Intake Valve and Feliks' ideas

All that has to do with the power train, gearbox, clutch, fuels and lubricants, etc. Generally the mechanical side of Formula One.
User avatar
Feliks
4
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2007 9:10 am
Location: Krakow,Poland

Re: Intake Valve and Feliks' ideas

Post

Well, here in the film you can see that the valves are almost not open at higher revolutions .. The same is seen this opening, the air that is to enter the cylinder ..

And the sound that this mechanism produces is huge .. You can take my word for it that the whole sound (95%) of the four-stroke engine comes from the timing mechanism ...
My engine has only 5% of this mechanical sound,

But on the exhale ... world record ...evil

http://new4stroke.com/zawory%20napedzane.mp4

Andrew :D

User avatar
Feliks
4
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2007 9:10 am
Location: Krakow,Poland

Re: Intake Valve and Feliks' ideas

Post

Did you like my balloons? It is a buoyancy engine .. There are already such, but operate under water .. are exceptionally fuel efficient vehicles, which you once, then 3 seconds using energy and emerges again up .. Of course the circulation of Carnot have nothing to do, although in the level covers considerable distances but the faithful his followers will try to convince us that they have ... But they do not have an orthodoxy should not be ... despite teach this way at universities ...
First about the underwater glider, of course in English .. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Underwater_glider

If someone needs it, you can already buy it ... maybe even a sailboat would be towed :)

http://www.teledynemarine.com/slocum-gl ... tLineID=14

Technical parameters .. http://www.teledynemarine.com/Lists/Dow ... yHh0ayJsSM

We develop thinking further, not burdened by this Carnot ..

Andrew :D :D

User avatar
Feliks
4
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2007 9:10 am
Location: Krakow,Poland

Re: Intake Valve and Feliks' ideas

Post

Do you know how much engine power goes to overcome losses in the timing mechanism? When designing, it is assumed that it is 10% of the maximum power of this engine .... But, after all, it is very rare to use the full maximum power .. to maintain speed in the city - 50 miles, usually not more than 20% of this is used maximum power .. .. But then the same amount of power goes to the camshaft ... as if we used the maximum power ... So, in fact, in driving in the city the timing drive goes up to 50% of the power used then ... we still have to overcome as much resistance as braking with a 4-stroke engine. I learned about it when I was driving a car with a two-stroke engine, which practically did not have engine braking ... So in summary - the timing drive and pressing the valve springs - I think, on average, there is 50% of the currently used power, which we need to overcome, thanks to our fuel. .. believe me.



Andrew :D

User avatar
Feliks
4
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2007 9:10 am
Location: Krakow,Poland

Re: Intake Valve and Feliks' ideas

Post

Here, such false graphs are:

https://x-engineer.org/automotive-engin ... Mba2uTqzBg

There was once a discussion on this subject .. I used to think so until 1980 ... But later I looked at it differently and I know, as a result of years of reflection and experience, that all this is sucked from the finger, these heat and mechanical losses, unfortunately .. Here is an evident example showing that the resistance to movement of the crankshaft and the camshaft is several times larger, so these charts are a complete fairy tale ..
And that's why they are not building new efficient engines ... previous engineers. and until they revise their views, they will not build a better engine .. Here you stubbornly do not see that my engine with the same capacity, the main piston sucks 3 TIMES more air into the cylinder, and you try to compare it to a traditional engine that sucks 3 times less ,, And you say that the losses on my pistons according to these graphs are much larger .. Yes, maybe (but I'm not sure) but they suck these 3 times more charge into the cylinder and This is an undeniable physical basis, but my engine must be more efficient , no matter whether you acknowledge or not...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oP1n0N_ ... e=youtu.be

You can see that the shaft itself is very light, you can turn the hand, it is very difficult to mount the camshafts, even using a long arm wrench .. I think that even 5 times more force is needed for this .. I used to rotate several engines that I modernized and I repaired and I know that this is a big difference in this strength .. And this will also be confirmed by every efficient engine mechanic...
And that's why modern engineers, unfortunately, put them down and are unable to make a working engine from 23 HP to 250 HP ... and until they start to find out, however, it is, they will not do it ... And I do a lot so that they deign find out ... until health allows.

