2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

This forum contains threads to discuss teams themselves. Anything not technical about the cars, including restructuring, performances etc belongs here.
PhillipM
PhillipM
424
Joined: Mon May 16, 2011 2:18 pm
Location: Over the road from Boothy...

Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

Post

darkpino wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 8:56 am
The interesting part is the head and the body, I’ve worked with drivers who had there seatbelts pretty loose (not very safe) and drivers who wanted them as tight as possible. I assume that in F1 as they are all professionals the belts are always really tight so that makes the body pretty much 1 with the safety cell and therefore the force that the safety cell faces is pretty much all the force the body also faces.
No, the reason you have them tight is to stop there being any free slack which can see the body accelerated and then stopped against the belts as a sudden jolt - which snaps your neck, a friend of mine died like this because of slack belts while competing, his co-driver walked away with nothing more than bruises.

You keep the belts tight to remove that free play but the belts themselves stretch a lot in an impact to reduce the acceleration force on the body - it's not uncommon for the belts to be a good few inches plastically deformed after a hard hit, and it's why the regulations for roll over bars and the halo, etc, have such a large distance from the drivers head.

PhillipM
PhillipM
424
Joined: Mon May 16, 2011 2:18 pm
Location: Over the road from Boothy...

Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

Post

"Keeping The Stewards Impartial
It was brought to my attention through the TV broadcast that Toto was going to see the stewards with information he had tried to email to Michael before they had ruled on a penalty. It is a little bit like trying to lobby a jury while they make their final verdict. The Stewards are locked away to ensure they are independent of external influence in order to reach their own conclusions.
So having heard that Toto was lobbying the stewards, I went up to see them and raised the point that neither of us should be there and it was not appropriate for anyone to interfere while the decision making process was underway. It is also detailed in the sporting code that this is not acceptable and I am now pleased to see that the FIA have clarified that this sort of lobbying will not be tolerated in the future as it may well pressure the stewards into a decision that is not wholly fair or impartial."
This bit made me laugh from Horner, given the reason Toto had to go up there with it to start with was because he was worried about Horner being on the radio every 2 minutes lobbying the stewards and the race director :lol:

LHamilton
LHamilton
3
Joined: Sat Jun 23, 2012 2:40 pm

Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

Post

Toto going to the stewards and Horner complaining about it is probably the most F1 thing to happen. In that sense that you are breaking the rules of the game if you're trying to influence the stewards by going to see them face-to-face, but it's okay to try and influence them on the radio. Them gray areas. :D

User avatar
godlameroso
514
Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 8:27 pm
Location: Miami FL

Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

Post

PhillipM wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:41 pm
"Keeping The Stewards Impartial
It was brought to my attention through the TV broadcast that Toto was going to see the stewards with information he had tried to email to Michael before they had ruled on a penalty. It is a little bit like trying to lobby a jury while they make their final verdict. The Stewards are locked away to ensure they are independent of external influence in order to reach their own conclusions.
So having heard that Toto was lobbying the stewards, I went up to see them and raised the point that neither of us should be there and it was not appropriate for anyone to interfere while the decision making process was underway. It is also detailed in the sporting code that this is not acceptable and I am now pleased to see that the FIA have clarified that this sort of lobbying will not be tolerated in the future as it may well pressure the stewards into a decision that is not wholly fair or impartial."
This bit made me laugh from Horner, given the reason Toto had to go up there with it to start with was because he was worried about Horner being on the radio every 2 minutes lobbying the stewards and the race director :lol:
Mr. Wolff had to go up there, look them in the eye to instill fear in their souls. :lol:
Saishū kōnā

dxpetrov
dxpetrov
-10
Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 2:39 pm

Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

Post

One of the reasons I love RB is Horner and his no BS attitude. Wouldn't change anything in there, no.

User avatar
Ryar
15
Joined: Sun Jan 31, 2021 4:28 pm

Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

Post

PhillipM wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:41 pm
"Keeping The Stewards Impartial
It was brought to my attention through the TV broadcast that Toto was going to see the stewards with information he had tried to email to Michael before they had ruled on a penalty. It is a little bit like trying to lobby a jury while they make their final verdict. The Stewards are locked away to ensure they are independent of external influence in order to reach their own conclusions.
So having heard that Toto was lobbying the stewards, I went up to see them and raised the point that neither of us should be there and it was not appropriate for anyone to interfere while the decision making process was underway. It is also detailed in the sporting code that this is not acceptable and I am now pleased to see that the FIA have clarified that this sort of lobbying will not be tolerated in the future as it may well pressure the stewards into a decision that is not wholly fair or impartial."
This bit made me laugh from Horner, given the reason Toto had to go up there with it to start with was because he was worried about Horner being on the radio every 2 minutes lobbying the stewards and the race director :lol:
What department or function do you manage in Mercedes racing operations? I am curious. :)
Hakuna Matata!

