The battle of the establishment against the new pretender was evident yesterday. Both Motorsport.com and Autosport posted ‘exclusive’ articles revealing Michelin were pitching to return as a tyre supplier to F1 in 2017.
Michelin’s motorsport boss Pascal Couasnon says, “One of the extremely important things is that in addition to providing a show with technology and tyres that correspond to something, we would like to get closer to everyday life.
“We want this technology that would be put in the tyres to reach the high-end road car products. It would be something,” according to Motorsport.com.
Decoded, that means durable tyres that deliver high performance grip.
The same Michelin representative tells Autosport they will persist with their proposal to deliver bulletproof tyres for Formula One. “The reasoning is we’ve been proposing ideas, talking about Formula 1 and that we are disappointed, especially where it is today tyre-wise.
Michelin are not happy with the current notion of tyres designed to ‘artificially’ degrade and Couasnon adds, “In making a proposal we are trying to change the situation a little. We believe the image of tyres in Formula 1 is not what we would like to do, or makes sense.
“The tyre used as an object you throw away after a few laps, or whatever, is not really something that is good for the tyre industry.
“We say there’s another way to ensure a good show, as we saw over the weekend (at Le Mans), with high-technology tyres lasting with good grip, and you can have a show.”
Of course Le Mans is a 24 hour race, and so tyres lasting for two hours still requires 12 changes of rubber during the race. The comparison is therefore null and void.
Michelin also are making it clear that there is a line in the sand regarding the wheel rim size. They want 18 inch wheel rims because this is more relevant to road cars.
“It’s clear that even if we go through the FIA process and they say: ‘You can get in but with the 13-inch’, then it won’t go further,” said Couasnon.
18-inch wheels would send the teams back to the drawing board as their current chassis and aero designs would be incompatible.
The FIA deadline for the F1 tyre tender to contract from 2017 expires today.
Michelin withdrew from F1 in 2006, because they refused to accept the single supplier concept Max Mosely had decided upon. However, the French tyre manufacturer has now changed their stance on this issue and is prepared to play ball again.
Jean Todt is believed to be in favour of Michelin as an F1 tyre supplier, but Bernie Ecclestone has recently been adamant that Michelin’s ideas are bad for Formula One.
Ecclestone recently commented, “[Michelin will]make a rock-hard tyre you could put on in January and take off in December because they don’t want to be in a position where they can be criticised”.
Couasnon’s rather desperate plea concludes, “We love the sport, but we believe there is something better than can be done today.
“We are not saying we are right, but at least we would like to contribute to the sport, and bring a little bit of innovation.”
Given the fact the teams do not want 18 inch tyres and neither does Bernie want Michelin as a supplier, the likely outcome appears to be that Pirelli will again be appointed as the F1 tyre supplier until 2019-20. Guys i dont think so, read this......from thejudge13
There is a balance between performance and durability. The FIA asked Pirelli to focus on performance, durability-wise 10-20 laps per set would be fine and spice up the racing.
I think Pirelli has kept that durabilty promise, but not the performance aspect of the tyres. I think they should have done a much better job at that. Hence, i'd love to see Michelin back in F1.
ME4ME wrote:There is a balance between performance and durability. The FIA asked Pirelli to focus on performance, durability-wise 10-20 laps per set would be fine and spice up the racing.
I think Pirelli has kept that durabilty promise, but not the performance aspect of the tyres. I think they should have done a much better job at that. Hence, i'd love to see Michelin back in F1.
If it's going to happen .. well probably not
Surely performance and durability are mutually exclusive when relating to Formula 1 tyres?
The tyres are designed to give performance for 15 laps, but the teams will always stretch them to 20 laps because it opens a better strategy.
If the tyres were then made to perform for 20 laps, teams would stretch to 25 to meet strategy.
I honestly don't think it's possible to do both *consistently across 19 circuits*
ChrisF1 wrote:Surely performance and durability are mutually exclusive when relating to Formula 1 tyres?
*
Yes that's what I mean with balance between them. But just between the balance is right doesn't mean the performance is acceptable.
For instance, say there were 3 tyres suppliers. All make tyres that last 15 laps. Inevitably there is going to be a difference in performance for those 15 laps between the 3 suppliers.
