2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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CjC
CjC
8
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:13 pm

Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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Mansell89 wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 11:08 pm
Form out of the window next season - all about our development team getting the new car right and optimised. They’ve been pretty good so far and of course get their first opportunity to optimise the rear of the car around the Merc power unit which is a massive help next year compared to this
I disagree about the form and I dare say Binotto does too. He’s asked his team to treat this P3 battle as a dress rehearsal for a title campaign and they are killing it. The exact opposite of Mclaren who seem to me have lost their head of steam- the form and luck has dipped which will effect the race team.
I’d imagine the designers working on the ‘22 car will produce whatever they manage to produce regardless of a successful or disappointing ‘21 season.
Just a fan's point of view

runningmanz
runningmanz
0
Joined: Tue May 25, 2021 1:57 pm

Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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Sounds like Dan was fuel saving even behind Leclerc in the full race radio. So much fuel saving it was ridiculous lifting and coasting with him saying at one point I don't know how much slower I can go. Bloody disappointing to not see him be able to battle Leclerc with the fuel sensor issue and robbed again 2 races in a row with car issues.


basti313
basti313
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Joined: Sat Feb 22, 2014 1:49 pm

Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

Post

Mansell89 wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 11:08 pm
Form out of the window next season - all about our development team getting the new car right and optimised. They’ve been pretty good so far and of course get their first opportunity to optimise the rear of the car around the Merc power unit which is a massive help next year compared to this
I do not know...for me it is 2013 again:
- McLaren falling apart in view of a big rule change. Does this mean good for next season like 2014, when they finished behind Williams?
- Also remember that it started to go wrong when the car was falling apart in 2012.
- Bull, Merc and Ferrari are the only teams making progress over the season. With surprisingly bad Nr.2 drivers for the top tiers...they seem to still have the same resource advantage like 2013?
- Renault surprisingly good? No idea why I see this strange coincidence.
- While Merc throws in wonder engines the McL is driven on mediocre. Comes back to the RedBull point, that without a Nr.1 engine supply contract you do not compete for the championship.

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adrianjordan
20
Joined: Sun Feb 28, 2010 10:34 am
Location: West Yorkshire, England

Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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basti313 wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 10:39 am
Mansell89 wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 11:08 pm
Form out of the window next season - all about our development team getting the new car right and optimised. They’ve been pretty good so far and of course get their first opportunity to optimise the rear of the car around the Merc power unit which is a massive help next year compared to this
I do not know...for me it is 2013 again:
- McLaren falling apart in view of a big rule change. Does this mean good for next season like 2014, when they finished behind Williams?
- Also remember that it started to go wrong when the car was falling apart in 2012.
- Bull, Merc and Ferrari are the only teams making progress over the season. With surprisingly bad Nr.2 drivers for the top tiers...they seem to still have the same resource advantage like 2013?
- Renault surprisingly good? No idea why I see this strange coincidence.
- While Merc throws in wonder engines the McL is driven on mediocre. Comes back to the RedBull point, that without a Nr.1 engine supply contract you do not compete for the championship.
Significant differences though between the 2 seasons.

In 2012 McLaren didn't understand why their car was so fast, then they started with a clean slate in 2013 - not a good idea when you don't understand where the previous car worked and didn't work.

The 2013 car was flawed as a result. They then spent too much of 2013 focused on that car and didn't switch to the 2014 car as early as they should have.

This time around they are in a completely different position. They understand the car, perhaps more than they have in a long time and they have switched focus early - which is reflected in the limited updates they've brought the the car.

Additionally we have extra wind tunnel and CFD time to get to know the new car next year, we're fully funded, have 2 of the best drivers on the grid, have probably the best PU on the grid and have one of the strongest design departments.

The future is bright, the future is papaya!!
Favourite driver: Lando Norris
Favourite team: McLaren

Turned down the chance to meet Vettel at Silverstone in 2007. He was a test driver at the time and I didn't think it was worth queuing!! 🤦🏻‍♂️

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bauc
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Joined: Wed Jun 19, 2013 9:03 am
Location: Skopje, Macedonia

Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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Everything comes around in this sport, the last few races Ferrari was quicker but also we were unlucky, ever since that rain in Russia and the missed chance of LANDO for the WIN, but since this sport and else is bound by karma, we will get it all back next season, trust me ;)
Формула 1 на Македонски - The first ever Macedonian Formula 1 YouTube channel
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJkjCv ... 6rVRgKASwg

Emag
Emag
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Joined: Mon Feb 11, 2019 1:56 pm

Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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bauc wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:18 pm
Everything comes around in this sport, the last few races Ferrari was quicker but also we were unlucky, ever since that rain in Russia and the missed chance of LANDO for the WIN, but since this sport and else is bound by karma, we will get it all back next season, trust me ;)
Not gonna lie, I don't have high hopes for next season as some others do.

