2021 Mclaren F1 Team

This forum contains threads to discuss teams themselves. Anything not technical about the cars, including restructuring, performances etc belongs here.
PhillipM
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Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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Oil was topped off in the pits, maybe a touch touch overestimated

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djos
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Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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CjC wrote:
Mon Jul 19, 2021 9:18 pm
Yea I’ve tended to notice that when it’s warm it favours Ferrari or at least helps them to challenge and sometimes beat the Mclarens.
Regarding the horror show for Ferrari in France- was that a very warm day or was it cool? I can’t remember, the only thing I remember was that it rained over night...
Ferrari seems to be very kind to their tires which explains why they do so well in the heat.
The impossible often has a kind of integrity which the merely improbable lacks.

SmallSoldier
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Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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CjC wrote:Yea I’ve tended to notice that when it’s warm it favours Ferrari or at least helps them to challenge and sometimes beat the Mclarens.
Regarding the horror show for Ferrari in France- was that a very warm day or was it cool? I can’t remember, the only thing I remember was that it rained over night...
A comparison of temperatures by themselves wouldn’t be enough… The analysis would have to be based on temperatures and compounds for a given race… In addition to track surface.

Understanding the tires is the name of the game


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CjC
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Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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djos wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 12:07 am
CjC wrote:
Mon Jul 19, 2021 9:18 pm
Yea I’ve tended to notice that when it’s warm it favours Ferrari or at least helps them to challenge and sometimes beat the Mclarens.
Regarding the horror show for Ferrari in France- was that a very warm day or was it cool? I can’t remember, the only thing I remember was that it rained over night...
Ferrari seems to be very kind to their tires which explains why they do so well in the heat.
It seems that they are, so were the track temps cooler?
Just a fan's point of view

CjC
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Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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SmallSoldier wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 12:31 am
CjC wrote:Yea I’ve tended to notice that when it’s warm it favours Ferrari or at least helps them to challenge and sometimes beat the Mclarens.
Regarding the horror show for Ferrari in France- was that a very warm day or was it cool? I can’t remember, the only thing I remember was that it rained over night...
A comparison of temperatures by themselves wouldn’t be enough… The analysis would have to be based on temperatures and compounds for a given race… In addition to track surface.

Understanding the tires is the name of the game


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Yea but it’s the same for all the cars at the same given time so some comparisons can be made in my opinion.
For instance after the first race in Austria Sainz said that Ferrari favour the harder compounds and Silverstone was all 3 of the hardest compounds. We seems to feel that the Ferrari favours the heat and It was warm at Silverstone (believe me it was! 8) )
All I’m trying to remember is if it was cooler at Paul Ricard and with the softer rubber (compared to Silverstone) that’s what hindered Ferrrai.
Just a fan's point of view

mwillems
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Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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CjC wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 6:31 am
SmallSoldier wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 12:31 am
CjC wrote:Yea I’ve tended to notice that when it’s warm it favours Ferrari or at least helps them to challenge and sometimes beat the Mclarens.
Regarding the horror show for Ferrari in France- was that a very warm day or was it cool? I can’t remember, the only thing I remember was that it rained over night...
A comparison of temperatures by themselves wouldn’t be enough… The analysis would have to be based on temperatures and compounds for a given race… In addition to track surface.

Understanding the tires is the name of the game


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Yea but it’s the same for all the cars at the same given time so some comparisons can be made in my opinion.
For instance after the first race in Austria Sainz said that Ferrari favour the harder compounds and Silverstone was all 3 of the hardest compounds. We seems to feel that the Ferrari favours the heat and It was warm at Silverstone (believe me it was! 8) )
All I’m trying to remember is if it was cooler at Paul Ricard and with the softer rubber (compared to Silverstone) that’s what hindered Ferrrai.
Yeah but the tyres performance from being perfectly in the right range, around the right range to out of the range seems quite wide. Too much of a differentiator. I don't think we'd ever be able to get the graph but I think the increase that you get is too much when you get it on the nose, compared to when you are just about able to get the tyres in the working range. I'd like the tyres to have a more consistent performance in and out of the range. Not equal obviously, but less striking.

