sAx wrote: ↑
Fri Nov 03, 2017 10:03 am
ringo wrote: ↑
Fri Nov 03, 2017 12:13 am
cplchanb wrote: ↑
Thu Nov 02, 2017 4:38 pm
i respectfully disagree with the statement omitting schumacher. theres a reason why he had the pole record until now. sure he had many poles in the dynasty era but many were also set in the darker years like 97-99 when other teams had better cars or at least as competitive. teammates wise apart from the tenure with prost and berger, most of the teammates were pretty subpar to him to begin with.
however when gauging greatness you cant just label someone legendary with bias towards their qualifying. its should be the entire package. schumi in undeniably legendary (good and bad ways) because not only was he the rainmaster and fast, he built a team around him from essentially losers to a dynasty. not to mention, qualifying during his strongest years were based on race fuel levels. alot of the poles that other drivers got during those years sacrificed their race performance. If you look at 2007/08 when hamilton had arguably the strongest cars of the field he didnt clean the poles because race fuel dictated alot of qualifying. likewise for senna. Im sure that if it was race fuel, alot of the magical poles wouldnt have happened.
just my 2 cents...
Hamilton = sportsmanship, qualifying pace, race craft, getting the most out of the car, rain master, mind games, etc.
A degree of racing intelligence should be recognised too. Witness run down to Eau Rouge at Spa under extreme pressure and having the capacity to reduce effect of slipstream by easing off the throttle on the rise to Raidillon. Never heard any of the greats claim that as a possibility!
Not to make this some kind of "Hamilton ga ga thread", but would like to add a few more bits about the intellectual part.
- Obviously, he came on the scene without having much 0f a chance in 2007, against a two time champion, but soon was rookie "to be champion".
- When PIRELLI came on scene in 2011 AND with a particular demand from FIA to manufacture fast degrading tyres, everyone said, it would be Jenson whose smooth style would suit the new rubber, the most. In spite of having a rubbish year, Hamilton still got as many wins as Jenson did, plus a pole (the only pole that went to a driver other than that of RB that year).
- When 2014 hybrid engines were unvieled, everyone said, THE INTELLIGENT Rosberg will have a march on Hamilton. On the contrary, it was Hamilton who used those engines in a far intelligent way. His fuel consumption ALWAYS used to be less than that of Rosberg's, in spite of being faster than Rosberg. His tyre utilization was also better than that of Rosberg.
- In 2014 Monza, while his engineer asked him to bide his time after the pit stop to go for a late attack on Rosberg, he decided to do it at the beginning of the stint, as he knew the rubber wouldn't last for a late push.
- In US GP this year, after the race, he explained how he realized that Vettel is going to give an opportunity for overtaking, as he observed that Vettel was attacking turn 9, which he thought was a bad idea and would kill the tyres, while he wasn't attacking turn 9. And it did turn out that way.
- Of course the point mentioned about SPA this year.
In many ways, with the kind of lifestyle he has led, he has given this impression to people that he is not such an intelligent driver, sort of "Gangsta" type and all that stuff. But the things that he does on track, proves otherwise. Those who were rated supposedly more intelligent, haven't managed to compete with him in crucial thought provoking situations. With his sheer speed and the fact that he has never done anything ECCENTRIC like the things that Senna and Michael have done, he definitely stands out. That's not to belittle Senna or Michael. Just a distinction.
I am of the strong opinion that, Michael would have had far far too many pole positions, if the qualifying wasn't being done on race load (which brought in a lot of variety and Ferrari always placed premium for race and let go of many poles). The fact that, most modern drivers have more poles than wins, shows how different approach is now, than it was in Michael's time. If it was like that of today, qualifying on fumes, I am sure Michael would have had a minimum of 100 poles.