Yes, it's an opportunity to jump up the order, but it's also an opportunity to fall back into the abyss.

Beating Ferrari would have felt like a small victory this season. And it could have been the only sense of victory for us in a couple of years if things go bad next season.

That's the only reason why I feel incredibly disappointed that we lost out so badly after one engine upgrade.

The way we lost out hurts as well. If it would have been a tight battle to the end, it would have been easier to 'cope' with.

But the fact that all it took Ferrari was one engine upgrade to walk with it hurts.

Especially since McLaren was one of the last teams to give up development on this year's car.

It just shows that we are not able to compete with the big teams. It's like pressing on a very old wound, basically engraving a sad thought that McLaren may never be the top team it once was again.

The anger behind that thought is what encites the unpleasant "rants" I have had lately. But it's honestly just disappointment.

basti313
basti313
23
Joined: Sat Feb 22, 2014 1:49 pm

Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

Post

adrianjordan wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:59 pm
basti313 wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 10:39 am
Mansell89 wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 11:08 pm
Form out of the window next season - all about our development team getting the new car right and optimised. They’ve been pretty good so far and of course get their first opportunity to optimise the rear of the car around the Merc power unit which is a massive help next year compared to this
I do not know...for me it is 2013 again:
- McLaren falling apart in view of a big rule change. Does this mean good for next season like 2014, when they finished behind Williams?
- Also remember that it started to go wrong when the car was falling apart in 2012.
- Bull, Merc and Ferrari are the only teams making progress over the season. With surprisingly bad Nr.2 drivers for the top tiers...they seem to still have the same resource advantage like 2013?
- Renault surprisingly good? No idea why I see this strange coincidence.
- While Merc throws in wonder engines the McL is driven on mediocre. Comes back to the RedBull point, that without a Nr.1 engine supply contract you do not compete for the championship.
Significant differences though between the 2 seasons.

In 2012 McLaren didn't understand why their car was so fast, then they started with a clean slate in 2013 - not a good idea when you don't understand where the previous car worked and didn't work.

The 2013 car was flawed as a result. They then spent too much of 2013 focused on that car and didn't switch to the 2014 car as early as they should have.

This time around they are in a completely different position. They understand the car, perhaps more than they have in a long time and they have switched focus early - which is reflected in the limited updates they've brought the the car.

Additionally we have extra wind tunnel and CFD time to get to know the new car next year, we're fully funded, have 2 of the best drivers on the grid, have probably the best PU on the grid and have one of the strongest design departments.

The future is bright, the future is papaya!!
I agree on the point of driver lineup, still I can not see how it matters under the car dominated formula and the engine disadvantage.
I also disagree on the point that McLaren knows why their car is fast. It seemed to me as if they are still a bit surprised why it is sometimes good and sometimes not this season.

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bauc
28
Joined: Wed Jun 19, 2013 9:03 am
Location: Skopje, Macedonia

Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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Emag wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 3:24 pm
bauc wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:18 pm
Everything comes around in this sport, the last few races Ferrari was quicker but also we were unlucky, ever since that rain in Russia and the missed chance of LANDO for the WIN, but since this sport and else is bound by karma, we will get it all back next season, trust me ;)
Not gonna lie, I don't have high hopes for next season as some others do.

Yes, it's an opportunity to jump up the order, but it's also an opportunity to fall back into the abyss.

Beating Ferrari would have felt like a small victory this season. And it could have been the only sense of victory for us in a couple of years if things go bad next season.

That's the only reason why I feel incredibly disappointed that we lost out so badly after one engine upgrade.

The way we lost out hurts as well. If it would have been a tight battle to the end, it would have been easier to 'cope' with.

But the fact that all it took Ferrari was one engine upgrade to walk with it hurts.

Especially since McLaren was one of the last teams to give up development on this year's car.

