2019 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Honda F1 Team

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diffuser
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Re: 2019 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Honda F1 Team

Post Wed Nov 20, 2019 11:28 pm

I think if you wanted to win the drivers and the Constructors. As of 2019 Ricciardo was a better choice.

Max is younger and may or may not get better time will tell. Is he a little faster than Ricciardo? Probably but right now Ricciardo will bring it home more consistently. In the constructor/Drivers , that is muy importante.

Just_a_fan
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Re: 2019 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Honda F1 Team

Post Thu Nov 21, 2019 12:50 am

Wass85 wrote:
Wed Nov 20, 2019 6:56 am
Oh come on, Verstappen outperformed Ricciardo in every metric last season.
Except he didn't, as already pointed out.
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"

Wass85
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Re: 2019 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Honda F1 Team

Post Thu Nov 21, 2019 6:52 am

Just_a_fan wrote:
Thu Nov 21, 2019 12:50 am
Wass85 wrote:
Wed Nov 20, 2019 6:56 am
Oh come on, Verstappen outperformed Ricciardo in every metric last season.
Except he didn't, as already pointed out.
Remind me what their championship position was again, that's all that counts isn't it?

Bill
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Re: 2019 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Honda F1 Team

Post Thu Nov 21, 2019 7:03 am

No that's not all that count if you are an objective observer.Riccardo had a lot of retirements last year

Wass85
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Re: 2019 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Honda F1 Team

Post Thu Nov 21, 2019 8:13 am

Bill wrote:
Thu Nov 21, 2019 7:03 am
No that's not all that count if you are an objective observer.Riccardo had a lot of retirements last year
Max did too, like I said earlier I bet Max was ahead of Dan more often than the other way around when their cars retired.

Just_a_fan
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Re: 2019 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Honda F1 Team

Post Thu Nov 21, 2019 10:14 am

Wass85 wrote:
Thu Nov 21, 2019 8:13 am
Bill wrote:
Thu Nov 21, 2019 7:03 am
No that's not all that count if you are an objective observer.Riccardo had a lot of retirements last year
Max did too, like I said earlier I bet Max was ahead of Dan more often than the other way around when their cars retired.
Ric had more than twice the number of retirements than Max. Ric also had a good number of races where he had grid penalties, started well down the grid, and still finished immediately behind Max. So he raced through the midfield and got up behind Max.
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"

dxpetrov
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Re: 2019 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Honda F1 Team

Post Thu Nov 21, 2019 11:56 am

Just_a_fan wrote:
Thu Nov 21, 2019 10:14 am
Wass85 wrote:
Thu Nov 21, 2019 8:13 am
Bill wrote:
Thu Nov 21, 2019 7:03 am
No that's not all that count if you are an objective observer.Riccardo had a lot of retirements last year
Max did too, like I said earlier I bet Max was ahead of Dan more often than the other way around when their cars retired.
Ric had more than twice the number of retirements than Max. Ric also had a good number of races where he had grid penalties, started well down the grid, and still finished immediately behind Max. So he raced through the midfield and got up behind Max.
Not really. Most retirements happened whilst he was behind Max.
He was nowhere in race trim compared to Max. Go and check race by race.

Wass85
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Re: 2019 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Honda F1 Team

Post Thu Nov 21, 2019 12:11 pm

dxpetrov wrote:
Thu Nov 21, 2019 11:56 am
Just_a_fan wrote:
Thu Nov 21, 2019 10:14 am
Wass85 wrote:
Thu Nov 21, 2019 8:13 am


Max did too, like I said earlier I bet Max was ahead of Dan more often than the other way around when their cars retired.
Ric had more than twice the number of retirements than Max. Ric also had a good number of races where he had grid penalties, started well down the grid, and still finished immediately behind Max. So he raced through the midfield and got up behind Max.
Not really. Most retirements happened whilst he was behind Max.
He was nowhere in race trim compared to Max. Go and check race by race.
Exactly my point, Max was the superior driver no doubt.

Wouter
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Re: 2019 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Honda F1 Team

Post Thu Nov 21, 2019 12:32 pm

Wass85 wrote:
Thu Nov 21, 2019 12:11 pm
dxpetrov wrote:
Thu Nov 21, 2019 11:56 am
Just_a_fan wrote:
Thu Nov 21, 2019 10:14 am
Ric had more than twice the number of retirements than Max. Ric also had a good number of races where he had grid penalties, started well down the grid, and still finished immediately behind Max. So he raced through the midfield and got up behind Max.
.
Not really. Most retirements happened whilst he was behind Max.
He was nowhere in race trim compared to Max. Go and check race by race.
.
Exactly my point, Max was the superior driver no doubt.
Absolutely.

