2019 Renault F1 Team

This forum contains threads to discuss teams themselves. Anything not technical about the cars, including restructuring, performances etc belongs here.
kptaylor
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

Post by kptaylor » Sun Apr 07, 2019 4:07 pm

I took "driveability" to mean the mapping of the engine and its controls. How/when you add electric power, how/when you use regen to recharge, how/when you split between recharge and power to the wheels, how you limit torque from the electric power, how/when you use the electric power to spin the turbo, spin the MGU units, etc. You can have over 1000 BHP but if you can't put it down consistently or can't put it down in the most efficient manner so your overall pace is best (subject to fuel constraints and the desire to be efficient), then its "driveability" is not good.

ispano6
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

Post by ispano6 » Sun Apr 07, 2019 6:19 pm

There is a correlation for Honda, his name is Yasuaki Asaki. And people from passenger powertrain departments are put into Formula projects all the time. Probably why they don't always have racy engines. But sometimes, it is to bring reliability to overly fragile racy engines. Not sure what Renault does with it's personnel but I imagine it's similar. You should not assume no correlation because that's simply not correct.

https://patents.justia.com/inventor/yasuaki-asaki

diffuser
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

Post by diffuser » Sun Apr 07, 2019 6:45 pm

ispano6 wrote:
Sun Apr 07, 2019 6:19 pm
There is a correlation for Honda, his name is Yasuaki Asaki. And people from passenger powertrain departments are put into Formula projects all the time. Probably why they don't always have racy engines. But sometimes, it is to bring reliability to overly fragile racy engines. Not sure what Renault does with it's personnel but I imagine it's similar. You should not assume no correlation because that's simply not correct.

https://patents.justia.com/inventor/yasuaki-asaki
Nope not what I said.

diffuser
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

Post by diffuser » Sun Apr 07, 2019 10:04 pm

diffuser wrote:
Sun Apr 07, 2019 6:45 pm
ispano6 wrote:
Sun Apr 07, 2019 6:19 pm
There is a correlation for Honda, his name is Yasuaki Asaki. And people from passenger powertrain departments are put into Formula projects all the time. Probably why they don't always have racy engines. But sometimes, it is to bring reliability to overly fragile racy engines. Not sure what Renault does with it's personnel but I imagine it's similar. You should not assume no correlation because that's simply not correct.

https://patents.justia.com/inventor/yasuaki-asaki
Nope not what I said.
No Correlation as in (not saying this is true, just an example): Just because the Honda PU in the NSX has more drive-ability than Mercedes EQ's PU doesn't mean that the Honda PU has more drive-ablility that the Merc F1 PU.

Different goals/expectations and different measurements. One is tested weekly by professionals that spend a large part of their day in the car or simulator in 21 different track layouts, the others by people that mostly take the car to work or journalists that can be persuaded by the $$$$.

rogazilla
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

Post by rogazilla » Mon Apr 08, 2019 9:23 pm

My example on production vehicle is simply trying to explain a simple EGR valve changed the engine character enough to change the torque curve. When they do the mapping on these engine, I assume the more anticipated part change or incremental update is easier to anticipate the characteristic of the engine and map it to fit a driver's feedback and also make the car drive-able.

When we saw Merc lapping none stop during testing the last few year, part is testing the reliability but the engineers are testing different settings and probably coming up with many map settings. How much time you are spending to understand a component versus how much time you can spend to test engine settings probably does compromise things. When you start putting old parts, new parts and things together on a PU, it probably makes little differences in the map and as sensitive as the drivers are to this car, it could be noticeable.

Sparky
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

Post by Sparky » Wed Apr 10, 2019 8:19 pm

Am i looking at the honda/renault PU thread or renault f1 team thread?
Wanted to know if there was any more info on the retirements last race but looking here ended me up in a honda nsx drivability discussion...

PowerandtheGlory
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

Post by PowerandtheGlory » Thu Apr 11, 2019 10:13 am

Let's get it back on track - Renault are due to bring ".......new bodywork, braking and suspension updates to China...." any body have any news on these parts on the cars yet?
“I don't believe in luck, luck is preparation and taking your opportunity” Ross Brawn

Capharol
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

Post by Capharol » Thu Apr 11, 2019 11:47 am

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/ricc ... ontent=www
Daniel Ricciardo reckons he and Renault have been trying to be "too clever" on Formula 1 weekends chasing the perfect set-up.
As part of a deep analysis done by the team after the Bahrain Grand Prix

Ricciardo not yet in tune with "different beast" Renault, Ricciardo says the outfit came to the conclusion that it has lost out by constantly seeking out improvements with its car rather than settling on a solid baseline.
and from what i have read they bring a new MGU-K (but that is more relevant in the other Renault-Topic)
Strive for continuous improvement, instead of perfection.

