Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

All that has to do with the power train, gearbox, clutch, fuels and lubricants, etc. Generally the mechanical side of Formula One.
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PlatinumZealot
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

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What is the regulatory boost limit again?
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gruntguru
gruntguru
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

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No limit. Not needed with a fuel flow limit.
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Tommy Cookers
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

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gruntguru wrote:
Sat Apr 11, 2020 1:18 am
..... Turbine power is "4 city cars".

..... Turbine power perhaps 350 kW.
isn't 350 kW optimistic ?

my city car has about 50 kW not about 90 kW

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henry
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

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The reference may be to Kei cars which have a maximum legal power of 47kW
Fortune favours the prepared; she has no favourites and takes no sides.
Truth is confirmed by inspection and delay; falsehood by haste and uncertainty : Tacitus

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

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My estimates are 160kW to 180kW.
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henry
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

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PlatinumZealot wrote:
Sun Apr 12, 2020 4:29 pm
My estimates are 160kW to 180kW.
For what?
Fortune favours the prepared; she has no favourites and takes no sides.
Truth is confirmed by inspection and delay; falsehood by haste and uncertainty : Tacitus

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

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henry wrote:
Sun Apr 12, 2020 6:53 pm
PlatinumZealot wrote:
Sun Apr 12, 2020 4:29 pm
My estimates are 160kW to 180kW.
For what?
Compressor shaft power requirement. Granted this is not based on calculations but extrapolation from some other engines.
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gruntguru
gruntguru
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

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Turbine power should be higher than compressor power (MGUH harvests the rest.)

Turbine power = 376 kW for the following conditions.
Mass flow (air + fuel) = 1.0 kg/s (AFR = 35:1 ie Lambda = 2.38)
PR = 5.0
Inlet temperature = 1000 *C
Isentropic efficiency = 80%
Steady state flow (no blowdown).

Working from the other direction:
Mass flow (air only) = 0.97 for the following conditions
11,000 rpm
VE = 1.1 (pessimistic)
PR = 5.02
Intercooling to 27*C (optimistic)
Ambient air density = 1.2

Mass flow (air only) = 0.825 for the following conditions (Conservative)
11,000 rpm
VE = 1.0 (really pessimistic)
PR = 5
Intercooling to 47*C (realistic)
Ambient air density = 1.2
je suis charlie

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godlameroso
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

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gruntguru wrote:
Sat Apr 11, 2020 1:18 am
WOW. Reading the fine print in that first image (It doesn't look fake). Compressor PR is 5:1. Turbine power is "4 city cars". Exhaust temp 1000+*C.

At 5:1 PR the AFR is >2.0 lambda - almost certainly stratified charge on top of TJI. Compressor power perhaps 200 kW. Turbine power perhaps 350 kW.

These numbers have moved along a lot since the early days.
Kei cars make ~68hp so ~280hp or a bit under 200kW
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Snorked
Snorked
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

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There's new Japanese magazine chronicling Honda moving to RedBull.

From the looks of it the four main guys at Sakura are being interviewed.

Garbage quality but it's better than nothing 😁

Image
Image

Maybe Amazon.jp free sample will cover these pages once the magazine is released.

gruntguru
gruntguru
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

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Nice find. I would love to read the labels on those images.

The first one seems to show a progression in compressor maps from lower boost and flow to more of both in the third one.

The second image shows a breakdown of energy flows in the exhaust, MGUH and compressor. It would be nice to know where all those branches are going.

Anyone who can translate the Japanese and re-label the images?
je suis charlie

ispano6
ispano6
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

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Snorked wrote:
Tue Apr 14, 2020 11:37 pm
There's new Japanese magazine chronicling Honda moving to RedBull.

From the looks of it the four main guys at Sakura are being interviewed.

Garbage quality but it's better than nothing 😁

https://abload.de/img/img_20200414_232211uxj6n.jpg
https://abload.de/img/img_20200414_232138atjlp.jpg

Maybe Amazon.jp free sample will cover these pages once the magazine is released.
If you provide the magazine or publication I can probably get a digital copy or higher quality scan and can translate the main parts.

Snorked
Snorked
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

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It's five main guys from Sakura talking about engine development, not four #-o

Here is the link: https://www.sun-a.com/magazine/detail.php?pid=11367

Alexf1
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

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GhostF1
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Re: Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

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This is pretty good news. I think this is mostly what Honda wanted to see, hopefully this keeps them in the sport until at least 2025. Should make the idea of the team becoming Honda Red Bull Racing a higher possibility for 2021 onwards.