2016 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

This forum contains threads to discuss teams themselves. Anything not technical about the cars, including restructuring, performances etc belongs here.
basti313
basti313
52
Joined: Sat Feb 22, 2014 1:49 pm

Re: 2016 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

Post

Gothrek wrote:
ME4ME wrote:Ferrari isn't giving up on 2016 ...

http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/ferra ... ce-828694/
"We have six races now to go and if we want to be second in constructors' [championship] of course we need to improve, that is normal," he said. "This is what we are going to do.
Meanwhile RB already fully switched resources to the 2017 car. Way to go Ferrari, invest for the future #-o
I don't think Vettel speaks resources wise. As it has been confirmed by Ferrari that they are fully focussing on 2017.
From my point of view, he wants the team to stay hungry, he wants to motivate them and not give up.
Well, Ferrari brought a new nose this weekend.

https://imgr1.auto-motor-und-sport.de/F ... 980752.jpg

They are still developing on points, which will not change next season. The nose rules will stay the same. RedBull for example was running correlation test for the front wing in FP1, so they still have this front wing in CFD and/or wind tunnel.
We might also see new diffusors or brake coolings.

User avatar
iotar__
7
Joined: Fri Sep 28, 2012 11:31 am

Re: 2016 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

Post

GPR-A wrote:Arrivabene: Vettel must earn Ferrari future

Oh well, what have we come to !!! I wouldn't want to really read it the way it was put in heading, but scrolling through the article, the message is clear, where Arrivabene has said it that way, without really sounding it that way. Vettel is one asset that they shouldn't be ruffling the feathers of. Totally un-necessary statements there Mr. Arrivabene.
That doesn't mean anything, they gave those warning to Raikkonen in 15-16, both a parody. Pretending as everything else about Ferrari's driver management. As for being an asset would be nice if you gave examples. I can, below the scale:
- Spain '16
- Mexico '15
- Spa '16
- Spa '15
- Bahrain '15
- China '16 (affecting Russia)
- Malaysia '16 (affecting Japan)
- Great Britain '16 (mistakes, pace)

Bad ones, may be questionable as a whole but parts are not
- Monaco '16 (mistakes, pace compared to FI)
- Canada '15 (penalty, racecraft/overtakes)
Below potential, meaning 100% from the car/position not necessarily result only
- Canada '16 (I mean off track/mistakes)
- Spain '15 (pace)
- USA '15 pace behind Perez then against TR
- perhaps Australia '15 (I mean off track at the first opportunity)

For a driver that
- is considered top,
- paid ~30 million,
- chooses (shortcut you know what I mean) his team-mate which compromises team's results,
- is not blamed for anything but technical people are reshuffled, fired or pretended ;-) to be fired
- is having close second, second or third best car all the time with limited competition and thus little pressure (including within the team, you can't pretend otherwise)
In short driver making a difference that's not exactly impressive. On the contrary for any driver and especially in '16 Vettel is not delivering at all.

User avatar
ME4ME
173
Joined: Fri Dec 19, 2014 3:37 pm

Re: 2016 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

Post

iotar__ wrote:
GPR-A wrote:Arrivabene: Vettel must earn Ferrari future

Oh well, what have we come to !!! I wouldn't want to really read it the way it was put in heading, but scrolling through the article, the message is clear, where Arrivabene has said it that way, without really sounding it that way. Vettel is one asset that they shouldn't be ruffling the feathers of. Totally un-necessary statements there Mr. Arrivabene.
That doesn't mean anything, they gave those warning to Raikkonen in 15-16, both a parody. Pretending as everything else about Ferrari's driver management. As for being an asset would be nice if you gave examples. I can, below the scale:
- Spain '16
- Mexico '15
- Spa '16
- Spa '15
- Bahrain '15
- China '16 (affecting Russia)
- Malaysia '16 (affecting Japan)
- Great Britain '16 (mistakes, pace)

Bad ones, may be questionable as a whole but parts are not
- Monaco '16 (mistakes, pace compared to FI)
- Canada '15 (penalty, racecraft/overtakes)
Below potential, meaning 100% from the car/position not necessarily result only
- Canada '16 (I mean off track/mistakes)
- Spain '15 (pace)
- USA '15 pace behind Perez then against TR
- perhaps Australia '15 (I mean off track at the first opportunity)

For a driver that
- is considered top,
- paid ~30 million,
- chooses (shortcut you know what I mean) his team-mate which compromises team's results,
- is not blamed for anything but technical people are reshuffled, fired or pretended ;-) to be fired
- is having close second, second or third best car all the time with limited competition and thus little pressure (including within the team, you can't pretend otherwise)
In short driver making a difference that's not exactly impressive. On the contrary for any driver and especially in '16 Vettel is not delivering at all.
You could just as easily make such a list of bad performances of Hamilton, Rosberg or Alonso.
Overall Vettel had a stunning 2015 season. This year Vettel has made mistakes no doubt. But equally Ferrari has failed to deliver and taken 2 victories from him (Australia, Canada), as well as giving him as bad reliability as Hamilton has received at Mercedes. In addition, he got crashed out in Russia by Kvyat.

