2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

This forum contains threads to discuss teams themselves. Anything not technical about the cars, including restructuring, performances etc belongs here.
M840TR
366
Joined: Fri Apr 13, 2018 8:04 pm

Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by M840TR » Fri Oct 18, 2019 1:22 pm

search wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:26 pm
_cerber1 wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:03 pm
Ground Effect wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 11:48 am

Maybe he was using one from earlier in the season for the Suzuka weekend that was still in the pool, not the one taken in Spa?
Then it was very risky.
electrical energy is more important in Mexico (and allegedly it was one of the key factors which let to the win last year), so maybe they were saving some parts
Interesting. Could you elaborate on this?

diffuser
168
User avatar
Joined: Fri Sep 07, 2012 12:55 pm
Location: Montreal

Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by diffuser » Fri Oct 18, 2019 1:56 pm

M840TR wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 1:22 pm
search wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:26 pm
_cerber1 wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:03 pm


Then it was very risky.
electrical energy is more important in Mexico (and allegedly it was one of the key factors which let to the win last year), so maybe they were saving some parts
Interesting. Could you elaborate on this?

Yeah, I don't get that. the Mexico track is 1.5kms shorter than japan. A full charge of the battery before a quali lap will be fairly easy to make it to the end.

Although, cause of the alititude, the turbo will be harder to spin up.

M840TR
366
Joined: Fri Apr 13, 2018 8:04 pm

Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by M840TR » Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:14 pm

diffuser wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 1:56 pm
M840TR wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 1:22 pm
search wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:26 pm

electrical energy is more important in Mexico (and allegedly it was one of the key factors which let to the win last year), so maybe they were saving some parts
Interesting. Could you elaborate on this?

Yeah, I don't get that. the Mexico track is 1.5kms shorter than japan. A full charge of the battery before a quali lap will be fairly easy to make it to the end.

Although, cause of the alititude, the turbo will be harder to spin up.
What confuses me is how the engine with consistently one of the worst ERS tech of the v6 era contributed to Redbull's win by virtue of its greatest shortcoming. Ferrari & Mercedes were & remain light-years ahead of Renault in this area, even with the lower turbine rpm. And let's not forget Renault was using its 2016 Mgu-k well into 2018.

_cerber1
90
User avatar
Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2019 8:50 pm

Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by _cerber1 » Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:26 pm

The deal with Petrobras is terminated.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/mcla ... l/4559766/

ScottR267
0
Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2018 9:27 pm

Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by ScottR267 » Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:29 pm

_cerber1 wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:26 pm
The deal with Petrobras is terminated.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/mcla ... l/4559766/
Not confirmed but it looks to be heading that way. Surely means the reserve driver Camara will also be released as was he not part of the sponsorship deal?

My guess is will stick with BP/Castrol for the last year of the Renault partnership and then to Petronas for the Mercedes engine.

I have no doubts Zak will find new sponsors to fill the gap monetary wise, especially as he’s done very well at picking up new sponsors whilst in down years

RonDennis
41
Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2017 11:56 pm

Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by RonDennis » Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:31 pm

ScottR267 wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:29 pm
_cerber1 wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:26 pm
The deal with Petrobras is terminated.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/mcla ... l/4559766/
Not confirmed but it looks to be heading that way. Surely means the reserve driver Camara will also be released as was he not part of the sponsorship deal?

My guess is will stick with BP/Castrol for the last year of the Renault partnership and then to Petronas for the Mercedes engine.

I have no doubts Zak will find new sponsors to fill the gap monetary wise, especially as he’s done very well at picking up new sponsors whilst in down years
Well, it's not like the Brazilian government doesn't have to pay anything for getting out early. That's why it took this long to terminate the contract. McLaren has been using BP/Castrol during this whole time.
Last edited by RonDennis on Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

diffuser
168
User avatar
Joined: Fri Sep 07, 2012 12:55 pm
Location: Montreal

Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by diffuser » Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:31 pm

M840TR wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:14 pm
diffuser wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 1:56 pm
M840TR wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 1:22 pm


Interesting. Could you elaborate on this?

Yeah, I don't get that. the Mexico track is 1.5kms shorter than japan. A full charge of the battery before a quali lap will be fairly easy to make it to the end.

Although, cause of the alititude, the turbo will be harder to spin up.
What confuses me is how the engine with consistently one of the worst ERS tech of the v6 era contributed to Redbull's win by virtue of its greatest shortcoming. Ferrari & Mercedes were & remain light-years ahead of Renault in this area, even with the lower turbine rpm. And let's not forget Renault was using its 2016 Mgu-k well into 2018.

I'm not even sure any of that is true, I haven't see a good comparison done by anyone that I would trust. Realy to compare the ERS between all cars you'd have to follow the cars around at each track and see how much of thier time they spend flashing red. I've never done that. Also deploying isn' a ON off thing, it can be varied. So you'd might deploy more if you running higher DF levels....I'm not even sure that would give you perfect picture.

With regards to Mexico, I think that whatever Renault are doing is allowing them to acheive higher spin with thier turbo. That in turn is letting them acheive higher boost and higher electrical genration.

ScottR267
0
Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2018 9:27 pm

Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by ScottR267 » Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:46 pm

RonDennis wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:31 pm
ScottR267 wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:29 pm
_cerber1 wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:26 pm
The deal with Petrobras is terminated.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/mcla ... l/4559766/
Not confirmed but it looks to be heading that way. Surely means the reserve driver Camara will also be released as was he not part of the sponsorship deal?

My guess is will stick with BP/Castrol for the last year of the Renault partnership and then to Petronas for the Mercedes engine.