It just shows that we are not able to compete with the big teams. It's like pressing on a very old wound, basically engraving a sad thought that McLaren may never be the top team it once was again.

The anger behind that thought is what encites the unpleasant "rants" I have had lately. But it's honestly just disappointment.
You keep forgeting that this car should have not existed and its a mixed bag.... while Ferrari had this major engine and chassis upgrade planned long time ago (#lastseason) so all and all it not disapointing at all if we end up 4th at the end in the constructors. Also when it comes to next year, we have the best team in all the right places for the first time in many many years, so I'm truly optimistic about our chances next year.
Формула 1 на Македонски - The first ever Macedonian Formula 1 YouTube channel
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCJkjCv ... 6rVRgKASwg

SmallSoldier
SmallSoldier
142
Joined: Sun Mar 10, 2019 2:54 am

Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

Post

basti313 wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 10:39 am
Mansell89 wrote:
Sun Nov 21, 2021 11:08 pm
Form out of the window next season - all about our development team getting the new car right and optimised. They’ve been pretty good so far and of course get their first opportunity to optimise the rear of the car around the Merc power unit which is a massive help next year compared to this
I do not know...for me it is 2013 again:
- McLaren falling apart in view of a big rule change. Does this mean good for next season like 2014, when they finished behind Williams?
- Also remember that it started to go wrong when the car was falling apart in 2012.
- Bull, Merc and Ferrari are the only teams making progress over the season. With surprisingly bad Nr.2 drivers for the top tiers...they seem to still have the same resource advantage like 2013?
- Renault surprisingly good? No idea why I see this strange coincidence.
- While Merc throws in wonder engines the McL is driven on mediocre. Comes back to the RedBull point, that without a Nr.1 engine supply contract you do not compete for the championship.
Although it would be nice to think that way (that there could be correlation between different seasons), unluckily there isn’t… We just need to wait and see if the team will bring a good car to the track next season, let’s hope that’s the case!

SmallSoldier
SmallSoldier
142
Joined: Sun Mar 10, 2019 2:54 am

Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

Post

Emag wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 3:24 pm
bauc wrote:
Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:18 pm
Everything comes around in this sport, the last few races Ferrari was quicker but also we were unlucky, ever since that rain in Russia and the missed chance of LANDO for the WIN, but since this sport and else is bound by karma, we will get it all back next season, trust me ;)
Not gonna lie, I don't have high hopes for next season as some others do.

Yes, it's an opportunity to jump up the order, but it's also an opportunity to fall back into the abyss.

Beating Ferrari would have felt like a small victory this season. And it could have been the only sense of victory for us in a couple of years if things go bad next season.

That's the only reason why I feel incredibly disappointed that we lost out so badly after one engine upgrade.

The way we lost out hurts as well. If it would have been a tight battle to the end, it would have been easier to 'cope' with.

But the fact that all it took Ferrari was one engine upgrade to walk with it hurts.

Especially since McLaren was one of the last teams to give up development on this year's car.

It just shows that we are not able to compete with the big teams. It's like pressing on a very old wound, basically engraving a sad thought that McLaren may never be the top team it once was again.

The anger behind that thought is what encites the unpleasant "rants" I have had lately. But it's honestly just disappointment.
At the end of the day, been a fan and been emotional about the team you support go hand in hand.

I would argue that even though Ferrari only needed one component upgrade in their PU to take the lead on McLaren, we can’t forget that last season they had double the amount of resources to work on this year’s car, so in all honesty I’m not that surprised that once they close the clear gap in engine performance they had at the beginning (coming from the previous season) that they started performing better than McLaren… Their chassis has more strengths than ours, so it will work better in more tracks than McLaren.

Been said that, where I find comfort is in the fact that the differences haven’t been astronomical, with the exception of a couple of GP’s (Cota for example), Ferrari hasn’t been “miles ahead” of McLaren in terms of pace… Yes, the fact that they have outqualified us and that one ultimately comforms to the pace of those around you may have exacerbated that difference… If we take a look at the last 2 races, McLaren could have finish with at least one car in front of Ferrari in both Brazil and Qatar… Lando was arguably faster in both races than the Ferrari’s… From a performance perspective, I don’t think the gap is as big as the points in the last few races seems to suggest.

