[ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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M840TR
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Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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diffuser wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 09:19
Chicane wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 07:44
Mercedes has two customers already and one thing they are very good at it is fixing the issues on an urgent basis. The PU will make yet another step next season as Mercedes continue to adapt their PU to operate on a single ICE mode.

For McLaren they have had experience with every type of PU layout since the introduction of this engine formula. McLaren complete a full circle going from Mercedes to Honda to Renault and now back to Mercedes . The integration should go smoothly by and large barring a few niggling issues.

McLaren will gain aerodynamically at the rear with a more compactly packaged Mercedes PU. The weight distribution will be better with a split turbo layout and the cooling demands of the Mercedes PU are modest compared to the Renault.

McLaren are trying to understand the impact of 2021 nose downstream and all this pain that they are going through now will be worth it. Without any Friday running and back to back comparison you cannot t extract the maximum potential of the aero package. I think by the end of the season McLaren will have a solid understanding of the new aero bits.
I like the positive outlook, but there are limited resources. Those resources are being stretch even further in 2021. The odds are against them not having more that just nagging issues. In fact I'm pretty sure they're going ahead with PU change in 2021 because their real goal is to be ready for 2022 and those aero changes. They're expecting issues.

By looking at the rear of the Merc, they have a wider car. Merc have had cooling problems at hot races in recent years so not sure about that. I don't know about the difference in the cooling requirements.

Renault have a big PU change to split turbo coming. That too will likely come with many issues. So they'll be saving themselves that.
I seriously doubt this. What's the source?

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diffuser
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Location: Montreal

Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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M840TR wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 12:03
diffuser wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 09:19
Chicane wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 07:44
Mercedes has two customers already and one thing they are very good at it is fixing the issues on an urgent basis. The PU will make yet another step next season as Mercedes continue to adapt their PU to operate on a single ICE mode.

For McLaren they have had experience with every type of PU layout since the introduction of this engine formula. McLaren complete a full circle going from Mercedes to Honda to Renault and now back to Mercedes . The integration should go smoothly by and large barring a few niggling issues.

McLaren will gain aerodynamically at the rear with a more compactly packaged Mercedes PU. The weight distribution will be better with a split turbo layout and the cooling demands of the Mercedes PU are modest compared to the Renault.

McLaren are trying to understand the impact of 2021 nose downstream and all this pain that they are going through now will be worth it. Without any Friday running and back to back comparison you cannot t extract the maximum potential of the aero package. I think by the end of the season McLaren will have a solid understanding of the new aero bits.
I like the positive outlook, but there are limited resources. Those resources are being stretch even further in 2021. The odds are against them not having more that just nagging issues. In fact I'm pretty sure they're going ahead with PU change in 2021 because their real goal is to be ready for 2022 and those aero changes. They're expecting issues.

By looking at the rear of the Merc, they have a wider car. Merc have had cooling problems at hot races in recent years so not sure about that. I don't know about the difference in the cooling requirements.

Renault have a big PU change to split turbo coming. That too will likely come with many issues. So they'll be saving themselves that.
I seriously doubt this. What's the source?
Pictures on Renault PU thread.

M840TR
M840TR
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Joined: 13 Apr 2018, 21:04

Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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diffuser wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 12:21
M840TR wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 12:03
diffuser wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 09:19


I like the positive outlook, but there are limited resources. Those resources are being stretch even further in 2021. The odds are against them not having more that just nagging issues. In fact I'm pretty sure they're going ahead with PU change in 2021 because their real goal is to be ready for 2022 and those aero changes. They're expecting issues.

By looking at the rear of the Merc, they have a wider car. Merc have had cooling problems at hot races in recent years so not sure about that. I don't know about the difference in the cooling requirements.

Renault have a big PU change to split turbo coming. That too will likely come with many issues. So they'll be saving themselves that.
I seriously doubt this. What's the source?
Pictures on Renault PU thread.
They're speculating on cooling layout changes, not turbo or engine design.

tangodjango
tangodjango
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Joined: 14 Mar 2020, 23:38

Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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M840TR wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 12:33
diffuser wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 12:21
M840TR wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 12:03


I seriously doubt this. What's the source?
Pictures on Renault PU thread.
They're speculating on cooling layout changes, not turbo or engine design.
It`s been rumoured for a while the 2022 engine will adopt the split turbo layout but it`s probably too early for any solid news on that.
“Hamilton’s talent is perhaps even more than that of Ayrton or Schumacher or Fernando." - Rubens Barrichello

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_cerber1
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Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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M840TR wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 12:03
I seriously doubt this. What's the source?
Scroll down

viewtopic.php?f=4&t=22079&start=2940

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_cerber1
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Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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SmallSoldier
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Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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M840TR wrote:
Chicane wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 07:44
Mercedes has two customers already and one thing they are very good at it is fixing the issues on an urgent basis. The PU will make yet another step next season as Mercedes continue to adapt their PU to operate on a single ICE mode.

For McLaren they have had experience with every type of PU layout since the introduction of this engine formula. McLaren complete a full circle going from Mercedes to Honda to Renault and now back to Mercedes . The integration should go smoothly by and large barring a few niggling issues.

McLaren will gain aerodynamically at the rear with a more compactly packaged Mercedes PU. The weight distribution will be better with a split turbo layout and the cooling demands of the Mercedes PU are modest compared to the Renault.

