2018 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

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Sieper
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Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2017 2:19 pm

Re: 2018 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by Sieper » Sun Mar 25, 2018 9:53 pm

Well, I do believe (like others) that this car is very close to the 2017 Ferrari, Dallara even made a very similar monoque and combined with the 2018 powerplant that is a strong car, for now (the in season development must now start, will Haas be able to make enough gains themselves to keep this position) they are the 4th team. They already clearly were 4th in the winter practice.

Without the “shithouse”😜 penalty Ricci would have been in front of them both at the start, as was Max. Now Max on his red tires still had a decent start, was quicker of the line then Vettel (marginally) but got shut by Vettel which just allowed k mag in front. Then a few rounds later Max damaged his diffusor and with that Any change to pass (If that even existed in the first place). Ricci was later in the race able to match the Ferrari pace and for now RBR was stuck, I do believe Haas does not have top three pace, but for now, Yes clearly 4th.

sosic2121
18
Joined: Wed Jun 08, 2016 11:14 am

Re: 2018 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by sosic2121 » Mon Mar 26, 2018 10:08 am

RZS10 wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 7:50 pm
cross threaded the nuts
OMG!

Sieper
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Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2017 2:19 pm

Re: 2018 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by Sieper » Mon Mar 26, 2018 10:15 am

Yeah, does that mean the left hand wrenches we're on the right hand side of the car? (because the thread on both sides differ so that the turn of the wheel makes the nuts get tighter instead of looser) Could it be something as simple as a mix up? But the other side was fine (and one time it was front and the other time rear wheel that got cross threaded).

In any case, it was a totally bizarre fluke. I cannot remember having seen anything like this before.

dren
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Re: 2018 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by dren » Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:40 am

The Ferrari B car grants the Ferrari A car the victory on a botched pit stop.
Honda!

santos
37
Joined: Thu Nov 06, 2014 3:48 pm

Re: 2018 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by santos » Mon Mar 26, 2018 12:49 pm

dren wrote:
Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:40 am
The Ferrari B car grants the Ferrari A car the victory on a botched pit stop.
Nop... it was some guy at Mercedes that is not very good at math.

digitalrurouni
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Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2016 5:50 pm

Re: 2018 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by digitalrurouni » Mon Mar 26, 2018 7:45 pm

Manoah2u wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 9:36 pm
Seriosuly surprised with Haas. where did that come from?! Didn't HAAS say the chassis is fully theirs (they look way too much like 17 Ferrari though)?

They were genuinly up front and on full own power keeping up and in front of even the RedBulls. Perfect for Ferrari offcourse, but wow!. They could have had a podium today.
How on Earth did that happen?!

And with all due respect both for Kevin and Romain, i wonder what more can be from the HAAS in the hands of 'premium' drivers.
I believe Gunther Steiner said the aero was theirs.

Raleigh
61
Joined: Tue Jul 29, 2014 2:36 pm

Re: 2018 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by Raleigh » Mon Mar 26, 2018 8:51 pm

None of the aero is by Haas, the car is designed and built in Italy by Dallara, who are very capable racing manufactures in their own right and while they may not have enjoyed much F1 success in the past Dallara are more than capable of cloning a Ferrari, especially when Ferrari are supplying all the parts and technical information as is legal.

There is of necessity an element of reverse engineering which means the Haas-run car lags behind the cutting edge of Ferrari design, but even if Dallara is trailing by 4-6 months that should still produce an upper-midfield car.

Edit: I suppose Haas can say the Dallara produced aero is theirs in a legal sense...

Sieper
69
Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2017 2:19 pm

Re: 2018 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by Sieper » Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:02 pm

Mmmmh, but Ferrari does not develop its 2017 car anymore, I heard they now focus on their 2018 car😜so dallara is now on their own to find optimizations for their chassis. Last year did this not prove all too succesfull, they started strong, faded away, had a short return (I believe when the engine received an HP update) and then faded away more.

Stalker1
37
Joined: Mon Dec 07, 2015 11:53 pm

Re: 2018 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by Stalker1 » Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:17 pm

I found an article from 2016;

https://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2016/01/ ... m-haas-f1/

It is said, that the PU, gearbox and suspension were from Ferrari, but other parts were produced separately, like:
* Monocoque
• Survival cell
• Front-impact structures
• Roll-over structures
• Bodywork – except airboxes, exhausts, and prescribed bodywork geometries
• Wings
• Floor
• Diffuser

During the first seasons of participation, Haas has been in the upper-midfield in the first races but later faded away as the lack or insufficient development speed compared to other teams starts to show. This is probably the inherit problem with the Haas approach - you can buy a car from other manufacturer but without investments into your infrastucture for car building and development you are going to lost out in the development race.

godlameroso
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Location: Miami FL

Re: 2018 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by godlameroso » Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:11 pm

Sieper wrote:
Mon Mar 26, 2018 10:15 am
Yeah, does that mean the left hand wrenches we're on the right hand side of the car? (because the thread on both sides differ so that the turn of the wheel makes the nuts get tighter instead of looser) Could it be something as simple as a mix up? But the other side was fine (and one time it was front and the other time rear wheel that got cross threaded).