I have no doubts Zak will find new sponsors to fill the gap monetary wise, especially as he’s done very well at picking up new sponsors whilst in down years
Well, it's not like the Brazilian government doesn't have to pay anything for getting out early. That's why it took this long to terminate the contract. McLaren has been using BP/Castrol during this whole time.
I understand that the Brazilian government will have to pay something to terminate the contract however it’s not going to be the full sum of the contract is is!! I thought they used BP/Castrol fuel but Petrobras lubricants....

search
5
Joined: Sat Jul 19, 2014 8:20 pm

Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by search » Fri Oct 18, 2019 3:20 pm

diffuser wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 1:56 pm
M840TR wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 1:22 pm
search wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 12:26 pm

electrical energy is more important in Mexico (and allegedly it was one of the key factors which let to the win last year), so maybe they were saving some parts
Interesting. Could you elaborate on this?

Yeah, I don't get that. the Mexico track is 1.5kms shorter than japan. A full charge of the battery before a quali lap will be fairly easy to make it to the end.

Although, cause of the alititude, the turbo will be harder to spin up.
I couldn't find the source I was thinking of, but this article on formula1.com for example mentions it:

"Renault’s turbochargers remain smaller than those used by Mercedes and Ferrari and it’s quite feasible that their burst point is correspondingly higher. If their smaller turbos are capable of running faster before their burst point, it would allow the turbo to compensate more for the lower oxygen content, thereby overcoming its power shortfall at lower altitudes.

It may also be – as some have conjectured – that the Renault power unit generates electrical energy more efficiently than the others and that this is revealed more as the internal combustion engine’s contribution is reduced by the thinner air."

Nonserviam85
10
Joined: Fri May 17, 2013 10:21 am

Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by Nonserviam85 » Fri Oct 18, 2019 3:22 pm

I suspect Renault have a smaller or more robust turbine so they can either keep (or increase their revs) in contrast to Mercedes and Ferrari who might me closer to the limit and suffer more in the thin air of Mexico.

M840TR
366
Joined: Fri Apr 13, 2018 8:04 pm

Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by M840TR » Fri Oct 18, 2019 3:23 pm

diffuser wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:31 pm
M840TR wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 2:14 pm
diffuser wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 1:56 pm



Yeah, I don't get that. the Mexico track is 1.5kms shorter than japan. A full charge of the battery before a quali lap will be fairly easy to make it to the end.

Although, cause of the alititude, the turbo will be harder to spin up.
What confuses me is how the engine with consistently one of the worst ERS tech of the v6 era contributed to Redbull's win by virtue of its greatest shortcoming. Ferrari & Mercedes were & remain light-years ahead of Renault in this area, even with the lower turbine rpm. And let's not forget Renault was using its 2016 Mgu-k well into 2018.

I'm not even sure any of that is true, I haven't see a good comparison done by anyone that I would trust. Realy to compare the ERS between all cars you'd have to follow the cars around at each track and see how much of thier time they spend flashing red. I've never done that. Also deploying isn' a ON off thing, it can be varied. So you'd might deploy more if you running higher DF levels....I'm not even sure that would give you perfect picture.

With regards to Mexico, I think that whatever Renault are doing is allowing them to acheive higher spin with thier turbo. That in turn is letting them acheive higher boost and higher electrical genration.
We have to consider the wider context. AMuS reported several times that Ferrari is able to run the K much longer hence their advantage on the end of a straight compared to others; that's where their pace advantage lied. We know Renault has had problems with the ERS throughout the hybrid era. They ran the same mgu-k for nearly 3 years! It's safe to assume this their Achilles' heel.

M840TR
366
Joined: Fri Apr 13, 2018 8:04 pm

Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by M840TR » Fri Oct 18, 2019 3:28 pm

Nonserviam85 wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 3:22 pm
I suspect Renault have a smaller or more robust turbine so they can either keep (or increase their revs) in contrast to Mercedes and Ferrari who might me closer to the limit and suffer more in the thin air of Mexico.
They've had the worst turbo reliability of the 3 over the years. Even this year they've had multiple reliability problems with the turbo. I reckon it has to do with others suffering more due to normally utilizing the mgu-h on a higher level than Renault.

RonDennis
41
Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2017 11:56 pm

Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by RonDennis » Fri Oct 18, 2019 7:01 pm

I wouldn't be surprised if Orlen will join McLaren with Kubica in a test/simulator role. They already had talks, but McLaren didn't have any place at that moment.
Last edited by RonDennis on Fri Oct 18, 2019 7:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

proteus
50
User avatar
Joined: Fri Feb 13, 2015 1:35 pm

Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by proteus » Fri Oct 18, 2019 7:02 pm

RonDennis wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 7:01 pm
I wouldn't be surprised if Orlen will join McLaren with Kubica in a test/simulator role. They already had talks, but McLaren didn't have any place at the moment.
Haas is aparently the no.1 choice for Orlen.
If i would get the money to start my own F1 team, i would revive Arrows

RonDennis
41
Joined: Mon Oct 23, 2017 11:56 pm

Re: 2019 Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by RonDennis » Fri Oct 18, 2019 7:04 pm

proteus wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 7:02 pm
RonDennis wrote:
Fri Oct 18, 2019 7:01 pm
I wouldn't be surprised if Orlen will join McLaren with Kubica in a test/simulator role. They already had talks, but McLaren didn't have any place at the moment.
Haas is aparently the no.1 choice for Orlen.
I hope Orlen will rather sponsor McLaren. According to the Polish media McLaren told Orlen that they didn't have any place for them at that time.

https://sport.onet.pl/formula-1/orlen-w ... ha/cbezc46