2018 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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Nonserviam85
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Re: 2018 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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They probably encountered air flow attachment and diffuser sealing issues during braking, the high rake + longer wheelbase setup needs more refining

ripper
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Re: 2018 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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This is not clearly written in the article, but it should be like you said: more DF, more rake, but unstable.

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Vanja #66
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Re: 2018 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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http://en.f1i.com/news/298904-vettel-wa ... e-win.html

A nice short interview with Seb about the car handling issues they are facing right now.
And they call it a stall. A STALL!

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LM10
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Re: 2018 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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Vanja #66 wrote:
Fri Mar 30, 2018 11:12 am
http://en.f1i.com/news/298904-vettel-wa ... e-win.html

A nice short interview with Seb about the car handling issues they are facing right now.
In your opinion, what exactly are the problems they are facing right now with their car? Do you think they can solve them in the following couple of races or will it take longer?

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Vanja #66
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Re: 2018 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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Mercedes had some correlation problems last year, between track and CFD/wind tunnel. They had much more success from Spanish GP, with a big update package, but slow circuits were still a problem. I think this was set-up related, probably coming from car being over the weight limit early in the season (because of very long wheelbase), leading to lack of ballast to make a decent set up for every track which wasn't solved fully the whole year. I don't think Ferrari are facing such set up problems, only slight issue with diffuser (which they had a problem with last season as well, failing to update it until late in the year). Once that's settled, raising the rake should bring a lot of performance back - or so those articles say. :)
And they call it a stall. A STALL!

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#DwarvesAreNaturalSprinters
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Sevach
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Re: 2018 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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All through FP i thought the car understeered a lot (Vettel Q3 lap that seemed to be the case as well), some said this was a conscious choice because the back isn't what it should be.

The car also seemed more nervous on bumps and changes of direction than the other contenders, so perhaps some suspension work is needed.

ripper
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Re: 2018 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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Motorsport says that there's a new floor coming in Shanghai GP that should help with instability problems.

https://it.motorsport.com/f1/news/ferra ... a-1020402/

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Vanja #66
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Re: 2018 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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If they manage that in less than 3 races... wow.
And they call it a stall. A STALL!

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ripper
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Re: 2018 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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Well I guess they started working on it after Barcelona, as soon as they understood that there were problems.

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godlameroso
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Re: 2018 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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The version trialed in Melbourne is part of the package update for China, along with the new floor, there will be revised wheel winglets.
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MtthsMlw
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Re: 2018 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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I'm not sure if I understand correctly, are the 'channels' on the side of the gearbox a part of upgrades that should increase downforce at the rear or are they part of the instability problems because they are not working as expected?

LM10
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Re: 2018 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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Vanja #66 wrote:
Fri Mar 30, 2018 3:07 pm
Mercedes had some correlation problems last year, between track and CFD/wind tunnel. They had much more success from Spanish GP, with a big update package, but slow circuits were still a problem. I think this was set-up related, probably coming from car being over the weight limit early in the season (because of very long wheelbase), leading to lack of ballast to make a decent set up for every track which wasn't solved fully the whole year. I don't think Ferrari are facing such set up problems, only slight issue with diffuser (which they had a problem with last season as well, failing to update it until late in the year). Once that's settled, raising the rake should bring a lot of performance back - or so those articles say. :)
I see. Thank you for the answer.

I've watched a lap comparison of Vettel's qualification this year and last year. What I find interesting is that this year's lap seemed way smoother (just by looking at the steering wheel) besides them still struggling with the car. On the other hand, as we all know the SF70H was a quite smooth and driveable car from the beginning on, but in the video Vettel looked like he fought much more.
Does this mean that Vettel was on and even over the limit last year and this year not because he maybe lacks trust as he has told? Or the basis of this year's car might be good so it is that smooth on the track, but still not there where they want it to be?

Here it is: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rYn7eytgW8
Last edited by LM10 on Sat Mar 31, 2018 5:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Vanja #66
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Re: 2018 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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LM10 wrote:
Sat Mar 31, 2018 1:36 pm
I see. Thank you for the answer.

I've watched a lap comparison of Vettel's qualification this year and last year. What I find interesting is that this year's lap seemed way smoother (just by looking at the steering wheel) besides them still struggling with the car. On the other hand, as we all know the SF70H was a quite smooth and driveable car from the beginning on, but in the video Vettel looked like he fighted much more.
Does this mean that Vettel was on and even over the limit last year and this year not because he maybe lacks trust as he has told? Or the basis of this year's car might be good so it is that smooth on the track, but still not there where they want it to be?

Here it is: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5rYn7eytgW8
That's a very nice comparison video, thanks. :)

Now, I'm far, far from an expert in driving techniques, but from what I understand - Seb likes his cars with more under steer, so he can be aggressive on turn-in. This is especially of importance in high-speed corners, where high-rake cars experience some movement of CoP to the rear and bring up the level of under steer. So this lack of aggression in that video is very telling - in a way it shows us his lack of confidence in the car. This is what he says in an article I posted here as well.

Going back to the race, it was not surprising to see him struggle a bit more on softer tyres. Softer tyres, as far as I know, bring the car handling towards over steer, while harder tyres bring it towards under steer.
And they call it a stall. A STALL!

#Aerogimli
#DwarvesAreNaturalSprinters
#BlessYouLaddie

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godlameroso
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Re: 2018 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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Probably this year's car has more potential but is less confidence inspiring, whereas last year's car was more confidence inspiring. They just need to find the right sweetspot between driver confidence and downforce.
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LM10
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Re: 2018 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

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Vanja #66 wrote:
Sat Mar 31, 2018 4:53 pm

That's a very nice comparison video, thanks. :)

Now, I'm far, far from an expert in driving techniques, but from what I understand - Seb likes his cars with more under steer, so he can be aggressive on turn-in. This is especially of importance in high-speed corners, where high-rake cars experience some movement of CoP to the rear and bring up the level of under steer. So this lack of aggression in that video is very telling - in a way it shows us his lack of confidence in the car. This is what he says in an article I posted here as well.

Going back to the race, it was not surprising to see him struggle a bit more on softer tyres. Softer tyres, as far as I know, bring the car handling towards over steer, while harder tyres bring it towards under steer.
You're welcome!

Since I'm even much further away of being an expert than you I'm not sure I've fully understood what you've written, but I think I have. :)
So, you're telling that high-rake cars should normally suit the style of Vettel by generating more under steer? However, we don't see a confident Vettel yet, because Ferrari have not managed to come on top of things?
This also means that Ferrari kind of needs to choose a path they can develop on, right? Developing towards under steer or over steer and this way favor one driver. Even though they most probably and logically will choose the one which would unleash most of the performance and potential out of their car.

godlameroso wrote:
Sat Mar 31, 2018 5:52 pm
Probably this year's car has more potential but is less confidence inspiring, whereas last year's car was more confidence inspiring. They just need to find the right sweetspot between driver confidence and downforce.
I also think so.