User avatar
godlameroso
514
Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 8:27 pm
Location: Miami FL

Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

Post

If we look at things over a longer time span, the sequence of events and how they culminate into now are rather interesting. In a way Ross Brawn gave away a lot of juicy details in his excellent book, whether willing or unwillingly. The biggest takeaway I got from it, was that things don't happen overnight in F1, although the cars are beyond rapid, the political gears turn in an almost inversely proportional manner. Red Bull took a good few years from 2006 until 2009 before they had established something champion caliber. Honda now, in their 3rd year with Red Bull have something champion caliber. Ironic as well that Honda's 3 year investment into their original team created a Monster that was luckily raced, and became the backbone of the car Red Bull is facing now.

There's such an intriguing web of interrelatedness between the two entities that it is almost surreal, truth is stranger than fiction.
Saishū kōnā

User avatar
Big Tea
163
Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2017 7:57 pm

Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

Post

If you're lying, I'll be back :shock:
How can I learn Braille for 'Danger do not touch'

politburo
politburo
3
Joined: Tue Mar 09, 2021 10:46 am

Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

Post

PhillipM wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:41 pm
"Keeping The Stewards Impartial
It was brought to my attention through the TV broadcast that Toto was going to see the stewards with information he had tried to email to Michael before they had ruled on a penalty. It is a little bit like trying to lobby a jury while they make their final verdict. The Stewards are locked away to ensure they are independent of external influence in order to reach their own conclusions.
So having heard that Toto was lobbying the stewards, I went up to see them and raised the point that neither of us should be there and it was not appropriate for anyone to interfere while the decision making process was underway. It is also detailed in the sporting code that this is not acceptable and I am now pleased to see that the FIA have clarified that this sort of lobbying will not be tolerated in the future as it may well pressure the stewards into a decision that is not wholly fair or impartial."
This bit made me laugh from Horner, given the reason Toto had to go up there with it to start with was because he was worried about Horner being on the radio every 2 minutes lobbying the stewards and the race director :lol:
None of the teams cannot talk back and forth to the stewards over the radio, only to the race director
"Nosotros diferimos, pero nosotros todos son iguales"

politburo
politburo
3
Joined: Tue Mar 09, 2021 10:46 am

Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

Post

politburo wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 7:08 pm
PhillipM wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:41 pm
"Keeping The Stewards Impartial
It was brought to my attention through the TV broadcast that Toto was going to see the stewards with information he had tried to email to Michael before they had ruled on a penalty. It is a little bit like trying to lobby a jury while they make their final verdict. The Stewards are locked away to ensure they are independent of external influence in order to reach their own conclusions.
So having heard that Toto was lobbying the stewards, I went up to see them and raised the point that neither of us should be there and it was not appropriate for anyone to interfere while the decision making process was underway. It is also detailed in the sporting code that this is not acceptable and I am now pleased to see that the FIA have clarified that this sort of lobbying will not be tolerated in the future as it may well pressure the stewards into a decision that is not wholly fair or impartial."
This bit made me laugh from Horner, given the reason Toto had to go up there with it to start with was because he was worried about Horner being on the radio every 2 minutes lobbying the stewards and the race director :lol:
None of the teams cannot talk back and forth to the stewards over the radio, only to the race director
During the session. However the race director can talk to the chairman of the stewards over the radio.
"Nosotros diferimos, pero nosotros todos son iguales"

darkpino
darkpino
3
Joined: Thu Aug 31, 2017 4:35 pm

Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

Post

PhillipM wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:32 pm
darkpino wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 8:56 am
The interesting part is the head and the body, I’ve worked with drivers who had there seatbelts pretty loose (not very safe) and drivers who wanted them as tight as possible. I assume that in F1 as they are all professionals the belts are always really tight so that makes the body pretty much 1 with the safety cell and therefore the force that the safety cell faces is pretty much all the force the body also faces.
No, the reason you have them tight is to stop there being any free slack which can see the body accelerated and then stopped against the belts as a sudden jolt - which snaps your neck, a friend of mine died like this because of slack belts while competing, his co-driver walked away with nothing more than bruises.

