface area to cover than the upper side so if the upper side has more surface area than the under side then it is more likely it will create lift rather than downforce
The problem is not the exposed surface (a wing can produce DF even with one of the sides completely neutral). The problems of that nose are mainly 2:
1°: that splitter creates too much high pressure, making it impossible for the air to go upward and thus it does not create a "diffuser" effect
2°: that splitter acts as wall, deviating part of the mass of the upwashed flow, creating lift.

What astonishes me is this: since the lift described in the 2°point is generated purely by the inertia of the particles, how on earth is possible that this force is way stronger than the down-forces generated by the rest of the wing???

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hollus
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Joined: 29 Mar 2009, 01:21
Location: Copenhagen, Denmark

Re: Variante: my F1 car

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The only part of that nose that would create downforce, the bend in the lower part near the front, has a fake floor under it so the low pressure is wasted. The rest of it, as Nick said, is an inverted F1 style wing profile.
Rivals, not enemies.

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variante
131
Joined: 09 Apr 2012, 11:36
Location: Monza

Re: Variante: my F1 car

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hey guys,
i just wanted to see how the old livery looks like on the KVRC car... not bad, i think
BTW interesting updates on this car coming for the new Khamsin season
Image

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variante
131
Joined: 09 Apr 2012, 11:36
Location: Monza

Re: Variante: my F1 car

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Finally unveiling the latest model, specifically designed for KVRC 2013.

Image
Image

Let me know what you think. Suggestions are always welcomed.

Meanwhile i'll tell you that the car is not in its final configuration...mostly because i'm unsure about what components are the most effective (i haven't been able to run a single CFD analysis... #-o ). For example, i might decide to use a high DF nosecone, modified Fwing, modified bargeboard and turning vanes... At least i can surely tell you that the rear wing is going to be way different (the current one is just aesthetics), and the diffuser will be pretty much the same used in the test race, which performed very well.
To be honest, i'm not fully convinced by this car (i relied a lot on CFD...). Let's see what happens...

CottrellGP
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Joined: 02 Sep 2011, 01:48

Re: Variante: my F1 car

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Love it!
Dan Cottrell

Master Of Innovation!

wesley123
204
Joined: 23 Feb 2008, 17:55

Re: Variante: my F1 car

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Looks good! Clean and simple, that is the right way to go.
"Bite my shiny metal ass" - Bender