[ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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FittingMechanics
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Joined: 19 Feb 2019, 12:10

Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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mwillems wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 10:12
djos wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 08:11
Don't get me wrong, I think Max is a superstar but, Daniel can be just as fast or faster and the history of them together backs that up.
Yeah I get what you're saying, I think the history backs that up, but the history is nearly 2 years old and I think it has changed since then in Max's favour. I don't like Max particularly in terms of how he comes across, but I do think he has developed a lot since Ricciardo left.
I think that Max mostly improved on staying calm and not losing points due to being too aggressive. I don't think he became much faster as a racing driver, only more championship capable as he understands that to win a championship you need to pick your battles. It's not like Ricciardo left and then in the off season Verstappen became half a second faster.

Balalu
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Joined: 14 Feb 2020, 23:58

Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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I believe Ricardo has also improved. He seems to have matured his race-craft in particular when it comes to the bigger picture, the long-game.

I dont like "ifs" and "would haves". Hopefully McLaren can close up to Red Bull soon, and then we can see.
Last edited by Balalu on 04 Aug 2020, 16:04, edited 1 time in total.
"I showed him [with my hands] and said: I have bigger balls!” - Mika Hakkinen

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mwillems
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Joined: 04 Sep 2016, 22:11

Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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FittingMechanics wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 12:06
mwillems wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 10:12
djos wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 08:11
Don't get me wrong, I think Max is a superstar but, Daniel can be just as fast or faster and the history of them together backs that up.
Yeah I get what you're saying, I think the history backs that up, but the history is nearly 2 years old and I think it has changed since then in Max's favour. I don't like Max particularly in terms of how he comes across, but I do think he has developed a lot since Ricciardo left.
I think that Max mostly improved on staying calm and not losing points due to being too aggressive. I don't think he became much faster as a racing driver, only more championship capable as he understands that to win a championship you need to pick your battles. It's not like Ricciardo left and then in the off season Verstappen became half a second faster.
haha yes I don't think he is a half second faster, but I do think he has gained speed and as you say, that maturity. It is just an opinion and you'd need to put them in the same car again, but I feel still that Ric is a step behind Max now. That may be entirely wrong of course.
Give a man a fire, and he will be warm for a night.
Set a man on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life.

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Big Tea
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Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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mwillems wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 13:53
FittingMechanics wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 12:06
mwillems wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 10:12


Yeah I get what you're saying, I think the history backs that up, but the history is nearly 2 years old and I think it has changed since then in Max's favour. I don't like Max particularly in terms of how he comes across, but I do think he has developed a lot since Ricciardo left.
I think that Max mostly improved on staying calm and not losing points due to being too aggressive. I don't think he became much faster as a racing driver, only more championship capable as he understands that to win a championship you need to pick your battles. It's not like Ricciardo left and then in the off season Verstappen became half a second faster.
haha yes I don't think he is a half second faster, but I do think he has gained speed and as you say, that maturity. It is just an opinion and you'd need to put them in the same car again, but I feel still that Ric is a step behind Max now. That may be entirely wrong of course.
And 'politically educated' in relation to his early days. He could handle a partner better now
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.

kfrantzios
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Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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Big Tea wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 14:07
mwillems wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 13:53
FittingMechanics wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 12:06


I think that Max mostly improved on staying calm and not losing points due to being too aggressive. I don't think he became much faster as a racing driver, only more championship capable as he understands that to win a championship you need to pick your battles. It's not like Ricciardo left and then in the off season Verstappen became half a second faster.
haha yes I don't think he is a half second faster, but I do think he has gained speed and as you say, that maturity. It is just an opinion and you'd need to put them in the same car again, but I feel still that Ric is a step behind Max now. That may be entirely wrong of course.
And 'politically educated' in relation to his early days. He could handle a partner better now
I guess that is because he doesnt have a competitive teammate, plus Ric, is driving a slower car so there is no real comparison that can be made. Unless we take a look the data teams have 8)

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mwillems
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Joined: 04 Sep 2016, 22:11

Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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Big Tea wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 14:07
mwillems wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 13:53
FittingMechanics wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 12:06


I think that Max mostly improved on staying calm and not losing points due to being too aggressive. I don't think he became much faster as a racing driver, only more championship capable as he understands that to win a championship you need to pick your battles. It's not like Ricciardo left and then in the off season Verstappen became half a second faster.
haha yes I don't think he is a half second faster, but I do think he has gained speed and as you say, that maturity. It is just an opinion and you'd need to put them in the same car again, but I feel still that Ric is a step behind Max now. That may be entirely wrong of course.
And 'politically educated' in relation to his early days. He could handle a partner better now
I think he might have just done a quick online course called "keep your mouth shut" as he's still blunt as a hammer!