This is where I think Pirelli has under performed. Obviously it's hard to prove, cause there isn't any other supplier in F1 to compare with. But id like to think that Michelin could do a better job
Designing a tire as a single supplier is obviously not the same as designing a tire against competing manufacturers.
In a competition, designing a tire that last long is not good enough if that tire also isn't fast enough. Here there is always a tradeoff, a tire with a softer compound will be faster, but also wear faster.
With a single supplier, the tire is instead designed according to a certain desired specification. In such a situation you can design a tire that lasts very long without regard to performance - the result is boring races since lap times will be very consistent during the whole race. You can on the other hand set design goals that results in a tire that doesn't last very long, but without good performance - after all, there are no other manufacturers around to beat you. The current Pirellis are designed to offer a decent performance for a few laps, then slowly degrade in performance, and at the end, degrade rapidly (the so called "cliff").
So there isn't much point in comparing the current Pirelli tires with other tires. Neither will a "tire war" result in tires the drivers can "push" the whole race since such tires will cost too much in terms of performance.
Yesterday i read something about michelin. On AMS they said, bernie have a Sonsoringagreement whit Pirelli but no agreement about suppliing anything.
And jean todt give pirelli some pressure to built something that they cant, and michelin says we will built any tire, fast-durable-lot of grip, no problem..
Heres the translatet (ger/eng) text:
Will the FIA overwhelm Pirelli?
But the controversy over the new car also has a political dimension. Pirelli has the team declares that one can not build a tire that loads of 50 percent endure more. Unless you increase the tire pressures by 3 to 4 PSI. The but the drivers do not want. Because then the car in the slow corners lack mechanical grip are too slow. And since then the aerodynamic progress only 2 or 3 seconds arrive on the track.
therefore Pirelli stands up for the moderate revolution. The Italian tire manufacturer will not publicly admit that five seconds faster cars overwhelm the tires. Apparently constitutes FIA at precisely at this point. Pirelli has now closed with Bernie Ecclestone a commercial agreement to 2019, but not yet the supplier contract with the federation.
Michelin can build tires for each tempo
It is no secret that FIA president Jean Todt rather Michelin had in the boat. The French say they could build tires for each pace. But they also want to determine how the tires look like when they get the nod. However, the desired low-profile tires with low grip loss not taste many teams and Bernie Ecclestone.
Pirelli calls the Teams special tests for the wider tires. However, the teams refuse to specially provide test cars for. Michelin sees itself in a position to build tires for high requirements without testing. In Clermont-Ferrand is a tire test.
Observers suspect that the Michelin fans in the FIA try to force Pirelli about the car of the future in a corner. Depending unrealisable claims on Pirelli, the greater the chance that there one throws in the towel.
"In my time the Pit babe was there instead of the telemetry."
Gerhard Berger
Don't seem to be having a good time of it in Moto GP at the moment. Have had to bring in a tyre for the race with a different construction to the one being used all weekend due to delamination. All teams mandates to use this new tyre so an extra warm up session has been scheduled.
Madness.
NutritionFact wrote:Yesterday i read something about michelin. On AMS they said, bernie have a Sonsoringagreement whit Pirelli but no agreement about suppliing anything.
I know this is old news. But how did the story develope? Is Pirelli the old and new supplier of tyres or is it still in the air?
NutritionFact wrote:Yesterday i read something about michelin. On AMS they said, bernie have a Sonsoringagreement whit Pirelli but no agreement about suppliing anything.
I know this is old news. But how did the story develope? Is Pirelli the old and new supplier of tyres or is it still in the air?
Bernie signed Pirelli as the supplier to F1 from 2017 to 2019.
But Pirelli do not currently have a contract with the FIA.
NutritionFact wrote:Yesterday i read something about michelin. On AMS they said, bernie have a Sonsoringagreement whit Pirelli but no agreement about suppliing anything.
I know this is old news. But how did the story develope? Is Pirelli the old and new supplier of tyres or is it still in the air?
Bernie signed Pirelli as the supplier to F1 from 2017 to 2019.
But Pirelli do not currently have a contract with the FIA.
