Macau GP 2018

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Sieper
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Re: Macau GP 2018

Post by Sieper » Mon Nov 19, 2018 1:47 pm

What an horrible Accident. I hope she (and the others involved) recover well, dreadful.

Macau is a dangerous track but perhaps these F3 cars are also exceptionally vulnerable. Baku and the likes could also (although way wider) potentially see such accidents but with even higher F1 speeds, but just maybe these F3 cars are more susceptible to sending each other flying then F1 cars. Or maybe simply the fact that there are much more of them on track, often tangling with 3 4 at a time is the cause of this.

Just_a_fan
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Re: Macau GP 2018

Post by Just_a_fan » Mon Nov 19, 2018 2:12 pm

Another accident where a halo device might have been beneficial if the car had hit anywhere else on the tower rather than the photography aperture.

Also, the driver she flew over was very lucky not to have his head taken off.
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jjn9128
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Re: Macau GP 2018

Post by jjn9128 » Mon Nov 19, 2018 2:49 pm

turbof1 wrote:
Mon Nov 19, 2018 1:35 pm
In 2020 (or if they move ahead possibly next year), the engines will make a jump from 200bhp to 275-300bhp. If this circuit is posing these kind of dangers now already, then it will be even worse when they get more power, more weight and more speed.
Macau is FIA grade 3 - which is for cars with weight/power = 2 to 3kg/hp. The F3 car is 580kg (not sure if just car or car plus driver?) - assuming 2020 is with halo and more current impact rules that's going to climb closer to or above 600kg. So at 600kg weight/power just qualifies still with 300bhp. If the engine power jump is with a turbo the FIA/organisers may specify a maximum boost at each track. So for example grade 1 tracks like Hockenheimring may have 300bhp, but grade 3 like Macau may have 250bhp, grade 2 275bhp. Could also be done by altering the restrictor size if naturally aspirated.
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turbof1
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Re: Macau GP 2018

Post by turbof1 » Mon Nov 19, 2018 2:50 pm

Reports coming in that she has been operated on the C7 vertebra. Spinal chord was unharmed and there were no signs of paralysis.

https://www.essentiallysports.com/updat ... h-surgery/
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Shakeman
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Re: Macau GP 2018

Post by Shakeman » Mon Nov 19, 2018 2:58 pm

turbof1 wrote:
Mon Nov 19, 2018 2:50 pm
Reports coming in that she has been operated on the C7 vertebra. Spinal chord was unharmed and there were no signs of paralysis.

https://www.essentiallysports.com/updat ... h-surgery/
That is absolutely fantastic news, it's almost unbelievable considering that impact. Praise should go to the track side medical team for managing the extrication process so capably.

Manoah2u
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Re: Macau GP 2018

Post by Manoah2u » Mon Nov 19, 2018 5:36 pm

amazing luck btw that her head indeed went into the opening of the booth. though the car obviously has a roll hoop, you never know what might have happened even with it.
Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools.

Jolle
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Re: Macau GP 2018

Post by Jolle » Mon Nov 19, 2018 6:52 pm

turbof1 wrote:
Mon Nov 19, 2018 2:50 pm
Reports coming in that she has been operated on the C7 vertebra. Spinal chord was unharmed and there were no signs of paralysis.

https://www.essentiallysports.com/updat ... h-surgery/
The C7 is where your neck goes into your back and the part that is bent the most when you’re in a formula car. That could mean she did get a bump on top of her head to fracture that, either from contact with the bunker or a heavy impact on the ground after the crash.

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Re: Macau GP 2018

Post by turbof1 » Mon Nov 19, 2018 7:02 pm

Jolle wrote:
Mon Nov 19, 2018 6:52 pm
turbof1 wrote:
Mon Nov 19, 2018 2:50 pm
Reports coming in that she has been operated on the C7 vertebra. Spinal chord was unharmed and there were no signs of paralysis.

https://www.essentiallysports.com/updat ... h-surgery/
The C7 is where your neck goes into your back and the part that is bent the most when you’re in a formula car. That could mean she did get a bump on top of her head to fracture that, either from contact with the bunker or a heavy impact on the ground after the crash.
Honestly, between the hefty bump from the steep kerb launching her into the air, hitting the fence, hitting the bunker and crashing back down onto the ground, it's miraculous she only has a single broken vertebra without spinal cord injury.

Let's also not forget the other victims. All seem to be ok, with Tsuboi and photographer Minami already left the hospital, marshal Cha to be released in 4 days and photographer Wang to be expected to be released in 10 days. There will probably be some lasting consequences in one shape or another, if not physical than mental, but given the size of the crash all will walk away from it in relative good shape.
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Just_a_fan
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Re: Macau GP 2018

Post by Just_a_fan » Mon Nov 19, 2018 8:28 pm

Manoah2u wrote:
Mon Nov 19, 2018 5:36 pm
amazing luck btw that her head indeed went into the opening of the booth. though the car obviously has a roll hoop, you never know what might have happened even with it.
I've watched it a few times now and looked at the photo of her car immediately after the impact - I don't think he head did go in to the gap - I think the roll hoop did.