Image

These and this graph shows that the valve train movement resistance, despite increasing the turnover by 6 times, does not consume more energy .. It's some wonders, because they also have their inertia, and bearing resistance also increases, similarly to the resistance in shaft bearings crankshaft ... and as a result of increasing turnover from 1000 to 6000, this green space should be much wider ... .. and this indicates a very unreliable development of this chart. Because the valves also have their inertia, which increases with the square of revolutions, and thus the friction in the drive system of these valves also ...


Andrew :D

gruntguru
gruntguru
454
Joined: Sat Feb 21, 2009 6:43 am

Re: Intake Valve and Feliks' ideas

Post

Feliks wrote:
Thu Nov 14, 2019 2:48 pm
These and this graph shows that the valve train movement resistance, despite increasing the turnover by 6 times, does not consume more energy .. It's some wonders, because they also have their inertia, and bearing resistance also increases, similarly to the resistance in shaft bearings crankshaft ... and as a result of increasing turnover from 1000 to 6000, this green space should be much wider ... .. and this indicates a very unreliable development of this chart. Because the valves also have their inertia, which increases with the square of revolutions, and thus the friction in the drive system of these valves also ...
The graph is not energy vs rpm or power vs rpm. It is FMEP vs rpm which is equivalent to torque vs rpm. What it tells you is the torque required to actuate the valves is fairly constant wrt rpm. This means the energy (power) required increases linearly with rpm.

Most of the friction is camshaft/lifter friction which is likely boundary lubrication (higher u) at low speeds and probably a mixture of boundary and hydrodynamic (lower u) at higher speeds. Note the piston rings exhibit a similar effect for the same reasons.
je suis charlie

User avatar
Feliks
4
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2007 9:10 am
Location: Krakow,Poland

Re: Intake Valve and Feliks' ideas

Post

However, not the inertial forces that eventually turn into friction increase with the square of engine revolutions ..

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotational_energy

Andrew :D

gruntguru
gruntguru
454
Joined: Sat Feb 21, 2009 6:43 am

Re: Intake Valve and Feliks' ideas

Post

Feliks wrote:
Fri Nov 15, 2019 4:50 pm
However, not the inertial forces that eventually turn into friction increase with the square of engine revolutions ..
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotational_energy
Andrew :D
Image
There are essentially two dominant sources of normal force on the cam-lobe/follower interface - spring force and inertial force. Spring force is independent of engine rpm and (as you have pointed out) inertial forces increase with the square of engine rpm.
Looking at the above chart showing displacement velocity and acceleration for a typical camshaft, spring force is proportional to displacement or "lift" (blue trace, right side vertical axis 0-16mm) and inertial force is proportional to valve acceleration (grey trace, left side vertical axis -0.45 to +0.45 mm/deg/deg).

The sum of these two forces is therefore the sum of the blue and grey lines. The blue line doesn't change with rpm and the grey line expands above and below zero in proportion to rpm squared. The rpm limit of the cam/spring system is reached when the spring force is not sufficient to maintain contact between the cam follower and the cam at some point in the cycle. This will occur in the region where follower acceleration is toward the cam between 140* and 220* on the chart. This is the region where valve acceleration is provided by the spring, everywhere else the acceleration is provided by the cam pushing on the lifter.