I think Raikkonens comeback to form makes some people think Vettel has gone backwards, rather then Raikkonen being the one going forwards.

Anyway I think it's foolish of Arrivabene to comment on the matter at all. Also in Suzuka Q3 Arrivabene was getting "passionate" for no reason at all, waving his hands at RAI & VET taking third and fourth. To me he seems a very emotionally driven guy, wich might get the better of him.

Ferrari should look at improving their car & strategic capabilities, rather then messing with their drivers.

Silent Storm
Silent Storm
107
Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2015 5:42 pm
Location: Sydney, Australia

Re: 2016 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

Post

ME4ME wrote:
I think Raikkonens comeback to form makes some people think Vettel has gone backwards, rather then Raikkonen being the one going forwards.


Ferrari should look at improving their car & strategic capabilities, rather then messing with their drivers.
This!! People think Vettel has lost his speed under pressure although he is making rookie mistakes and trying to do Alonso like first laps trying to prove something but he hasn't lost his speed, It's Raikkonen who is back in form and that's one less problem for Ferrari as their No.2 driver is matching their No.1 driver who is a Four time world champion.

I agree they should focus on performance rather than drivers. IMO they should just forget this season and stop wasting time on this car as 2nd or 3rd in WCC doesn't make a difference to Ferrari, rather catch up to rivals in areas where they lag behind, But it's Ferrari they know what's best for them.
There is always a way, and it usually doesn't work.

User avatar
Mr. Fahrenheit
14
Joined: Thu Apr 02, 2015 3:28 pm

Re: 2016 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

Post

The translations are winding me up and I can understand how people are running with them. The quotes originate from an interview with Sky Italia with Federica Masolin, Jacques Villeneuve e Carlo Vanzini (Sky F1 Italia's answer to Herbert, Hill, Lazenby). Oh, and it's in Italian.

http://sport.sky.it/formula1/2016/10/07 ... nerdi.html



Apologies in advance for the long post.


Direct quotes:

...after discussing Kimi and how he's much happier, the quotes suddenly switch to discussing Vettel. I haven't been able to watch a clip to understand why the topic changed unless Vettel was inferred when discussing German drivers and contract renewals...

[1] È già successo in passato con Schumacher, nel maggior momento di pressione, che arrivasse un rinnovo importante. Si parla di un rinnovo a breve?
"Non credo che le persone si conquistino con i rinnovi. Oggi i tempi sono un po’ cambiati, nel senso che quello che aveva funzionato con Michael non necessariamente potrebbe funzionare con Sebastian. Sebastian ha solo bisogno di concentrarsi sulla macchina. è una persona che dà tanto e il suo dar tanto a volte significa interessarsi un po’ di tutto, ecc… per cui ogni tanto va ripreso e va focalizzato sul lavoro principale che deve fare, ma non lo fa con spirito polemico. Lo fa perché è totalmente immerso in questa che tanti chiamano “la famiglia”, ma che io chiamo il Team Ferrari”.

[2] Il desiderio di blindarlo c’è?
"Sebastian oggi ha un contratto con noi. abbiamo del lavoro da fare quest’anno e anche il prossimo anno. Poi durante la stagione si vedrà. Ognuno di noi ha degli obiettivi, li ho io, li ha la squadra, li ha Sebastian, li abbiamo tutti. Per cui è giusto che chiunque, indipendentemente da chi sia, si guadagni il suo posto e il suo stipendio".

translated:

[1] In the past, when Schumacher was going through his most difficult period he had a contract renewal
I don't think that you win people over with contract renewals. Things have moved on since then and what worked with Michael may not work with Sebastian. Sebastian just needs to focus on (driving) the car. He's a guy that gives a lot and that manifests itself as trying too hard to interest himself in everything going on - every so often he's reined back in and focussed back on his main task (driving the car). He doesn't behave like this as an act, he's completely immersed in the thing they call 'la famiglia', but I call 'Team Ferrari'.

[2]Is there a desire to tie him down with a new contract?
Right now, Sebastian has a contract with us. We've got work to do this year and next year. During next season, we'll think about the new contract. Everyone has their objectives. I have mine, everyone in the team has theirs, Sebastian has his; we all have them. Therefore it's right that everyone - regardless of who they are - earns their place and their pay-check"

I don't take this as a barbed remark aimed at Vettel because he's underperforming, nor towing the boss' (Marchionne) line that no one is irreplaceable. But hey, argue away!! :lol:

note: presumably the Schumacher renewal is the contract announced in 1998 that took him through 2000-2002.

