Renault Power Unit Hardware & Software

All that has to do with the power train, gearbox, clutch, fuels and lubricants, etc. Generally the mechanical side of Formula One.
Carl Mccoy
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Re: Renault Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by Carl Mccoy » Mon Jun 24, 2019 3:22 pm

toraabe wrote:
Mon Jun 24, 2019 12:18 pm
Jambier wrote:
Mon Jun 24, 2019 9:32 am
I think Renault has made real good progress with the engine.

They are very close to Mercedes one in races. That's good =D>

Now Enstone and Woking can really now how far behind they are on chassis' side
Yes

They gained 50-60 hp this year, so in race trim they are more or less equal with MB and Ferrari.
They have no problems overtaking both MB and Ferrari powered cars, so the power is there.
The Mc Laren is the best of the two renault powered cars, and it is really nice to see that they at least has got the engine they deserved. I suppose Renault got back some of their people that went to Mercedes.
So they have really done a great job in Viry the last two years. Another thing is that Mc Laren is fully backing them, and you have never heard anything but positivty from Woking.
During the Hulkenberg race, he spent several dozen laps behind Raikkonen. He could not overtake him even with DRS and complained about the speed of Alfa on straights The Renault engine is definitely better than Honda but leading duo is still ahead.

epo
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Re: Renault Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by epo » Mon Jun 24, 2019 6:51 pm

Carl Mccoy wrote:
Mon Jun 24, 2019 3:22 pm
toraabe wrote:
Mon Jun 24, 2019 12:18 pm
Jambier wrote:
Mon Jun 24, 2019 9:32 am
I think Renault has made real good progress with the engine.

They are very close to Mercedes one in races. That's good =D>

Now Enstone and Woking can really now how far behind they are on chassis' side
Yes

They gained 50-60 hp this year, so in race trim they are more or less equal with MB and Ferrari.
They have no problems overtaking both MB and Ferrari powered cars, so the power is there.
The Mc Laren is the best of the two renault powered cars, and it is really nice to see that they at least has got the engine they deserved. I suppose Renault got back some of their people that went to Mercedes.
So they have really done a great job in Viry the last two years. Another thing is that Mc Laren is fully backing them, and you have never heard anything but positivty from Woking.
During the Hulkenberg race, he spent several dozen laps behind Raikkonen. He could not overtake him even with DRS and complained about the speed of Alfa on straights The Renault engine is definitely better than Honda but leading duo is still ahead.
Where do you get the knowledge the Renault engine is better then the Honda? It's said Renault engine is better in qualy but lacking power in race-trim compared to Honda. Honda can maintain higher modes in race much longer then Renault.

trinidefender
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Re: Renault Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by trinidefender » Mon Jun 24, 2019 7:40 pm

epo wrote:
Mon Jun 24, 2019 6:51 pm
Carl Mccoy wrote:
Mon Jun 24, 2019 3:22 pm
toraabe wrote:
Mon Jun 24, 2019 12:18 pm

Yes

They gained 50-60 hp this year, so in race trim they are more or less equal with MB and Ferrari.
They have no problems overtaking both MB and Ferrari powered cars, so the power is there.
The Mc Laren is the best of the two renault powered cars, and it is really nice to see that they at least has got the engine they deserved. I suppose Renault got back some of their people that went to Mercedes.
So they have really done a great job in Viry the last two years. Another thing is that Mc Laren is fully backing them, and you have never heard anything but positivty from Woking.
During the Hulkenberg race, he spent several dozen laps behind Raikkonen. He could not overtake him even with DRS and complained about the speed of Alfa on straights The Renault engine is definitely better than Honda but leading duo is still ahead.
Where do you get the knowledge the Renault engine is better then the Honda? It's said Renault engine is better in qualy but lacking power in race-trim compared to Honda. Honda can maintain higher modes in race much longer then Renault.
Who said that? The fact is that we simply don't know. All we seem to be able to surmise is that they are close. Personally just looking at Renault and McLaren vs Red Bull and Torro Rosso I get a feeling that the Renault PU has a slight power edge in qualifying but pretty much equal in the race. I could and am probably very well be wrong though.

The only information we have for sure, and where I personally believe that the, "higher PU modes for longer" thing came from is when Renault had to turn down their PU because of the Conrod issue. That has however been solved and the PU seems to be ok now.

Separately from that. Does anyone know if Renault is using the new smaller MGU-K that has supposedly been in development for a few years now?