I think this is the reason why so many predictions in here of "The mclaren will do well here and the Ferrari will do well there" have been wrong. It's way more about the tyres than the track characteristics. They do help you be able to manage the temps but then the type of tarmac and the weather will push that to the side.
Give a man a fire, and he will be warm for a night.
Set a man on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life.

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mclaren111
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Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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SmallSoldier wrote:
Mon Jul 19, 2021 7:02 pm
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202107 ... a76635.jpg


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It's all that silly black paint on the 2017 car... :lol: :lol:

Chicane
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Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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Best result for McLaren so far partly due to track characteristics – Ricciardo.



“But it’s definitely [that] there’s less braking on this circuit, so that’s one characteristic which maybe has been a good thing for me this weekend.”

Ricciardo said this was the first time the car suited him so well this year.


Speaking on Sunday evening, Ricciardo said his race-long battle with Carlos Sainz Jnr helped him understand more about the way his car was behaving.

“It’s strange, because you’d think on one lap is more when you’re really pushing the car on the limit and maybe the race, when everything settles down, I’ll have a bit more [pace],” he said.

“But I’ve kind of seen the opposite this weekend. On the race, when the car’s a bit [high] on fuel and starts to move around more, that’s where I’ve still got to dial it in a bit more. I think just the feeling and being able to really put the car on that knife-edge. I’m not able to do as consistently yet.

“I think having Carlos actually for most of the race putting the pressure on me kind of forced me to, in a way, over-drive some corners. And I think it allowed me to feel a little more where that edge is.”


https://www.racefans.net/2021/07/20/bes ... ricciardo/
Quickshifter

SmallSoldier
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Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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CjC wrote:
SmallSoldier wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 12:31 am
CjC wrote:Yea I’ve tended to notice that when it’s warm it favours Ferrari or at least helps them to challenge and sometimes beat the Mclarens.
Regarding the horror show for Ferrari in France- was that a very warm day or was it cool? I can’t remember, the only thing I remember was that it rained over night...
A comparison of temperatures by themselves wouldn’t be enough… The analysis would have to be based on temperatures and compounds for a given race… In addition to track surface.

Understanding the tires is the name of the game


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Yea but it’s the same for all the cars at the same given time so some comparisons can be made in my opinion.
For instance after the first race in Austria Sainz said that Ferrari favour the harder compounds and Silverstone was all 3 of the hardest compounds. We seems to feel that the Ferrari favours the heat and It was warm at Silverstone (believe me it was! 8) )
All I’m trying to remember is if it was cooler at Paul Ricard and with the softer rubber (compared to Silverstone) that’s what hindered Ferrrai.
I did some digging on the temperatures… Initially, I used the Forecast from @F1 since I couldn’t find any actual temperature information on official documents (Fia.com) or even in F1.com that talked about the conditions… But knowing that Forecasts could be far off the mark, I then look for the temperature at the actual city where the GP’s were held for that particular day (please note that information is based on the “highest” temperature for the day, not necessarily the temperature at the time the GP was held, which could provide some variance (for example with Bahrain been held at night and the temperatures dropping).

To your question, yes France seemed to be 2 degrees cooler than Silverstone… Nevertheless Silverstone and France where the 2 hottest places where they have raced so far… The coldest place was Imola and interestingly both Portimao and Spain where run at the same temperature (22 degrees) with very different results for Ferrari… That’s why the analysis would need to include not only the compounds used at each circuit, but also probably the circuit characteristics would need to be part of the analysis (low / high downforce, front / rear limited).

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McG
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Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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mclaren111 wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 10:34 am
SmallSoldier wrote:
Mon Jul 19, 2021 7:02 pm
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202107 ... a76635.jpg


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It's all that silly black paint on the 2017 car... :lol: :lol:
A little more black paint than some would like was the least of our worries 😂
Honda, The Power Of Giving Up.
Red Bull Gives You Flexiwings.

CjC
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Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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SmallSoldier wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 5:23 pm
CjC wrote:
SmallSoldier wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 12:31 am

A comparison of temperatures by themselves wouldn’t be enough… The analysis would have to be based on temperatures and compounds for a given race… In addition to track surface.

