2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

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djones
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by djones » Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:27 pm

Bottas must feel like such a fool shouting and swearing about his win....

To then find the other Mercedes who was faster in FP and Q had a badly damaged car since lap 4.

Big Tea
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by Big Tea » Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:31 pm

djones wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:27 pm
Bottas must feel like such a fool shouting and swearing about his win....

To then find the other Mercedes who was faster in FP and Q had a badly damaged car since lap 4.
But he still has a 'W' on the board and points to match. :mrgreen:
One test is worth a thousand expert opinions

GPR -A
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by GPR -A » Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:32 pm

djones wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:27 pm
Bottas must feel like such a fool shouting and swearing about his win....

To then find the other Mercedes who was faster in FP and Q had a badly damaged car since lap 4.
I guess he deserves the right to celebrate it as he wishes. Such bad luck in Baku last year and a thoroughly deserved win forfeited in the interest of team in Russia, a win-less last season and heartless people criticizing his racing abilities, anyone would be exalted to be in his position on Sunday,vent out the anger and frustration and be relieved. Full marks for his performance and within his right to do what he did.

SmallSoldier
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2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by SmallSoldier » Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:33 pm

djones wrote:Bottas must feel like such a fool shouting and swearing about his win....

To then find the other Mercedes who was faster in FP and Q had a badly damaged car since lap 4.
Not at all, he shouted and cursed because he killed the other driver after the lights went on, managed his tires better than anyone else in the field, didn’t make any mistakes, won the race and got a cherry for his cake with the fastest lap in what was his 4th career win... Oh he is also leading a Championship for the first time in his career... I don’t think he feels like a fool, probably is still smiling...

Oh, and I have a feeling that he might have meant people like you in his “To Whom It May Concern...”


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Last edited by SmallSoldier on Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Quantum
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by Quantum » Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:35 pm

djones wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:27 pm
Bottas must feel like such a fool shouting and swearing about his win....

To then find the other Mercedes who was faster in FP and Q had a badly damaged car since lap 4.
Considering his poor luck in 2018, I'd be shouting from the rooftops just like Mr Bottas.
He left Hamilton for dead at the start too, and his floor was very much intact at this point.

Mattchu
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by Mattchu » Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:52 pm

SmallSoldier wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:33 pm
Oh, and I have a feeling that he might have meant people like you in his “To Whom It May Correspond...”
"To Whom It May Concern", not correspond...

I say fair play to the Finn, It`s good [imo] to see/hear outbursts like this, makes them more "human" and shows they care.

SmallSoldier
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by SmallSoldier » Mon Mar 18, 2019 7:04 pm

Mattchu wrote:
SmallSoldier wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:33 pm
Oh, and I have a feeling that he might have meant people like you in his “To Whom It May Correspond...”
"To Whom It May Concern", not correspond...

I say fair play to the Finn, It`s good [imo] to see/hear outbursts like this, makes them more "human" and shows they care.
Fixed!


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Brake Horse Power
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by Brake Horse Power » Tue Mar 19, 2019 8:58 pm

djones wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:27 pm
Bottas must feel like such a fool shouting and swearing about his win....

To then find the other Mercedes who was faster in FP and Q had a badly damaged car since lap 4.
Yeah extremely badly damaged, i think Hamilton even tought about retiring.. Come on he mist 2square centimeter of carbon fibre. All this talking about it by media feels a bit pathetic imo.

SmallSoldier
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by SmallSoldier » Tue Mar 19, 2019 11:26 pm

Brake Horse Power wrote:
djones wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:27 pm
Bottas must feel like such a fool shouting and swearing about his win....

To then find the other Mercedes who was faster in FP and Q had a badly damaged car since lap 4.
Yeah extremely badly damaged, i think Hamilton even tought about retiring.. Come on he mist 2square centimeter of carbon fibre. All this talking about it by media feels a bit pathetic imo.
The thing is that 2 square centimeters make a big impact on the car performance, it will affect balance left to right, as well as downforce (that particular piece is there to prevent rear tire squirt from having an effect on the diffuser)

It’s crazy that this cars are designed in a way that very small pieces can have a big effect on performance, but that doesn’t make it less true


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adrianjordan
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by adrianjordan » Wed Mar 20, 2019 12:27 am

djones wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:27 pm
Bottas must feel like such a fool shouting and swearing about his win....

To then find the other Mercedes who was faster in FP and Q had a badly damaged car since lap 4.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but there are 18 other cars in the field as well as Hamilton. He won a race without having to rely on anyone falling off the road in front of him and had been facing a lot of criticism. Fair play to him. Let him enjoy it while it lasts...
In 2007 I had the chance to go to a meet-and-greet with an F1 test driver. I decided not to as I didn't think he'd even amount to much...he was the BMW Sauber test driver and his name was Sebastian Vettel...

Brake Horse Power
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by Brake Horse Power » Wed Mar 20, 2019 1:37 am

SmallSoldier wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 11:26 pm
Brake Horse Power wrote:
djones wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:27 pm
Bottas must feel like such a fool shouting and swearing about his win....