Edit: https://www.racefans.net/2019/06/22/ver ... g-mclaren/
The closest thing that I have seen that is evidence to support your argument is this article. However we don't know if MV is talking about the race PU performance or simply the Red Bull having a better chassis that makes up the race pace performance.

carisi2k
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Re: Renault Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by carisi2k » Tue Jun 25, 2019 12:07 am

The Honda power unit is decent or else Max wouldn't have been getting all those podiums and fourth place finishes. But I think the Renault has definetly improved since they fixed the hardware issue and it does look to be more powerful. Daniels new PU allowed him to make that pass on both norris and raikonnen regardless of how legal it was. Nico was definelty trying to get in to Daniels tow to follow him.

I'm still not sure if it is engine performance or a low drag, low downforce setup that is providing this extra speed we are seeing from the reggie powered cars.

Blackout
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Re: Renault Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by Blackout » Wed Jun 26, 2019 12:55 pm

lol yeah for sure; if the Renault powered cars gain so much speed on the straights compared to 2018, its mainly because they have lowered their drag level somehow... but somehow they are faster than 2018, although they are heavier...
BS. Those gains are mainly, if not exclusively, thanks to a much stronger PU, like the team states, especially for Renault who has not a "low drag setup". And the Mclaren did definitely not use one of their low drag RW in France.
Renault, like many teams, already recovered their 2018 DF levels in the 2019 winter testing according to its drivers.
The 2019 DRS is stronger, but its the same for everybody.
So we're talking about two different aspects; the top speed gains compared to 2018 and the top speed advantage against other 2019 cars.
The top speed advantage compared to the the best cars can also be down to lower df and drag, obviously.
But the Renault has often equal or better top speeds than the Haas, FI, STR while being faster overall at the same time.
The Ferrari is generally the only car that is faster than the Renault and has similar top speeds in Q. They are also the ones who usually make the biggest gains in the straights compared to 2018, after the Renault powered cars...
Carl Mccoy wrote:
Mon Jun 24, 2019 3:22 pm
toraabe wrote:
Mon Jun 24, 2019 12:18 pm
Jambier wrote:
Mon Jun 24, 2019 9:32 am
I think Renault has made real good progress with the engine.

They are very close to Mercedes one in races. That's good =D>

Now Enstone and Woking can really now how far behind they are on chassis' side
Yes

They gained 50-60 hp this year, so in race trim they are more or less equal with MB and Ferrari.
They have no problems overtaking both MB and Ferrari powered cars, so the power is there.
The Mc Laren is the best of the two renault powered cars, and it is really nice to see that they at least has got the engine they deserved. I suppose Renault got back some of their people that went to Mercedes.
So they have really done a great job in Viry the last two years. Another thing is that Mc Laren is fully backing them, and you have never heard anything but positivty from Woking.
During the Hulkenberg race, he spent several dozen laps behind Raikkonen. He could not overtake him even with DRS and complained about the speed of Alfa on straights The Renault engine is definitely better than Honda but leading duo is still ahead.
Prost says only the Ferrari is more potent... and mainly in Qualy, based on very precise datas.
Hulkenberg wasnt running the spec B, but he mostly complained about the impossibility to catch the Sauber in the curves due to the df loss because of the turbulences and due to the track characteristics. He says he was 0.2s faster than the Sauber on the paper.
So the Sauber's biggest adantage was the clean air. It had a (rather small) engine avantage and had probably less df and drag.

Jambier
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Re: Renault Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by Jambier » Wed Jun 26, 2019 2:56 pm

All this prove that:

You should get stable rules, and let them work
Both Honda and Renault are making good progress to catch the top

On chassis' side there is a lot to do, and FIA is wrong in changing rules so often, it only helps big teams with big resources

JordanMugen
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Re: Renault Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by JordanMugen » Wed Jun 26, 2019 3:39 pm

Carl Mccoy wrote:
Mon Jun 24, 2019 3:22 pm
During the Hulkenberg race, he spent several dozen laps behind Raikkonen. He could not overtake him even with DRS and complained about the speed of Alfa on straights The Renault engine is definitely better than Honda but leading duo is still ahead.
Renault chassis has much more drag (and downforce) than the Alfa Romeo, so comparing the two explains little about the power unit. McLaren has a low drag car similar to Alfa Romeo, it would be best to compare Alfa Romeo and McLaren straight line speed.