So we can estimate the cam-lifter force throughout the cycle at the limiting rpm. Firstly, the grey curve will be expanded by a factor of about 5 so that the negative value at 180* is about equal to the positive force provided by the spring. The largest positive value of the inertial force (grey line) will now be about 16 vertical divisions (same as peak spring force) and occurs at 120* and 240*. At these points the spring force is about 2 divisions - lets say 6 divisions because I have assumed zero spring force with the valve on its seat which is clearly not so. So total cam/lifter force at its maximum is 16+6=22 divisions ie about 40% more than the highest spring force. At the same rpm the cam/lifter force between 140* and 220* is now reduced to almost zero, so over the complete cycle this force is no greater than it is at idle. The coefficient of friction (which is responsible for energy losses) is lower at high speed since the friction regime has changed from boundary to hydrodynamic.

The overall result is that friction torque stays fairly constant (as verified by experimental results) so friction power increases in direct proportion to rpm.
je suis charlie

User avatar
Feliks
4
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2007 9:10 am
Location: Krakow,Poland

Re: Intake Valve and Feliks' ideas

Post

gruntguru wrote:
Sun Nov 17, 2019 2:57 am
Feliks wrote:
Fri Nov 15, 2019 4:50 pm
However, not the inertial forces that eventually turn into friction increase with the square of engine revolutions ..
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotational_energy
Andrew :D
https://i.imgur.com/XhG0Gb0.jpg
There are essentially two dominant sources of normal force on the cam-lobe/follower interface - spring force and inertial force. Spring force is independent of engine rpm and (as you have pointed out) inertial forces increase with the square of engine rpm.
Looking at the above chart showing displacement velocity and acceleration for a typical camshaft, spring force is proportional to displacement or "lift" (blue trace, right side vertical axis 0-16mm) and inertial force is proportional to valve acceleration (grey trace, left side vertical axis -0.45 to +0.45 mm/deg/deg).

The sum of these two forces is therefore the sum of the blue and grey lines. The blue line doesn't change with rpm and the grey line expands above and below zero in proportion to rpm squared. The rpm limit of the cam/spring system is reached when the spring force is not sufficient to maintain contact between the cam follower and the cam at some point in the cycle. This will occur in the region where follower acceleration is toward the cam between 140* and 220* on the chart. This is the region where valve acceleration is provided by the spring, everywhere else the acceleration is provided by the cam pushing on the lifter.

So we can estimate the cam-lifter force throughout the cycle at the limiting rpm. Firstly, the grey curve will be expanded by a factor of about 5 so that the negative value at 180* is about equal to the positive force provided by the spring. The largest positive value of the inertial force (grey line) will now be about 16 vertical divisions (same as peak spring force) and occurs at 120* and 240*. At these points the spring force is about 2 divisions - lets say 6 divisions because I have assumed zero spring force with the valve on its seat which is clearly not so. So total cam/lifter force at its maximum is 16+6=22 divisions ie about 40% more than the highest spring force. At the same rpm the cam/lifter force between 140* and 220* is now reduced to almost zero, so over the complete cycle this force is no greater than it is at idle. The coefficient of friction (which is responsible for energy losses) is lower at high speed since the friction regime has changed from boundary to hydrodynamic.

The overall result is that friction torque stays fairly constant (as verified by experimental results) so friction power increases in direct proportion to rpm.
Well, it's not like you are trying to describe it .. This is where you came to the specialist for cams ... :D firstly, both speed and acceleration increase with revolutions also .. and all inertial forces in this mechanism turn into friction, because they increase, but already the square of revolutions .. So the amount of energy to drive the mechanism increases with the square, because you do not eliminate friction .. And the skin increases with the square, it is unfortunately also energy, although you wish otherwise ... (and not only you ) ..
Already in 1980, I corrected the computer program for cams with a pencil, because I did not want to draw the basic element of cams.
Image
I have been working with cams since 1974, as together with my colleague Maciek Halczyński we made camshafts for sports at home, because we could not afford the original , because the monthly earnings of our wives were $ 10 per month ... so there was no way out, you had to do it yourself because some sort of costs cost $ 100 here with number && we are on the start list of such a rally with the starting number 77.