PowerandtheGlory
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

Post by PowerandtheGlory » Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:02 pm

Capharol wrote:
Thu Apr 11, 2019 11:47 am
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/ricc ... ontent=www
Daniel Ricciardo reckons he and Renault have been trying to be "too clever" on Formula 1 weekends chasing the perfect set-up.
As part of a deep analysis done by the team after the Bahrain Grand Prix

Ricciardo not yet in tune with "different beast" Renault, Ricciardo says the outfit came to the conclusion that it has lost out by constantly seeking out improvements with its car rather than settling on a solid baseline.
and from what i have read they bring a new MGU-K (but that is more relevant in the other Renault-Topic)
Do you know where it was reported that they have a new MGU-K?
“I don't believe in luck, luck is preparation and taking your opportunity” Ross Brawn

Capharol
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

Post by Capharol » Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:30 pm

PowerandtheGlory wrote:
Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:02 pm
Capharol wrote:
Thu Apr 11, 2019 11:47 am
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/ricc ... ontent=www
Daniel Ricciardo reckons he and Renault have been trying to be "too clever" on Formula 1 weekends chasing the perfect set-up.
As part of a deep analysis done by the team after the Bahrain Grand Prix

Ricciardo not yet in tune with "different beast" Renault, Ricciardo says the outfit came to the conclusion that it has lost out by constantly seeking out improvements with its car rather than settling on a solid baseline.
and from what i have read they bring a new MGU-K (but that is more relevant in the other Renault-Topic)
Do you know where it was reported that they have a new MGU-K?
not 100% sure, but i believe it was motorsport.com aswell but i can't find it anymore :evil:

Edit: found it on Racefans

https://www.racefans.net/2019/04/11/ren ... -problems/
All four Renault-powered drivers will use a new specification of MGU-K this weekend as the manufacturer works to solve the problems it has suffered since the beginning of the season.......

Nico Hulkenberg confirmed he will take a new power unit this weekend following his retirement from sixth place in Bahrain.

“We worked on reliability to get on top of the situation,” he said. “It’s a pity we lost a great result there but that’s gone.”

“For me it was a failure on the PU side,” Hulkenberg explained. “We had a problem there, that’s why I’m onto my second engine now.
Strive for continuous improvement, instead of perfection.

PowerandtheGlory
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Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2019 9:52 am

Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

Post by PowerandtheGlory » Thu Apr 11, 2019 2:06 pm

Capharol wrote:
Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:30 pm
PowerandtheGlory wrote:
Thu Apr 11, 2019 12:02 pm
Capharol wrote:
Thu Apr 11, 2019 11:47 am
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/ricc ... ontent=www



and from what i have read they bring a new MGU-K (but that is more relevant in the other Renault-Topic)
Do you know where it was reported that they have a new MGU-K?
not 100% sure, but i believe it was motorsport.com aswell but i can't find it anymore :evil:

Edit: found it on Racefans

https://www.racefans.net/2019/04/11/ren ... -problems/
All four Renault-powered drivers will use a new specification of MGU-K this weekend as the manufacturer works to solve the problems it has suffered since the beginning of the season.......

Nico Hulkenberg confirmed he will take a new power unit this weekend following his retirement from sixth place in Bahrain.

“We worked on reliability to get on top of the situation,” he said. “It’s a pity we lost a great result there but that’s gone.”

“For me it was a failure on the PU side,” Hulkenberg explained. “We had a problem there, that’s why I’m onto my second engine now.
Brilliant - thanks! i always forget to check Racefans!! :D
“I don't believe in luck, luck is preparation and taking your opportunity” Ross Brawn

PowerandtheGlory
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

Post by PowerandtheGlory » Fri Apr 12, 2019 12:03 pm

Fingers crossed on the reliability again this weekend, Hulk looks on-it again
“I don't believe in luck, luck is preparation and taking your opportunity” Ross Brawn

Jambier
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

Post by Jambier » Fri Apr 12, 2019 1:03 pm

It's a shame not to have be able to fix this before season.

So all car already reach their MGU K allocation for the year
HUL already on second engine.

If reliability is now here, it is not a big deal, but that will cost some points ultimately.
I've also read that if proven reliable they will unleash more power.

For now, the team seems to have a good pace in FP. But still a huge work to do on chassis to catch the top teams

Ground Effect
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

Post by Ground Effect » Fri Apr 12, 2019 7:12 pm

Jambier wrote:
Fri Apr 12, 2019 1:03 pm
It's a shame not to have be able to fix this before season.

So all car already reach their MGU K allocation for the year
HUL already on second engine.

If reliability is now here, it is not a big deal, but that will cost some points ultimately.
I've also read that if proven reliable they will unleash more power.

For now, the team seems to have a good pace in FP. But still a huge work to do on chassis to catch the top teams
It seems reliability is a bit of an issue for all, except Mercedes. Ferrari has shown a bit of a soft underbelly. They've changed CE for the works team and Haas, Honda have had to change Kvyat's unit today, though there's is a precaution and could still be used. If there's more power to unleash with these changes, then it may be worth it, depending on how much of course.
Q: (Stefano Mancini – La Stampa) Kimi, will you help Vettel to win his championship this year?
Kimi Raikkonen: I can only drive one car, obviously. 
@2018 Singapore Grand Prix drivers press conference.

Jambier
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Re: 2019 Renault F1 Team

Post by Jambier » Sat Apr 13, 2019 11:40 am

Good qualy knowing that it is their weak point

I hope to see them clear 4 force in race and really begin the season