Image

Looking at the car, the roll hoop appears to be undamaged/unmarked. The engine cover has been trashed and the cockpit surround looks to be damaged. I wonder if the reason she fractured a vertebra is because of an impact on the helmet. The high cockpit sides definitely took most of the hit, however.

She was also lucky in that the fence took some of the energy out before the impact with the stand behind. Also the rear of the car hit the stand first too which also helped.

Whatever the details, racing is lucky not to be mourning a death...
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools."

Polite
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Re: Macau GP 2018

Post by Polite » Mon Nov 19, 2018 8:32 pm

Good news for her: the surgery is over and succesful! No spinal cord damage [-o<

piast9
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Re: Macau GP 2018

Post by piast9 » Mon Nov 19, 2018 9:11 pm

I was thinking about this accident for a while. In my opinion there are many tracks where similar one may occur. All you need is a braking zone into tight bend. If there is a collision at the start of the braking zone that causes the car to loose front wheels or which breaks the front wing that goes under the car and huge shunt may happen like for example infamous Grosjean SPA 2012 one. As I recall there have been several serous ones at the Monaco chicane. But in neither of these places there is a photo tower at the shooting line of the out of control car...

Manoah2u
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Re: Macau GP 2018

Post by Manoah2u » Mon Nov 19, 2018 9:20 pm

Just_a_fan wrote:
Mon Nov 19, 2018 8:28 pm
Manoah2u wrote:
Mon Nov 19, 2018 5:36 pm
amazing luck btw that her head indeed went into the opening of the booth. though the car obviously has a roll hoop, you never know what might have happened even with it.
I've watched it a few times now and looked at the photo of her car immediately after the impact - I don't think he head did go in to the gap - I think the roll hoop did.

https://cdn.newsapi.com.au/image/v1/184 ... ?width=700

Looking at the car, the roll hoop appears to be undamaged/unmarked. The engine cover has been trashed and the cockpit surround looks to be damaged. I wonder if the reason she fractured a vertebra is because of an impact on the helmet. The high cockpit sides definitely took most of the hit, however.

She was also lucky in that the fence took some of the energy out before the impact with the stand behind. Also the rear of the car hit the stand first too which also helped.

Whatever the details, racing is lucky not to be mourning a death...
whoa, you're absolutely right. as for the vertebrea damage due to helmet hitting the construction, that seems very plausible indeed.
Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools.

Jolle
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Re: Macau GP 2018

Post by Jolle » Mon Nov 19, 2018 11:55 pm

Manoah2u wrote:
Mon Nov 19, 2018 9:20 pm
Just_a_fan wrote:
Mon Nov 19, 2018 8:28 pm
Manoah2u wrote:
Mon Nov 19, 2018 5:36 pm
amazing luck btw that her head indeed went into the opening of the booth. though the car obviously has a roll hoop, you never know what might have happened even with it.
I've watched it a few times now and looked at the photo of her car immediately after the impact - I don't think he head did go in to the gap - I think the roll hoop did.

https://cdn.newsapi.com.au/image/v1/184 ... ?width=700

Looking at the car, the roll hoop appears to be undamaged/unmarked. The engine cover has been trashed and the cockpit surround looks to be damaged. I wonder if the reason she fractured a vertebra is because of an impact on the helmet. The high cockpit sides definitely took most of the hit, however.

She was also lucky in that the fence took some of the energy out before the impact with the stand behind. Also the rear of the car hit the stand first too which also helped.

Whatever the details, racing is lucky not to be mourning a death...
whoa, you're absolutely right. as for the vertebrea damage due to helmet hitting the construction, that seems very plausible indeed.
Part of her luck was probably that the armco of that bunker was quite high up and therefore "bent" more then armco right on the track.

This was one of the accidents where the Halo was designed for.

turbof1
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Re: Macau GP 2018

Post by turbof1 » Tue Nov 20, 2018 12:04 am

Jin told me the "bunker" used to be open in the past. The bunker is not made out of reinforced concrete (unlike the name suggest), but out of materials like steel, laminate, etc. Materials that luckily bent.
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Andres125sx
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Re: Macau GP 2018

Post by Andres125sx » Tue Nov 20, 2018 5:37 pm

turbof1 wrote:
Tue Nov 20, 2018 12:04 am
Jin told me the "bunker" used to be open in the past. The bunker is not made out of reinforced concrete (unlike the name suggest), but out of materials like steel, laminate, etc. Materials that luckily bent.
I´ve been watching some pictures at the news from inside the bunker, there was a circular steel pilar noticeably bent


I agree the vertebrea damage could have been prevented with Halo