Jambier
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Location: France

Re: Renault Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by Jambier » Tue Jul 02, 2019 8:33 am

The engine seems to be better and better.

In Austria we saw again for a few times how good it was in the Mclaren.
With the Mercedes engine in very safe mode on this race, Renault was second best engine :D

carisi2k
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Re: Renault Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by carisi2k » Sat Jul 06, 2019 10:32 am

Jambier wrote:
Tue Jul 02, 2019 8:33 am
The engine seems to be better and better.

In Austria we saw again for a few times how good it was in the Mclaren.
With the Mercedes engine in very safe mode on this race, Renault was second best engine :D
except it was clearly outdragged by the merc on the first lap and subsequently passed easily by a ferrari and even the Honda powered Red Bull.

GhostF1
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Re: Renault Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by GhostF1 » Sat Jul 06, 2019 1:33 pm

Jambier wrote:
Tue Jul 02, 2019 8:33 am
The engine seems to be better and better.

In Austria we saw again for a few times how good it was in the Mclaren.
With the Mercedes engine in very safe mode on this race, Renault was second best engine :D
In qualifying, Honda and Renault and level pegging for peak speeds reached, both still a clear step below Merc and Ferrari. I can't see where people believe Renault are equal to Merc. It's definitely not the case yet. This does not mean they haven't improved, they ahve dramatically, it's just also true that Honda have improved quicker to equal them.

Before Austria, RB and Toro Rosso both claimed Renault looked stronger in quali but they were confident Honda was better during the race. This was mentioned many times. What isn't clear now is where everyone stands now Honda unlocked more power in Austria. Silverstone will be a good watch in this regard.

Bill
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Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2018 9:28 am

Re: Renault Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by Bill » Sat Jul 06, 2019 5:32 pm

A lot of energy 24 7 bombardment on this thread has been spent to prob up Renault and portray them as better than Honda, you would think that some of you are pr people for Renault . I mean what am missing they are 4 engines manufactures and each as strength and weakness no pu is predominantly the best.

Juzh
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Re: Renault Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by Juzh » Sun Jul 07, 2019 12:18 pm

Bill wrote:
Sat Jul 06, 2019 5:32 pm
I mean what am missing they are 4 engines manufactures and each as strength and weakness no pu is predominantly the best.
Except ferrari, which predominantly is in fact the best, and it's not even close sometimes (austria for example).

As for the honda vs renault, much more will be clear after silverstone. In austria red bull was easily faster on the straights than mclaren in both quali and race, when it was exactly the opposite in france. It was said honda had much better tunning ready for austria and was able to run more power, which makes sense. As it stands I think we're assuming lots of things on too little sample size. Silverstone will give us a much clearer picture of where the engines stand.

mclaren111
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Location: Shithole - South Africa

Re: Renault Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by mclaren111 » Sun Jul 07, 2019 1:28 pm

carisi2k wrote:
Sat Jul 06, 2019 10:32 am
Jambier wrote:
Tue Jul 02, 2019 8:33 am
The engine seems to be better and better.

In Austria we saw again for a few times how good it was in the Mclaren.
With the Mercedes engine in very safe mode on this race, Renault was second best engine :D
except it was clearly outdragged by the merc on the first lap and subsequently passed easily by a ferrari and even the Honda powered Red Bull.

Norris said he was taking it easy in the opening laps to save tyres...

I read an article where Seidl said Renault gained 50 - 60 Bhp over the winter...

Let's hope they keep it up...

carisi2k
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Re: Renault Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by carisi2k » Mon Jul 08, 2019 7:46 am

Oh yeah because the mercs were pushing really hard in Austria.

The Renault engine has improved but to state it was the second best engine is incorrect. Lando should have been able to breeze past Lewis in those first 2 drags on the first lap considering the issues that mercedes were having if Renault had the second best engine.

SmallSoldier
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Re: Renault Power Unit Hardware & Software

Post by SmallSoldier » Mon Jul 08, 2019 3:13 pm

carisi2k wrote:Oh yeah because the mercs were pushing really hard in Austria.

The Renault engine has improved but to state it was the second best engine is incorrect. Lando should have been able to breeze past Lewis in those first 2 drags on the first lap considering the issues that mercedes were having if Renault had the second best engine.
Agreed... But at the same time, Norris made a couple mistakes that didn’t placed him in the tow (that’s why Kimi also overtook him)... It wasn’t only a power deficit, but also how their exit out of the corner was and the positioning of the car to maximize the tow from the car in front




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