Understanding the tires is the name of the game


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Yea but it’s the same for all the cars at the same given time so some comparisons can be made in my opinion.
For instance after the first race in Austria Sainz said that Ferrari favour the harder compounds and Silverstone was all 3 of the hardest compounds. We seems to feel that the Ferrari favours the heat and It was warm at Silverstone (believe me it was! 8) )
All I’m trying to remember is if it was cooler at Paul Ricard and with the softer rubber (compared to Silverstone) that’s what hindered Ferrrai.
I did some digging on the temperatures… Initially, I used the Forecast from @F1 since I couldn’t find any actual temperature information on official documents (Fia.com) or even in F1.com that talked about the conditions… But knowing that Forecasts could be far off the mark, I then look for the temperature at the actual city where the GP’s were held for that particular day (please note that information is based on the “highest” temperature for the day, not necessarily the temperature at the time the GP was held, which could provide some variance (for example with Bahrain been held at night and the temperatures dropping).

To your question, yes France seemed to be 2 degrees cooler than Silverstone… Nevertheless Silverstone and France where the 2 hottest places where they have raced so far… The coldest place was Imola and interestingly both Portimao and Spain where run at the same temperature (22 degrees) with very different results for Ferrari… That’s why the analysis would need to include not only the compounds used at each circuit, but also probably the circuit characteristics would need to be part of the analysis (low / high downforce, front / rear limited).

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202107 ... efdf2f.jpg


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Top work👏🏻
The track temps aren’t as far a part as I thought so must not have been a huge factor.
Maybe the green track for race day at paul Ricard played a bigger role or the tyre compounds didn’t suit Ferrari as much or he’ll maybe Ferrari have just got on too of the problem, after all it did hinder Sainz in Portimao as well as at Paul Ricard.

Anyway even though Hungary is a front limiting circuit I expect Ferrari to be extremely strong as engine power is less of a factor at the Hungaroring.

It’s just going to be a fascinating contest- just like the fight for the WDC currently is....👍🏻
Just a fan's point of view

the EDGE
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Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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SmallSoldier wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 5:23 pm
CjC wrote:
SmallSoldier wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 12:31 am

A comparison of temperatures by themselves wouldn’t be enough… The analysis would have to be based on temperatures and compounds for a given race… In addition to track surface.

Understanding the tires is the name of the game


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Yea but it’s the same for all the cars at the same given time so some comparisons can be made in my opinion.
For instance after the first race in Austria Sainz said that Ferrari favour the harder compounds and Silverstone was all 3 of the hardest compounds. We seems to feel that the Ferrari favours the heat and It was warm at Silverstone (believe me it was! 8) )
All I’m trying to remember is if it was cooler at Paul Ricard and with the softer rubber (compared to Silverstone) that’s what hindered Ferrrai.
I did some digging on the temperatures… Initially, I used the Forecast from @F1 since I couldn’t find any actual temperature information on official documents (Fia.com) or even in F1.com that talked about the conditions… But knowing that Forecasts could be far off the mark, I then look for the temperature at the actual city where the GP’s were held for that particular day (please note that information is based on the “highest” temperature for the day, not necessarily the temperature at the time the GP was held, which could provide some variance (for example with Bahrain been held at night and the temperatures dropping).

To your question, yes France seemed to be 2 degrees cooler than Silverstone… Nevertheless Silverstone and France where the 2 hottest places where they have raced so far… The coldest place was Imola and interestingly both Portimao and Spain where run at the same temperature (22 degrees) with very different results for Ferrari… That’s why the analysis would need to include not only the compounds used at each circuit, but also probably the circuit characteristics would need to be part of the analysis (low / high downforce, front / rear limited).

