2016 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

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sgth0mas
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Re: 2016 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by sgth0mas » Fri Feb 26, 2016 2:42 am

Raleigh wrote:Not hating, it's a clever approach, and much better than having another hopeless backmarker simply making up the numbers. I'd be quite happy to see more customer teams on the grid if it improved the competitiveness of racing.

But no credit for the car goes to Haas. They have found a legal loophole to buy and run a Dallara built Ferrari F1 car, nothing more and nothing less.

Ahh i see. I didnt realize you had the technical drawings of both chassis and the other non purchased components. I guess you got it from dallara?

Haha..."not hating"

Der_Meister45
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Re: 2016 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by Der_Meister45 » Fri Feb 26, 2016 5:13 am

Raleigh wrote:Not hating, it's a clever approach, and much better than having another hopeless backmarker simply making up the numbers. I'd be quite happy to see more customer teams on the grid if it improved the competitiveness of racing.

But no credit for the car goes to Haas. They have found a legal loophole to buy and run a Dallara built Ferrari F1 car, nothing more and nothing less.
I wouldn't call it a loophole. They, Hass, still decides on the direction of the car. They just have a 3rd party manufacture actually make the parts for them. Just as other teams use brembo to make the brakes.

Raleigh
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Re: 2016 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by Raleigh » Fri Feb 26, 2016 8:43 am

I'm a Williams fan. Williams started out running customer March and Brabham cars. So no, I'm not hating Haas for doing the same.

But we know who developed this car, we know where the car was developed, and the car has an uncanny resemblance to the SF15-T, mixed with certain elements that were developed for the SF16-H. And I'm not talking about a general resemblance, large parts of the the car are 1:1 copies of Ferrari down to the finest details.

So don't try to say this car is anything more than a technically legal customer Ferrari.

mattia.bobbo
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Re: 2016 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by mattia.bobbo » Fri Feb 26, 2016 9:31 am

RBR won titles on loopholes and nobody blamed on them. So I really can't see the problem with Haas.

Writinglife
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Re: 2016 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by Writinglife » Fri Feb 26, 2016 9:32 am

mattia.bobbo wrote:RBR won titles on loopholes and nobody blamed on them. So I really can't see the problem with Haas.

Oh we blamed them, but the FIA turned a blind eye to a lot of their shenanigans. :D

sgth0mas
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Re: 2016 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by sgth0mas » Fri Feb 26, 2016 3:05 pm

Raleigh wrote:I'm a Williams fan. Williams started out running customer March and Brabham cars. So no, I'm not hating Haas for doing the same.

But we know who developed this car, we know where the car was developed, and the car has an uncanny resemblance to the SF15-T, mixed with certain elements that were developed for the SF16-H. And I'm not talking about a general resemblance, large parts of the the car are 1:1 copies of Ferrari down to the finest details.

So don't try to say this car is anything more than a technically legal customer Ferrari.

Prove it...and while youre at it...throw a TR next to the ferrari and see just how similar all these cars look.

donskar
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Re: 2016 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by donskar » Fri Feb 26, 2016 3:29 pm

Great to see a new team enter F1 -- and one that seems able to avoid disgracing itself like so many have in the past several years. Is the Haas a Ferrari? No, it is not. Does it use many Ferrari parts? Yes, as allowed by the rules. (The Williams -- to cite just one example -- uses a customer engine, customer brakes, etc -- but is still very much a Williams.) More teams can only be good for F1 -- so long as they have the money and skills to do a reasonable job. There was a time when MANY teams ran customer cars, and did so reasonably well.
Enzo Ferrari was a great man. But he was not a good man. -- Phil Hill

Gridlock
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Re: 2016 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by Gridlock » Sat Feb 27, 2016 3:54 pm

Dallara make the wings as well as the chassis, although I can't remember where I read that.

I think some of you have this backwards: Ferrari didn't 'help' Haas to make a good VF16, Ferrari helped Haas to make a good SF-15T. And then spent a lot of time looking at it, outside of the restrictions. Allegedly.
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Pierce89
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Re: 2016 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by Pierce89 » Sun Feb 28, 2016 11:03 pm

You people seemingly ignore the fact that Haas has a completely proprietary monocoque. Haas even bragged that his chassis is "more advanced" than the Ferrari chassis because without championship expectations they could be less conservative than top teams in construction of the monocoque.
“To be able to actually make something is awfully nice”
Bruce McLaren on building his first McLaren racecars, 1970