McLaren are trying to understand the impact of 2021 nose downstream and all this pain that they are going through now will be worth it. Without any Friday running and back to back comparison you cannot t extract the maximum potential of the aero package. I think by the end of the season McLaren will have a solid understanding of the new aero bits.
I'll add a few points to this rather starchy portrait by saying that Mclaren went through 1 more PU change in 2017 with Honda shifting to a split-turbo layout. That's a shift in 2014, 2015, 2017 and then 2018, all for entirely distinctive engines. That surely must've honed their integration skills a bit.

The Mercedes PU also is more compact in the middle - look at the RP or the Williams's intercooler packaging for example.

As for the nose, I don't agree that it cost lap-time. The Renaults and RPs were on average a tenth or two ahead by Silverstone and Norris with the new nose in Nurburgring demonstrated that they carried over that gap. Sainz's was the only Mclaren beckoning a bit of head-scratching. But what do you expect after significantly altering the bargeboards without the concomitant setup alterations - at the top, the 2 downwash vortex generators were replaced for 5 smaller yet conventional ones, and at the bottom outwash section the downward angled fins are now blunted.

However, this doesn't account for Norris reverting to a pre-Sochi setup. Given that the new nose and front-wing remained untouched, he must be referring to some underlying changes, which regardless indicates to no-flaws in the aero updates.
That’s also what I was wondering in regards to the comments of going back to “pre Sochi” spec... Norris run the new wing and new nose, with only missing the bargeboards bits... That wouldn’t be a pre Sochi setup in regards to Aero.


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diffuser
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Joined: 07 Sep 2012, 13:55
Location: Montreal

Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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M840TR wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 12:33
diffuser wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 12:21
M840TR wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 12:03


I seriously doubt this. What's the source?
Pictures on Renault PU thread.
They're speculating on cooling layout changes, not turbo or engine design.

Look at the pictures from blackout showing the air intake infront of the motor. That would only be done if the compressor is there.


https://www.f1technical.net/foru ... rt=2940

M840TR
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Joined: 13 Apr 2018, 21:04

Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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diffuser wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 16:40
M840TR wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 12:33
diffuser wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 12:21


Pictures on Renault PU thread.
They're speculating on cooling layout changes, not turbo or engine design.

Look at the pictures from blackout showing the air intake infront of the motor. That would only be done if the compressor is there.


https://www.f1technical.net/foru ... rt=2940
I've seen those but I'll reserve my judgement till next season.

tangodjango
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Joined: 14 Mar 2020, 23:38

Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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diffuser wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 16:40
M840TR wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 12:33
diffuser wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 12:21


Pictures on Renault PU thread.
They're speculating on cooling layout changes, not turbo or engine design.

Look at the pictures from blackout showing the air intake infront of the motor. That would only be done if the compressor is there.


https://www.f1technical.net/foru ... rt=2940
Isn't that the engine for 2022 they are building though? Is it even feasible to use it next year?
“Hamilton’s talent is perhaps even more than that of Ayrton or Schumacher or Fernando." - Rubens Barrichello

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diffuser
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Joined: 07 Sep 2012, 13:55
Location: Montreal

Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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M840TR wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 19:59
diffuser wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 16:40
M840TR wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 12:33


They're speculating on cooling layout changes, not turbo or engine design.

Look at the pictures from blackout showing the air intake infront of the motor. That would only be done if the compressor is there.


https://www.f1technical.net/foru ... rt=2940
I've seen those but I'll reserve my judgement till next season.
Think the plan is 2022.

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diffuser
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Joined: 07 Sep 2012, 13:55
Location: Montreal

Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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tangodjango wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 20:42
diffuser wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 16:40
M840TR wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 12:33


They're speculating on cooling layout changes, not turbo or engine design.

Look at the pictures from blackout showing the air intake infront of the motor. That would only be done if the compressor is there.


https://www.f1technical.net/foru ... rt=2940
Isn't that the engine for 2022 they are building though? Is it even feasible to use it next year?
That is my understanding.

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mwillems
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Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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McG wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 02:03
mwillems wrote:
13 Oct 2020, 22:27
McG wrote:
13 Oct 2020, 17:09
Don't believe in the conspiracy stuff either. There's enough crazy stuff going on in the business side that they keep the on track stuff as sporting as possible, well, maybe not Ferrari but the rest are largely very sporting.
You know that they are watching you type...
Oh I know they are, but not they in F1!
On an unrelated note, they say that you forgot to water your plants this week.
Give a man a fire, and he will be warm for a night.
Set a man on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life.

tangodjango
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Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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diffuser wrote:
15 Oct 2020, 00:09
tangodjango wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 20:42
diffuser wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 16:40



Look at the pictures from blackout showing the air intake infront of the motor. That would only be done if the compressor is there.


https://www.f1technical.net/foru ... rt=2940
Isn't that the engine for 2022 they are building though? Is it even feasible to use it next year?
That is my understanding.
Wonder if they will bring it forward. Probably impossible due to architectural constraints with the present chassis.
“Hamilton’s talent is perhaps even more than that of Ayrton or Schumacher or Fernando." - Rubens Barrichello

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diffuser
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Location: Montreal

Re: [ 2020 ] Mclaren F1 Team - Renault

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tangodjango wrote:
15 Oct 2020, 08:11
diffuser wrote:
15 Oct 2020, 00:09
tangodjango wrote:
14 Oct 2020, 20:42

Isn't that the engine for 2022 they are building though? Is it even feasible to use it next year?
That is my understanding.
Wonder if they will bring it forward. Probably impossible due to architectural constraints with the present chassis.
Yeah, you'd think it would be like a PU change. With the token restrictions next year it will minimize other changes they can make.