You're probably right I think though, he's a bit more savvy.
Give a man a fire, and he will be warm for a night.
Set a man on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life.

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diffuser
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Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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djos wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 08:11
Don't get me wrong, I think Max is a superstar but, Daniel can be just as fast or faster and the history of them together backs that up.
I think the only thing you could ever complain about with regards to Max is his history of not keeping his nose clean. Too many risky moves(contact) for a top 3 team. While Ric did keep his nose clean....well, now he's not in a top 3 team. So I think there are now expectations of taking bigger risks.

ALO_Power
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Joined: 22 Feb 2016, 21:53

Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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If that's any accurate then we can expect a decent gain in 2021 with 37hp extra:
Image

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djos
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Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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ALO_Power wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 20:11
If that's any accurate then we can expect a decent gain in 2021 with 37hp extra:
https://i.imgur.com/hklGLPt.jpg
Now that will be awesome!

Honestly, I think with the quality of the Mclaren chassis, combined with the Merc PU, Daniel and Lando will be fighting for podiums on a regular basis next year.
"In downforce we trust"

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Blackout
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Joined: 09 Feb 2010, 04:12

Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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ALO_Power wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 20:11
If that's any accurate then we can expect a decent gain in 2021 with 37hp extra:
https://i.imgur.com/hklGLPt.jpg
Those "phonometric" analysis are BS. Nugnes isnt reliable in this regard. The AMuS numbers are more credible and AMuS is more reliable : )

genarro
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Joined: 15 May 2019, 10:22

Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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Blackout wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 23:16
ALO_Power wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 20:11
If that's any accurate then we can expect a decent gain in 2021 with 37hp extra:
https://i.imgur.com/hklGLPt.jpg
Those "phonometric" analysis are BS. Nugnes isnt reliable in this regard. The AMuS numbers are more credible and AMuS is more reliable : )
Do you have their numbers?

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McG
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Joined: 16 Feb 2011, 17:45

Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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mwillems wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 10:12
djos wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 08:11
Don't get me wrong, I think Max is a superstar but, Daniel can be just as fast or faster and the history of them together backs that up.
Yeah I get what you're saying, I think the history backs that up, but the history is nearly 2 years old and I think it has changed since then in Max's favour. I don't like Max particularly in terms of how he comes across, but I do think he has developed a lot since Ricciardo left.
You're just kind of making stuff up when there are actual facts available. Not good.
F1 is dead.

selvam_e2002
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Joined: 22 Oct 2018, 10:52

Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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I need to see RB crying with Honda when Meclaren beat them next year

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Blackout
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Joined: 09 Feb 2010, 04:12

Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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genarro wrote:
05 Aug 2020, 05:12
Blackout wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 23:16
ALO_Power wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 20:11
If that's any accurate then we can expect a decent gain in 2021 with 37hp extra:
https://i.imgur.com/hklGLPt.jpg
Those "phonometric" analysis are BS. Nugnes isnt reliable in this regard. The AMuS numbers are more credible and AMuS is more reliable : )
Do you have their numbers?
Their numbers are in line/close with other serious estimations. (around 25hp between the Merc and the Renault in Q in the 3 first gp, Honda close behind Renault, Ferrari 50hp behind Merc) RB too agrees with these Qualy numbers.
https://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/for ... i-schwach/

Frank Nugnes was already wrong with his phonometric analysis many times last year.

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mwillems
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Joined: 04 Sep 2016, 22:11

Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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McG wrote:
05 Aug 2020, 05:58
mwillems wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 10:12
djos wrote:
04 Aug 2020, 08:11
Don't get me wrong, I think Max is a superstar but, Daniel can be just as fast or faster and the history of them together backs that up.
Yeah I get what you're saying, I think the history backs that up, but the history is nearly 2 years old and I think it has changed since then in Max's favour. I don't like Max particularly in terms of how he comes across, but I do think he has developed a lot since Ricciardo left.
You're just kind of making stuff up when there are actual facts available. Not good.
No I'm saying the facts are out of date, and my opinion is that Max has improved, which is fine.

You might want to try and argue against that, but I think you'll find it a perfectly valid method of discussion around the world. I think the difficulties only begin when people present opinion as fact, which I'm not.
Give a man a fire, and he will be warm for a night.
Set a man on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life.

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