To then find the other Mercedes who was faster in FP and Q had a badly damaged car since lap 4.
Yeah extremely badly damaged, i think Hamilton even tought about retiring.. Come on he mist 2square centimeter of carbon fibre. All this talking about it by media feels a bit pathetic imo.
The thing is that 2 square centimeters make a big impact on the car performance, it will affect balance left to right, as well as downforce (that particular piece is there to prevent rear tire squirt from having an effect on the diffuser)

It’s crazy that this cars are designed in a way that very small pieces can have a big effect on performance, but that doesn’t make it less true


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I am no aero expert but I can't believe it has that much of an impact. He says his laptimes dropped after lap 4, well all the top 4 laptimes dropped after lap 4. See link. His dropped a bit further but it could have been to save tires who knows. He was just screwed for p1 that Merc wanted to counter Vettel by pitting Hamilton so early. It is not very strange that Bottas was a lot quicker, simply because his tyre strategy was better. Likewise for Verstappen.

https://www.racefans.net/2019/03/17/201 ... and-tyres/

zibby43
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by zibby43 » Wed Mar 20, 2019 6:24 am

Brake Horse Power wrote:
Wed Mar 20, 2019 1:37 am
SmallSoldier wrote:
Tue Mar 19, 2019 11:26 pm
Brake Horse Power wrote:
Yeah extremely badly damaged, i think Hamilton even tought about retiring.. Come on he mist 2square centimeter of carbon fibre. All this talking about it by media feels a bit pathetic imo.
The thing is that 2 square centimeters make a big impact on the car performance, it will affect balance left to right, as well as downforce (that particular piece is there to prevent rear tire squirt from having an effect on the diffuser)

It’s crazy that this cars are designed in a way that very small pieces can have a big effect on performance, but that doesn’t make it less true


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I am no aero expert but I can't believe it has that much of an impact.
It's not the size of the damage that's most consequential here. It's the particular area of the floor that was damaged.

That part of the floor is designed to prevent tire squirt, a phenomenon involving rear tire deformation in which air spills laterally into the diffuser (one of the most important/powerful downforce-producing areas on the entire car). That piece of the floor performed a sealing effect, and that sealing effect was pretty much lost entirely when the component broke off.

So, not only did the damage massively interfere with the car's overall downforce levels, but because the damage was only on one side of the car, it completely threw off the aerodynamic balance and stability of the rear end of the car.

This has a further knock-on effect in terms of tire degradation.

This is a pretty basic explanation. Whenever you're dealing with damage on this generation of F1 cars (which are more sensitive to damage, in general), the important question is oftentimes not how "big" the damage is, but what area of the car is damaged.

In sum, the damage had a substantial impact on the car's pace, balance, etc.

Schuttelberg
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by Schuttelberg » Wed Mar 20, 2019 6:58 am

djones wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:27 pm
Bottas must feel like such a fool shouting and swearing about his win....

To then find the other Mercedes who was faster in FP and Q had a badly damaged car since lap 4.
As far as I saw, Lewis didn't have one off in the race. Secondly, Mercedes has a history of fabricating stories to protect their drivers. I think it was in 2016 Austria, where Rosberg completely forgot how to turn right and we were made to believe it was a brake failure or something which had nothing to do with the steering wheel? This seems more of the same to me where they're just protecting the speed diff to Valtteri. Lewis did a lap one tenth shy off Bottas' fastest lap with 15+ laps older tyres.

I don't read much into one start. Lewis basically would have bossed the weekend but with the whole track layout and everything in f1 being how it is, once Lap 1 concluded, the race was pretty much over. Lewis tends to behave like an over petulant child when things don't go his way and I think he was just done with it after the start. I think Lewis was definitely the better Merc driver over the weekend and it was just the start that got Bottas the win. Over a season, I expect balance to restore itself unless Mercedes give Lewis 2016 reliability. If he's in top form like 2017 and 2018 second half, even that might not be enough for Bottas.
"Sebastian there's very, you're a member of a very select few.. Stewart, Lauda, Piquet, Senna, Prost, Schumacher, Fangio.. VETTEL!"

zibby43
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by zibby43 » Wed Mar 20, 2019 7:40 am

Schuttelberg wrote:
Wed Mar 20, 2019 6:58 am
djones wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 5:27 pm
Bottas must feel like such a fool shouting and swearing about his win....

To then find the other Mercedes who was faster in FP and Q had a badly damaged car since lap 4.
Lewis tends to behave like an over petulant child when things don't go his way and I think he was just done with it after the start.
Respectfully, I couldn't disagree more with this statement. He's competitive, like any other successful driver in the sport.

I like Vettel, but when I think of petulance, I think of his outburst on the radio at Charlie Whiting and ramming into Lewis in Baku.



And after this race, Lewis was very quick to say Bottas deserved the win and played down the very real damage to the rear section of the floor, which is well documented by pretty much every reputable F1 journalist in the paddock at this point. Hamilton said Bottas won at the start.

It seems that those who are trying to disregard the reality of the floor damage (there are photos of the piece missing, photos of the team trying to cure that part of the floor pre-race, etc.) can't see past an irrational hatred for Lewis, which is their prerogative. To me, it's like denying the moon landing happened. :lol:

And virtually no one has said that the damage was the primary difference in the outcome of the race. On the contrary, it only partially explained the size of the gap.

Morteza
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by Morteza » Wed Mar 20, 2019 7:05 pm

That intro though :lol:
"A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool."~William Shakespeare