I do agree that there is a feeling that Ferrari is doing a better job on and off track and they definitely have the momentum on their side… There is nothing that can be done about on track situations (like Lando’s puncture in Brazil), but the PU situation for Daniel and the Fuel Sensor situation in Qatar seem like things that could have been avoided… At least my heart doesn’t stops every time they do a PitStop anymore

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Darth-Piekus
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Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2018 2:27 pm
Location: Greece

Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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For me this year reminds me the years 1997 and 1998. In winter 1996 we got Andrian Newey from Williams and the car was leagues better. In winter 2020 we got James Key who many claim him to be the new Andrian Newey and the car in 2021 showed for the first time in many years innovations that others were jealous and the car wasn't fully developed due to heavy restrictions. In 1997 just like 2021 we had a car that took the fight to the big teams and got a victory when the GP helped all of our strenghts. Back then we won in Jerez and Melbourne and now we won in Monza in 1-2 on merit and we missed in my opinion another victory by sheer luck in Sochi. Just like Ron Dennis then we see Zak Brown creating a fantastic team over the years and just like then we have completely new cars and everyone starts from zero.

Maybe the team screws up at winter but I am positive we are gonna see a repeat of 1998.

Mansell89
Mansell89
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Joined: Sun Feb 22, 2015 6:21 pm

Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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I do think momentum is positive but in terms of a winning race car this is all about an enormous change of regulation.

The momentum part is about good correlation and proving you can deliver the goods

I just couldn’t be more pleased considering where we were at the end of 2018. We had switched to Renault, had to have that “hold the mirror up” moment where we realised the car wasn’t good enough and it wasn’t all Hondas fault, and had to renergise what looked a stale, uninspired team.

Sponsorship is coming along, morale looks great, the team looks one of the freshest and happiest on the grid, our youngster (Lando) looks like he can be top class, and we’ve got a proven benchmark power unit to support us through until the next engine change.

James Key has built on and moved forward the good work of Stella and Fry in 2019 and our car caught Adrian Neweys attention on more than one occasion.

We now have the chance to go toe to toe with everyone with full time to package the Merc engine, and stretch our innovation against the benchmarks of the business.

So excited for next year- I hope it’s good for the sport and we see some incredible racing between closely matched teams.

runningmanz
runningmanz
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Joined: Tue May 25, 2021 1:57 pm

Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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Some fine margin errors have cost us bigtime not to mention the awful luck with DNFs and the tyre puncture for Lando

Mexico

Ricciardo nails T1 and doesn't tap Bottas car, possible 5th - 10 points

Brazil

Lando doesn't turn in so soon passing Carlos. Most likely 4 or 5th - Minimum 10 points
Ricciardo cracked chassis doesn't occur. Most likely 5th or 6th one stopping ahead vs Ferrari two stopping. - Minimum 8 points

Qatar

Lando doesn't get puncture. Most likely 4th - 12 points
Dan doesn't have to heavily fuel save. 7th or 8th possible. Arguably faster than Ferrari as was fuel saving when catching Leclerc before 1st round of pitstops. Minimum 2 pts

Theres 42 points minimum lost and likely a little more.

Adjusted WCC

McLaren 3rd - 300
Ferrari 4th - 297.5

So very different with a little luck with the DNFs and small but costly T1 errors removed.

mwillems
mwillems
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Joined: Sun Sep 04, 2016 9:11 pm

Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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Lots of folks in here coming to terms with the season. I enjoyed it and I'm not disssapointed at all. We beat our points haul from last year, got our first win in years, and a 1-2 to boot and delivered a strong car. We critisise the team, but this was always going to the last few races and think that Daniels troubles also played a part. We had the car for 3rd and we missed out on a hatful of points earlier on as Daniel got used to the car. We had some poor luck with the puncture against Sainz, the engine sensor and the puncture again this weekend.

Things didn't fall our way, but had they gone our way, we were a team that could have still finished 3rd despite a resurgent Ferrari. It didn't fall our way and it did fall theirs, but so what. Great progress by the team and I look forward to next year.
Give a man a fire, and he will be warm for a night.
Set a man on fire, and he will be warm for the rest of his life.

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djos
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Joined: Fri May 19, 2006 5:09 am
Location: Melbourne, Australia

Re: 2021 Mclaren F1 Team

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It’s been confirmed that the fuel readings that ruined Daniel’s race were false.

https://news.google.com/articles/CBMiXG ... id=AU%3Aen
The impossible often has a kind of integrity which the merely improbable lacks.