IndyCar Series

Please discuss here all your remarks and pose your questions about all racing series, except Formula One. Both technical and other questions about GP2, Touring cars, IRL, LMS, ...
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Big Tea
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Re: IndyCar Series

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subcritical71 wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:20 pm
Big Tea wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 6:20 pm
Any one know what the truth is with ALON? The so-called 'Transparent Aluminum'?

There are many different opinions of if it is the real deal or so specialist we can forget it.
I think its still reserved for smaller scale projects...

http://www.surmet.com/technology/alon-o ... /index.php
They show a large pane in that, but it is flat, not curved. It seems ok to curve it as they mention domes that optics have to work through.
I am very much in favour of filtered water. Preferably passed through a brewery

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subcritical71
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Re: IndyCar Series

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Big Tea wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:22 pm
subcritical71 wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:20 pm
Big Tea wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 6:20 pm
Any one know what the truth is with ALON? The so-called 'Transparent Aluminum'?

There are many different opinions of if it is the real deal or so specialist we can forget it.
I think its still reserved for smaller scale projects...

http://www.surmet.com/technology/alon-o ... /index.php
They show a large pane in that, but it is flat, not curved. It seems ok to curve it as they mention domes that optics have to work through.
Yeah, but those are really small compared to the size required for an IndyCar. I thought I read somewhere they were creating cockpit canopies out of the stuff, but can't seem to find the article.

Jolle
Jolle
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Re: IndyCar Series

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subcritical71 wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:26 pm
Big Tea wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:22 pm
subcritical71 wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 7:20 pm


I think its still reserved for smaller scale projects...

http://www.surmet.com/technology/alon-o ... /index.php
They show a large pane in that, but it is flat, not curved. It seems ok to curve it as they mention domes that optics have to work through.
Yeah, but those are really small compared to the size required for an IndyCar. I thought I read somewhere they were creating cockpit canopies out of the stuff, but can't seem to find the article.
What I've read about ALON, is that it isn't really transparent aluminium what we know from Star Trek but glass with a high component of aluminium oxide. It's more like the next generation of artificial sapphire glass. So it's excellent for lenses and sensor glasses. For strength against impact style applications, it still needs a frame.

Just_a_fan
Just_a_fan
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Re: IndyCar Series

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Andres125sx wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 5:30 pm
Just_a_fan wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 10:34 am
The clue is that the fighter canopy is a canopy and not a screen. A canopy is inherently more robust because it doesn't have a huge hole cut in the top of it. We've been through this already.
What´s the reason to not implement a solid arc made of steel or carbon fiber at the top so the screen goes into a closed frame? Imagine current halo without the front leg, and a screen going from the top arc of the halo down to the cockpit
The front leg does two things - it stops stuff coming in from the front, and it supports the front of the hoop.

The hoop will be relying on the screen to help transfer vertical loads down on to the chassis in your idea. This might be possible but I don't know the characteristics of the screen material. Without the support from the front leg / screen, the rear mounting points of the hoop will have to resist some very large moments from any vertical load at the front of the hoop. These loads will have to transferred in to the chassis tub. That may, or may not, be feasible. It may be easy or it might require lots of additional material in this area. Any laterally applied loads at the front of the hoop are also resisted by the front leg. These loads apply a shear force in to the front leg's mounting to the chassis. The screen would have to take these lateral loads which may not be a problem depending on the material characteristics. If the screen can't resist these loads, the hoop's rear mounts will be subjected to higher shearing forces as the hoop's length makes it a long lever.

I'm sure these issues could be solved, however it may be that doing so is not worth the effort. The cost/benefit balance isn't great if the only benefit is "aesthetics".
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"

Jolle
Jolle
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Re: IndyCar Series

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if any open cockpit racing series would go closed cockpit/canopy, the logical and safest way to do that is to fit a roll cage under it, like in LMP1. This way you're not relying on polycarbonate or other transparent plastic for high impact. Basically a covered halo.

Just_a_fan
Just_a_fan
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Re: IndyCar Series

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Adding a cage inside the canopy is going to require even more space and thus the external size will be larger. Any system that around the head must allow room for the head to move without impacting the system.
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"

roon
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Re: IndyCar Series

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Just_a_fan wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 9:41 pm
Adding a cage inside the canopy is going to require even more space and thus the external size will be larger. Any system that around the head must allow room for the head to move without impacting the system.
Add it outside. :P

Just_a_fan
Just_a_fan
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Re: IndyCar Series

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A cage outside a canopy. Heard it all now! :lol:
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"

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strad
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Re: IndyCar Series

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I have a polycarbonate polish from a car care company that has left a number of projects crystal clear. :?
To achieve anything, you must be prepared to dabble on the boundary of disaster.”
Sir Stirling Moss

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strad
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Re: IndyCar Series

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The first tests with Opticor were deemed a success so I wonder why they haven't proceeded.
The material is designed to be able to withstand a four-pound bird strike at over 400 mph. That should make it strong enough for the Indy 500.
To achieve anything, you must be prepared to dabble on the boundary of disaster.”
Sir Stirling Moss

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Big Tea
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Re: IndyCar Series

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The problem with fitting a cage is being able to get in and out. The clear panels could be framed or supported but there has to be a hole large enough for the driver to enter/egress in what ever condition he may be. A fit driver will thread through anywhere but after a 200 mph shock, it may not be so easy even if he is 'un broken'


Edit, we are getting back to halo here
I am very much in favour of filtered water. Preferably passed through a brewery

Just_a_fan
Just_a_fan
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Re: IndyCar Series

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strad wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 10:50 pm
The first tests with Opticor were deemed a success so I wonder why they haven't proceeded.
The material is designed to be able to withstand a four-pound bird strike at over 400 mph. That should make it strong enough for the Indy 500.
2kg bird at 180m/s is a decent bit less energy to deal with than a 10kg wheel/tyre at 90m/s.
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"

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Big Tea
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Re: IndyCar Series

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strad wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 10:50 pm
The first tests with Opticor were deemed a success so I wonder why they haven't proceeded.
The material is designed to be able to withstand a four-pound bird strike at over 400 mph. That should make it strong enough for the Indy 500.
Fresh or frozen :mrgreen:
I am very much in favour of filtered water. Preferably passed through a brewery

Just_a_fan
Just_a_fan
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Re: IndyCar Series

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Big Tea wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 11:20 pm
strad wrote:
Mon Mar 04, 2019 10:50 pm
The first tests with Opticor were deemed a success so I wonder why they haven't proceeded.
The material is designed to be able to withstand a four-pound bird strike at over 400 mph. That should make it strong enough for the Indy 500.
Fresh or frozen :mrgreen:
:lol: :lol:
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"

roon
roon
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Re: IndyCar Series

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Pretty fast for a bird, regardless.