In any case, it was a totally bizarre fluke. I cannot remember having seen anything like this before.
Crossthreading is when you install a fastener so it overlaps one or more threads on the part being fastened. Typically this ruins the threads and makes it so that you can't tighten a fastener all the way.
The height of cultivation is really nothing special. It is merely simplicity; the ability to express the utmost with the minimum. Mr.Lee

godlameroso
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Location: Miami FL

Re: 2018 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by godlameroso » Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:14 pm

digitalrurouni wrote:
Mon Mar 26, 2018 7:45 pm
Manoah2u wrote:
Sun Mar 25, 2018 9:36 pm
Seriosuly surprised with Haas. where did that come from?! Didn't HAAS say the chassis is fully theirs (they look way too much like 17 Ferrari though)?

They were genuinly up front and on full own power keeping up and in front of even the RedBulls. Perfect for Ferrari offcourse, but wow!. They could have had a podium today.
How on Earth did that happen?!

And with all due respect both for Kevin and Romain, i wonder what more can be from the HAAS in the hands of 'premium' drivers.
I believe Gunther Steiner said the aero was theirs.
Both Haas and Sauber have last year's Ferrari diffuser. But Haas has better less cluttered aero, so theirs work better, as the diffuser is fed by flow fields upstream.
The height of cultivation is really nothing special. It is merely simplicity; the ability to express the utmost with the minimum. Mr.Lee

godlameroso
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User avatar
Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 8:27 pm
Location: Miami FL

Re: 2018 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by godlameroso » Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:18 pm

Stalker1 wrote:
Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:17 pm
I found an article from 2016;

https://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2016/01/ ... m-haas-f1/

It is said, that the PU, gearbox and suspension were from Ferrari, but other parts were produced separately, like:
* Monocoque
• Survival cell
• Front-impact structures
• Roll-over structures
• Bodywork – except airboxes, exhausts, and prescribed bodywork geometries
• Wings
• Floor
• Diffuser

During the first seasons of participation, Haas has been in the upper-midfield in the first races but later faded away as the lack or insufficient development speed compared to other teams starts to show. This is probably the inherit problem with the Haas approach - you can buy a car from other manufacturer but without investments into your infrastucture for car building and development you are going to lost out in the development race.
Haas has historically switched to next year's car early. They don't develop the car all season but rather try to get a leg up on next year. This year since there are only small changes planned for next year, they can develop the car all year and carry over for the next.
The height of cultivation is really nothing special. It is merely simplicity; the ability to express the utmost with the minimum. Mr.Lee

Sieper
69
Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2017 2:19 pm

Re: 2018 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by Sieper » Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:43 pm

godlameroso wrote:
Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:11 pm
Sieper wrote:
Mon Mar 26, 2018 10:15 am
Yeah, does that mean the left hand wrenches we're on the right hand side of the car? (because the thread on both sides differ so that the turn of the wheel makes the nuts get tighter instead of looser) Could it be something as simple as a mix up? But the other side was fine (and one time it was front and the other time rear wheel that got cross threaded).

In any case, it was a totally bizarre fluke. I cannot remember having seen anything like this before.
Crossthreading is when you install a fastener so it overlaps one or more threads on the part being fastened. Typically this ruins the threads and makes it so that you can't tighten a fastener all the way.
thanks for that! So it was "simply" a matter of the gun maybe held at an too extreme angle when pressing the nut on the thread so it caught already the second shall we say loop of the thread (sorry not an english speaker) as well and ruined the whole thread as a consequence as these guns use enormous forces (and RPMs)?

digitalrurouni
19
Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2016 5:50 pm

Re: 2018 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by digitalrurouni » Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:49 pm

godlameroso wrote:
Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:14 pm
Both Haas and Sauber have last year's Ferrari diffuser. But Haas has better less cluttered aero, so theirs work better, as the diffuser is fed by flow fields upstream.
So then they pretty much have a clone of the Ferrari from last year sans the main chassis from Dallara?!

RonDennis
41
Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2017 11:56 pm

Re: 2018 Haas F1 Team - Ferrari

Post by RonDennis » Tue Mar 27, 2018 1:55 pm

It's just a copied Ferrari from last year with some modifications. Just a mather of time until they get picked up by Renault and McLaren. Haas is pretty clever guy, because they are doing are great job with a limited budget.