User avatar
GPR-A duplicate2
167
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2014 8:00 am

Re: 2016 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

Post

Mr. Fahrenheit wrote:[1] In the past, when Schumacher was going through his most difficult period he had a contract renewal
note: presumably the Schumacher renewal is the contract announced in 1998 that took him through 2000-2002.
WTF!!! Seriously? Schumacher was going through his most difficult period? After winning 2 back to back championships, the man took the biggest challenge to renew a beaten Ferrari. As promised, wins 3 races in the first year of driving for that team. Fights for the championship in second and third year. A period of renaissance.

Statistics:
He won three races, more than the team's total tally for the period from 1991 to 1995. Early in the 1996 season the car had reliability trouble and he did not finish six of the 16 races.
Won 5 races in 1997 (8 podiums) and 1998 (11 podiums).

So when the hell was he going through his most difficult period? Absurdity to say the least.

User avatar
Vasconia
40
Joined: Thu Aug 30, 2012 9:45 am
Location: Basque Country

Re: 2016 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

Post

Man, those Ferrari strategies.... really, someone deserves a punch in the face.

Gothrek
Gothrek
1
Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2016 1:06 pm

Re: 2016 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

Post

Vasconia wrote:Man, those Ferrari strategies.... really, someone deserves a punch in the face.
Will Jock Clear still be present next season?

Ferrari & Strategy doesn't seem to go hand in hand it seems.

sosic2121
sosic2121
19
Joined: Wed Jun 08, 2016 11:14 am

Re: 2016 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

Post

Gothrek wrote:
Vasconia wrote:Man, those Ferrari strategies.... really, someone deserves a punch in the face.
Will Jock Clear still be present next season?

Ferrari & Strategy doesn't seem to go hand in hand it seems.
I was laughing at Williams' strategy during 2014 and 2015 but this is way worse!

User avatar
ME4ME
173
Joined: Fri Dec 19, 2014 3:37 pm

Re: 2016 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

Post

Gothrek wrote:
Vasconia wrote:Man, those Ferrari strategies.... really, someone deserves a punch in the face.
Will Jock Clear still be present next season?

Ferrari & Strategy doesn't seem to go hand in hand it seems.
This is an interesting point. When Allison was on the pit wall, temporary occupying the function that was later given to Clear, they did pretty well. In 2015 Ferrari were by far better strategy-wise than in 2016. Either Clear still needs to blend in with the team, or things are just not gelling. That said, obviously he isn't the only one accountable for Ferrari's strategy, but he should at least have some authority to make changes where he deems necessary.

User avatar
Vasconia
40
Joined: Thu Aug 30, 2012 9:45 am
Location: Basque Country

Re: 2016 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

Post

Gothrek wrote:
Vasconia wrote:Man, those Ferrari strategies.... really, someone deserves a punch in the face.
Will Jock Clear still be present next season?

Ferrari & Strategy doesn't seem to go hand in hand it seems.
I hope not, things dont work with him.

User avatar
iotar__
7
Joined: Fri Sep 28, 2012 11:31 am

Re: 2016 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

Post

Some bits from Baldisserri interview: http://en.f1i.com/news/75689-climate-te ... rrari.html He speaks about:
- qualifications of Marchionne - or rather lack of
- Allison's departure and Binotto not being proper replacement
- "Climate of terror" which I called "cover your a..." attitude
- drivers, including Vettel

Everything that has been mentioned in this thread before :-).

User avatar
Kiril Varbanov
250
Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2012 2:00 pm
Location: Bulgaria, Sofia

Re: 2016 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

Post

iotar__ wrote:Some bits from Baldisserri interview: ....
Here's is another site - http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/ferra ... ri-837753/

Basically, it's the same, just with slightly different words. Pretty sad, albeit already visible. You can smell the fear.

bhall II
bhall II
861
Joined: Thu Jun 19, 2014 7:15 pm

Re: 2016 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

Post

As long as Marchionne remains in the picture, Ferrari is fücked. He's the anti-Midas.

Silent Storm
Silent Storm
107
Joined: Mon Feb 02, 2015 5:42 pm
Location: Sydney, Australia

Re: 2016 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team - Ferrari

Post

Kiril Varbanov wrote:
iotar__ wrote:Some bits from Baldisserri interview: ....
Here's is another site - http://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/ferra ... ri-837753/

Basically, it's the same, just with slightly different words. Pretty sad, albeit already visible. You can smell the fear.
It seems the strategy team doesn't smell any fear.

Radical Gearbox which is problematic.
PU which isn't running on full power as seen on dyno due to reliability issues.
http://it.motorsport.com/f1/news/ferrar ... lo-837096/
There is always a way, and it usually doesn't work.