You keep the belts tight to remove that free play but the belts themselves stretch a lot in an impact to reduce the acceleration force on the body - it's not uncommon for the belts to be a good few inches plastically deformed after a hard hit, and it's why the regulations for roll over bars and the halo, etc, have such a large distance from the drivers head.
I know, I don’t understand your answer/message

PhillipM
PhillipM
424
Joined: Mon May 16, 2011 2:18 pm
Location: Over the road from Boothy...

Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

Post

Well if you did you'd understand that the belt stretch would be mean the body isn't subjected to as much force as the safety cell. They're not '1 with the safety cell'

User avatar
diffuser
233
Joined: Fri Sep 07, 2012 12:55 pm
Location: Montreal

Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

Post

Jolle wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:17 pm
Hoffman900 wrote:
Fri Jul 23, 2021 6:43 pm
SmallSoldier wrote:
Fri Jul 23, 2021 6:02 pm



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I really think F1 needs to rethink this.

Like I said about Bottas / Russell crash, big crashes affecting some upgrades are one thing, but shunts like these might start getting into the arena of having to furlough / layoff people, and that would be a terrible byproduct of all of this. I don’t care what team it is… if it starts heading down that path, then that is wrong.
The big teams have side projects or possibly even ghost projects to keep flexible, they won’t have to fire people. Small teams not hitting the budget cap is a whole other story. When a HAAS gets totalled, they have to find funds to buy a new car from Dalara or Williams who have to shift their limited resources.
RedBull just pulls some manufacturing hours from RedBull Technology and shifts some R&D power that way. The F1 project is budget limited, the whole company isn’t.
Not sure what you're saying. Do I think that teams budget $$$ for accidents? Yes they do. They don't fire people they just don't hire, cause it's not in the budge. Whatever $$$ go into accidents, don't go into salaries. Have they let people go to get under the budget? Yes.

User avatar
diffuser
233
Joined: Fri Sep 07, 2012 12:55 pm
Location: Montreal

Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

Post

politburo wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 7:12 pm
politburo wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 7:08 pm
PhillipM wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:41 pm


This bit made me laugh from Horner, given the reason Toto had to go up there with it to start with was because he was worried about Horner being on the radio every 2 minutes lobbying the stewards and the race director :lol:
None of the teams cannot talk back and forth to the stewards over the radio, only to the race director
During the session. However the race director can talk to the chairman of the stewards over the radio.
On Skysport were heard Toto talking to Masi and Masi specifically telling Toto to go see the Stewarts with the information, that he was allowed.

Jolle
Jolle
255
Joined: Wed Jan 29, 2014 9:58 pm
Location: Dordrecht

Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

Post

diffuser wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 9:28 pm
Jolle wrote:
Sat Jul 24, 2021 1:17 pm
Hoffman900 wrote:
Fri Jul 23, 2021 6:43 pm


I really think F1 needs to rethink this.

Like I said about Bottas / Russell crash, big crashes affecting some upgrades are one thing, but shunts like these might start getting into the arena of having to furlough / layoff people, and that would be a terrible byproduct of all of this. I don’t care what team it is… if it starts heading down that path, then that is wrong.
The big teams have side projects or possibly even ghost projects to keep flexible, they won’t have to fire people. Small teams not hitting the budget cap is a whole other story. When a HAAS gets totalled, they have to find funds to buy a new car from Dalara or Williams who have to shift their limited resources.
RedBull just pulls some manufacturing hours from RedBull Technology and shifts some R&D power that way. The F1 project is budget limited, the whole company isn’t.
Not sure what you're saying. Do I think that teams budget $$$ for accidents? Yes they do. They don't fire people they just don't hire, cause it's not in the budge. Whatever $$$ go into accidents, don't go into salaries. Have they let people go to get under the budget? Yes.
What I mean, for instance, Mercedes has a pool of people (engineers, R&D, designers, manufacturers, etc) that they can shift between projects. The F1 departement is one of those projects (and the biggest one). After the imola crash they had, for a guess, shift 5 designers working on the 22 car temporarily to the “applied technology” department, working, for instance on the next Americas cup boat, and transfer 5 manufacturer workers and some material from the INEOS project to the F1 project.