http://www.kwa-kwa.pl/strona/polska-raj ... A0btsNIe6U

I professionally dealt with electronics and sound control in music, but Maciek opened a specialist plant for regeneration and production of camshafts for sports. And he was constantly exchanging experiences with me ... Yes, even now, we know what and what companies hurt in camshafts. Yes, I understand the whole mechanism thoroughly, both from the theoretical and practical side ... ..

http://rewar.prv.pl/index.htm

And practically, it is enough to reduce the gear from higher to lower, then it is known that the engine braking power increases enormously .. even this experience can be done with candles turned off, so that there is "no compression" and then tow behind another car ... after reducing the gear , both vehicles brake quite well ...
You already know about camshafts, here about my work for the sound console in 1992 .. :D

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ckUTAQGHO-c

Andrew :D

User avatar
Feliks
4
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2007 9:10 am
Location: Krakow,Poland

Re: Intake Valve and Feliks' ideas

Post

And here, as if someone wants to calculate the displacement of a new engine ... and thus everything you need then, is different from the current engine ..
and the first weld, which you will not see on the animation ... that the minimum volume of the combustion chamber is 370 degrees of rotation of the main crankshaft ..


http://new4stroke.com/volume/volume.htm


http://new4stroke.com/volume/volume.xls


Andrew :D

gruntguru
gruntguru
454
Joined: Sat Feb 21, 2009 6:43 am

Re: Intake Valve and Feliks' ideas

Post

Feliks wrote:
Sun Nov 17, 2019 8:55 pm
Well, it's not like you are trying to describe it .. This is where you came to the specialist for cams ... :D firstly, both speed and acceleration increase with revolutions also .. and all inertial forces in this mechanism turn into friction, because they increase, but already the square of revolutions .. So the amount of energy to drive the mechanism increases with the square, because you do not eliminate friction .. And the skin increases with the square, it is unfortunately also energy, although you wish otherwise ... (and not only you ) ..
https://link.springer.com/article/10.10 ... 016-0107-9
Extract (Page 11.)

Image

You are entitled to disagree with published peer reviewed articles and the data gathered from actual testing, but don't expect anyone to agree with you unless you post some ACTUAL DATA that supports your <> theory.

<edited for language>
je suis charlie

User avatar
Feliks
4
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2007 9:10 am
Location: Krakow,Poland

Re: Intake Valve and Feliks' ideas

Post

gruntguru wrote:
Sun Nov 17, 2019 11:38 pm
Feliks wrote:
Sun Nov 17, 2019 8:55 pm
Well, it's not like you are trying to describe it .. This is where you came to the specialist for cams ... :D firstly, both speed and acceleration increase with revolutions also .. and all inertial forces in this mechanism turn into friction, because they increase, but already the square of revolutions .. So the amount of energy to drive the mechanism increases with the square, because you do not eliminate friction .. And the skin increases with the square, it is unfortunately also energy, although you wish otherwise ... (and not only you ) ..
https://link.springer.com/article/10.10 ... 016-0107-9
Extract (Page 11.)

https://i.imgur.com/Y5EFyRS.jpg

You are entitled to disagree with published peer reviewed articles and the data gathered from actual testing, but don't expect anyone to agree with you unless you post some ACTUAL DATA that supports your <> theory.

<edited for language>
This is not just my theory ... it is a general theory that has always been in mechanics ... which should be known ...
This colorful graph, made by ignorant people, does not exaggerate what the engine has, the nice green color "describes" its need for energy in terms of revolutions ..
So, let it be, desmodronic timing, which has no springs at all ..