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202107 ... efdf2f.jpg


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Problem your looking at air temp, where it’s actually the track temp that dictates tyre temp

Track temp is effected by cloud cover, surface colour, material, and possibly wind speed too

SmallSoldier
SmallSoldier
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Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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the EDGE wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 7:54 pm
SmallSoldier wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 5:23 pm
CjC wrote:
Yea but it’s the same for all the cars at the same given time so some comparisons can be made in my opinion.
For instance after the first race in Austria Sainz said that Ferrari favour the harder compounds and Silverstone was all 3 of the hardest compounds. We seems to feel that the Ferrari favours the heat and It was warm at Silverstone (believe me it was! 8) )
All I’m trying to remember is if it was cooler at Paul Ricard and with the softer rubber (compared to Silverstone) that’s what hindered Ferrrai.
I did some digging on the temperatures… Initially, I used the Forecast from @F1 since I couldn’t find any actual temperature information on official documents (Fia.com) or even in F1.com that talked about the conditions… But knowing that Forecasts could be far off the mark, I then look for the temperature at the actual city where the GP’s were held for that particular day (please note that information is based on the “highest” temperature for the day, not necessarily the temperature at the time the GP was held, which could provide some variance (for example with Bahrain been held at night and the temperatures dropping).

To your question, yes France seemed to be 2 degrees cooler than Silverstone… Nevertheless Silverstone and France where the 2 hottest places where they have raced so far… The coldest place was Imola and interestingly both Portimao and Spain where run at the same temperature (22 degrees) with very different results for Ferrari… That’s why the analysis would need to include not only the compounds used at each circuit, but also probably the circuit characteristics would need to be part of the analysis (low / high downforce, front / rear limited).

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202107 ... efdf2f.jpg


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Problem your looking at air temp, where it’s actually the track temp that dictates tyre temp

Track temp is effected by cloud cover, surface colour, material, and possibly wind speed too
Agreed! I just couldn’t find the information easily… Maybe if I go through race reports for the different news outlets I may be able to find the information… I’ll give it a try later tonight if I find some available time 😊

Mansell89
Mansell89
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Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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Any thoughts on Budapest and how our car will take to it?

Also, how will it be for Dan? It’s not a track with super high speed and tough braking zones is it - but it is a very rhythmical circuit so I’m intrigued to see how he goes. He absolutely can nail the circuit but of course he will just need that feel of the car.

I expect Ferrari to look pretty mighty here to be honest - they were superb at Monaco and this is high downforce. Not sure they’ll beat RBR and both Mercs but they’ll be very handy.

If we get either car in the top 6 I’d be very pleased.

CjC
CjC
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Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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SmallSoldier wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 8:50 pm
the EDGE wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 7:54 pm
SmallSoldier wrote:
Tue Jul 20, 2021 5:23 pm

I did some digging on the temperatures… Initially, I used the Forecast from @F1 since I couldn’t find any actual temperature information on official documents (Fia.com) or even in F1.com that talked about the conditions… But knowing that Forecasts could be far off the mark, I then look for the temperature at the actual city where the GP’s were held for that particular day (please note that information is based on the “highest” temperature for the day, not necessarily the temperature at the time the GP was held, which could provide some variance (for example with Bahrain been held at night and the temperatures dropping).

To your question, yes France seemed to be 2 degrees cooler than Silverstone… Nevertheless Silverstone and France where the 2 hottest places where they have raced so far… The coldest place was Imola and interestingly both Portimao and Spain where run at the same temperature (22 degrees) with very different results for Ferrari… That’s why the analysis would need to include not only the compounds used at each circuit, but also probably the circuit characteristics would need to be part of the analysis (low / high downforce, front / rear limited).

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202107 ... efdf2f.jpg


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
Problem your looking at air temp, where it’s actually the track temp that dictates tyre temp

Track temp is effected by cloud cover, surface colour, material, and possibly wind speed too
Agreed! I just couldn’t find the information easily… Maybe if I go through race reports for the different news outlets I may be able to find the information… I’ll give it a try later tonight if I find some available time 😊
Found them👍🏻
Paul Ricard had a track temp of 38 degrees using the C2, C3 and C4 tyres
Silverstone had a track temp of 53 degrees using the C3, C4 and C5 tyres.
That’s a fairly massive difference especially for the Pirelli tyres.....
I think it’s fair to say that the higher temps and harder tyres (according to Sainz) favoured Ferrari
Just a fan's point of view