“I've got to be careful what I say, but possibly to probably Juan would have had a bigger go”
Sir Frank Williams after the 2003 Canadian GP, where Ralf hesitated to pass brother M. Schumacher

Gridlock
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Re: 2016 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by Gridlock » Mon Feb 29, 2016 3:06 pm

Pierce89 wrote:You people seemingly ignore the fact that Haas has a completely proprietary monocoque. Haas even bragged that his chassis is "more advanced" than the Ferrari chassis because without championship expectations they could be less conservative than top teams in construction of the monocoque.
Seeing how that's something they couldn't legally buy anyway I think it's taken as fact implicitly..
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FW17
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Re: 2016 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by FW17 » Mon Feb 29, 2016 3:15 pm

JA: What about the new Haas F1?

Nick Downes: It looks like a child has done this. If this is a $100m programme, it looks as though they spent $100 dollars on it. The Haas logo is quite interesting, in that it is so poorly engineered for a company that makes computerised machine tools.

We re-drew that for him because some of those lines are not even parallel and Gene Haas likes tinkering around so he probably decided where this would go, but Guenther had us trying to design an identity for the Haas F1 team. I said “you need to look at this, there is probably some sense in putting a bit of distance between your Haas F1 team and your Haas sponsor because ultimately you want to roll down your Haas sponsor and bring up your Haas F1 team so while they are obviously a player, but they could perhaps generate 20 per cent and not 100 per cent of the budget.

But at the moment you’re making that look so much like a hammer and ingot type of thing that if you go and try to find some new sponsors they can’t see past this dreadful logo design and clumsy identity.” It looks like a GP2 car.

Pierce89
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Re: 2016 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by Pierce89 » Mon Feb 29, 2016 4:20 pm

Gridlock wrote:
Pierce89 wrote:You people seemingly ignore the fact that Haas has a completely proprietary monocoque. Haas even bragged that his chassis is "more advanced" than the Ferrari chassis because without championship expectations they could be less conservative than top teams in construction of the monocoque.
Seeing how that's something they couldn't legally buy anyway I think it's taken as fact implicitly..
Then how can they call it an sf15t?
“To be able to actually make something is awfully nice”
Bruce McLaren on building his first McLaren racecars, 1970

“I've got to be careful what I say, but possibly to probably Juan would have had a bigger go”
Sir Frank Williams after the 2003 Canadian GP, where Ralf hesitated to pass brother M. Schumacher

adrianjordan
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Re: 2016 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by adrianjordan » Mon Feb 29, 2016 5:31 pm

Pierce89 wrote:
Gridlock wrote:
Pierce89 wrote:You people seemingly ignore the fact that Haas has a completely proprietary monocoque. Haas even bragged that his chassis is "more advanced" than the Ferrari chassis because without championship expectations they could be less conservative than top teams in construction of the monocoque.
Seeing how that's something they couldn't legally buy anyway I think it's taken as fact implicitly..
Then how can they call it an sf15t?
How can who call it that?
In 2007 I had the chance to go to a meet-and-greet with an F1 test driver. I decided not to as I didn't think he'd even amount to much...he was the BMW Sauber test driver and his name was Sebastian Vettel...

Pierce89
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Re: 2016 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by Pierce89 » Mon Feb 29, 2016 5:45 pm

adrianjordan wrote:
Pierce89 wrote:
Gridlock wrote:
Seeing how that's something they couldn't legally buy anyway I think it's taken as fact implicitly..
Then how can they call it an sf15t?
How can who call it that?
Gridlock specifically said that Ferrari rather than helping Haas build a better vf16, helped them build a better sf15t.
“To be able to actually make something is awfully nice”
Bruce McLaren on building his first McLaren racecars, 1970

“I've got to be careful what I say, but possibly to probably Juan would have had a bigger go”
Sir Frank Williams after the 2003 Canadian GP, where Ralf hesitated to pass brother M. Schumacher

adrianjordan
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Location: West Yorkshire, England

Re: 2016 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by adrianjordan » Mon Feb 29, 2016 5:45 pm

Pierce89 wrote:
adrianjordan wrote:
Pierce89 wrote: Then how can they call it an sf15t?
How can who call it that?
Gridlock specifically said that Ferrari rather than helping Haas build a better vf16, helped them build a better sf15t.
Ah...then he can say that because it's his opinion.
In 2007 I had the chance to go to a meet-and-greet with an F1 test driver. I decided not to as I didn't think he'd even amount to much...he was the BMW Sauber test driver and his name was Sebastian Vettel...