Image

The demand for energy to drive such a timing is definitely in line with the square of revolutions ... at which it works ... not only such a timing, but every slide timing, also needs energy and it also increases with the square of revolutions, according to general mechanical theory. .
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rotational_energy

So for 1 we will take 1000 RPM and for 6 6000 RPM, the increase in energy in this range will be ... (1) squared, i.e. = 1, and, (6) squared, i.e. = 36 .. so this green bar on the right it should be 36 times wider .. but it is the same, and you can see that it is only the pious wishes of the illustrator sa, and not real values. We can now assume that instead of a closing cam, in normal popular timing, it is replaced by a spring that thunders energy earlier when it is pressed, then close the valve. And not driving the cam, which at high speed barely touches, and sometimes breaks away from it, because the energy as it is available is too small to close the valve. But on the basis of such unreliable charts, new adepts of mechanical art learn, and even after 100 years of experience they still produce such camshafts,
Here is a photo I took with Maciek, who thanks to this he perfectly adds to his retirement in his workshop, regenerating such camshafts from Audi V6.

Image


Well, well, even big companies are cheating, which was detected in terms of their data regarding the pollutants they emit ... (by the way my engine does not produce them, because the elements in the combustion chamber do not have a higher temperature than 350 degrees Celsius and NOx is not generated, similarly to engines with opposing pistons)
So on about people coloring pictures nicely with the help of their preschoolers, discussing makes no sense.
Anyway, the most powerful bomber engine during World War II was a springless valve, such a Hercules engine ...

Image

Andrew :D

J.A.W.
J.A.W.
92
Joined: Mon Sep 01, 2014 4:10 am
Location: Altair IV.

Re: Intake Valve and Feliks' ideas

Post

Andrew, you may find some epicyclic interest here:

http://www.douglas-self.com/MUSEUM/POWE ... parsep.htm
Dr Moreau sez..
"Who breaks the law... goes back to the House of Pain!"

User avatar
Feliks
4
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2007 9:10 am
Location: Krakow,Poland

Re: Intake Valve and Feliks' ideas

Post

That's right, but you can always buy a German product at home, which is the 3rd type of energy on Earth .. And the one who set the law is Lord Kelwin, who thought that birds fly because it is a divine matter ... But that's nobody this sharp view of reality bothers and many repeat it ...
But here is this German idea ...



Andrew :roll:

User avatar
Feliks
4
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2007 9:10 am
Location: Krakow,Poland

Re: Intake Valve and Feliks' ideas

Post

This German idea works or doesn't work, but certainly when applied to my balloons it shows the way to go .. My balloons are not perpetuam motion, just a giant heat engine for low temperature, which has already been proven to work because the balloon is rising due to this relatively low temperature inside.
And this German way how to properly enlarge it, it will work, enabling the previously wasted energy released into the air to use, and it can be energy released into the air from a coal-fired power plant, gas-fired power plant, or four-stroke energy engine (atomic power plants also), which only have no more than 50% efficiency, and the rest they release into the atmosphere And now maybe even with 40% of this energy can be used for electricity production, which can even give 90% of the total efficiency to give us such a new power plant ... 

Well, such "balloons" would have to have dimensions of 10 x 20 x 10 meters, and they could be built like scenes at outdoor concerts .. but the skin weight would be balanced, as well as thermal illumination in the form of foam polystyrene lining could be done .. No only the height of the tower is a problem .. Al I think that the height of 200 meters is quite real, that is, say, these 6 pieces of such "balloons" on this tower could work on one side, which would give a pull of up to 3000 KG ..

Well, for example, exhaust fumes from a diesel power plant could be introduced there, and with cooling hot water too .. So theoretically 50% of this heat energy lost in such a power plant could be forced to work ...

Image

Even water vapor could also be used to fill a "balloon" .. its weight is only about 0.5 KG at a temperature of 80 degrees Celsius ..
hot air pump, e.g. power plant chimney ...
and works 24 hours a day regardless of the weather ..


Andrew :D

User avatar
Big Tea
88
Joined: Sun Dec 24, 2017 7:57 pm

Re: Intake Valve and Feliks' ideas

Post

Would a Stirling engine not be more efficient and simpler?
One test is worth a thousand expert opinions