Just_a_fan
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Re: 2019 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Honda F1 Team

Post Thu Nov 21, 2019 1:49 pm

dxpetrov wrote:
Thu Nov 21, 2019 11:56 am
Just_a_fan wrote:
Thu Nov 21, 2019 10:14 am
Wass85 wrote:
Thu Nov 21, 2019 8:13 am


Max did too, like I said earlier I bet Max was ahead of Dan more often than the other way around when their cars retired.
Ric had more than twice the number of retirements than Max. Ric also had a good number of races where he had grid penalties, started well down the grid, and still finished immediately behind Max. So he raced through the midfield and got up behind Max.
Not really. Most retirements happened whilst he was behind Max.
He was nowhere in race trim compared to Max. Go and check race by race.
I have done, thanks, which is why I said what I said. A lot of his problems occurred before/during qualifying - he had plenty of grid penalties that messed his weekend from the start. Even when starting from many places back, he often finished immediately behind Max. On a number of occasions in qualifying, the two were separated by only a few thousandths of a second meaning they were as good as each other.

It's notable how many retirements Ric had after Canada. Ric had 8 retirements in the season compared to Max's three - both had 2 before Canada. When his car held together, Ric always finished top 6, Max had a 9th and a 15th.

Ric had two poles where Max had none. Ric had pole at Monaco - a circuit that requires skill and commitment I'm sure you'll agree - whilst Max had crashed in FP3 and so couldn't run. Ric also had one of his retirements after getting pole. Max won that race. Afterwards, Ric said his car was cursed and couldn't see the point in doing the rest of the season. His team let him down and he basically gave up. Max got all the good support, Ric got none. Few drivers can thrive in that environment.

The reality is the Max did not blow Ric out of the water as some claim. They were very close when both cars held together.
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"

nzjrs
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Re: 2019 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Honda F1 Team

Post Thu Nov 21, 2019 1:51 pm

Great. Mod's elected not to stop this discussion, so now we have another full page on 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing.

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Marti_EF3
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Re: 2019 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Honda F1 Team

Post Thu Nov 21, 2019 2:13 pm

Returning to 2019...

Translated from a Spanish media
Red Bull is also under observation, according to Italian press.

The Federation investigates the fuel system for suspicions about Ferrari
It is unknown if the Red Bull is the third car from which the FIA ​​has seized parts
Red Bull is also under observation, according to Italian press

The Italian press points out that Ferrari is not the only team under investigation by the FIA, also Red Bull. Although from the transalpine country they do not make it clear if the British team was one of the groups to which the Federation seized pieces to investigate them, they say they are under observation.

"The power units of Ferrari and Alfa Romeo were controlled in Brazil, but also that of Red Bull," says the Italian newspaper La Gazzetta dello Sport, one of its news this week.

Yesterday Auto Motor und Sport reported that the FIA ​​has seized parts of the fuel system of a Ferrari, an Alfa Romeo and a third car that has nothing to do with Ferrari. Now from Italy they say that the Honda engine is also under investigation , although they do not openly state that the Federation has seized parts of the Red Bull to compare its fuel system with that of Ferrari and Alfa Romeo.


Those of Milton Keynes were just the team that complained about Ferrari following the suspicions that exist about the legality of its engine and therefore filed a formal complaint to the FIA .

The new Federation investigation is expected to conclude a technical directive that sets limits on the fuel flow system. It would be the third issue of the FIA ​​this month on the same topic, the prohibition of injecting coolant into the combustion chamber.

Red Bull has just won the Interlagos race, after being fast throughout Brazil's weekend. "Red Bull was too strong on the straight, it was difficult to stay ahead," Hamilton said Sunday after the Grand Prix.

Sebastian Vettel joked about the speed of the Red Bulls in Brazil , wanting to respond to the criticisms Max Verstappen had made about Ferrari. "It is suspicious that Red Bull is so fast in a straight line," the German commented ironically.

Will Red Bull be under observation to compare its system with that of Ferrari or for complaints from its rivals in Brazil?

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HPD
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Re: 2019 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Honda F1 Team

Post Thu Nov 21, 2019 2:39 pm

I think it's true. So that the image of Ferrari does not look so bad, they choose another team.
It seems fair, but they won't find anything wrong with the Honda.

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turbof1
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Re: 2019 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Honda F1 Team

Post Thu Nov 21, 2019 3:27 pm

nzjrs wrote:
Thu Nov 21, 2019 1:51 pm
Great. Mod's elected not to stop this discussion, so now we have another full page on 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing.
And I think that is as far as we will let it go. Looks guys, Ricciardo is not part of the 2019 lineup of Red Bull Racing. Getting a read on Verstappen's performance is nice, but not relevant once we involve 2018 performances (which are highly subjective at that; there are enoug arguments pro and contra to make that discussion go for another year). Please reserve this topic for all associated RBR 2019 team relevant discussions.
#AeroFrodo

ispano6
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Re: 2019 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Honda F1 Team

Post Thu Nov 21, 2019 4:27 pm

Albon and Verstappen for 2020 is going to be epic. It was important to identify the strongest driver to pair Max as Red Bull had already based their team around him years ago. We now know Alex Albon is that man. Having a driver of Asian heritage in a top team is pretty rare and special, especially given he earned his spot. I wouldn't have it any other way. Besides, we wouldn't want a driver who would leave Red Bull simply because he was afraid of their engines... Big mistake.