New race car build

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sebring67
1
Joined: 14 Aug 2016, 14:15

Re: New race car build

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An idea,
The exhaust blown diffusor produces rear downforce when the throttle is applied and maintained. When the foot is taken off the throttle, the exhaust input into/through the diffusor significantly drops not to nothing obviously as the engine is still running, in addition you still have the usual flow through the diffusor from the flat floor/car moving forward.

The car will have fairly large side pods. One containing the rad the other the oil cooler. Airflow ducted through each from the intake to each side pod. Situate a high output fan in the ducting behing each, one behind the rad, one behind the oil cooler. Continue that ducting through a vent in the floor, one each side, direct that flow through the diffusor.

The diffusor would then be blown by,
1) Standard flow along the flat floor as the car moves forward
2) The exhaust (throttle dependent, reduced by some degree by left foot braking)
3) The flow through the side pods as the car moves forward augmented by the fans.

Jolle
132
Joined: 29 Jan 2014, 22:58
Location: Dordrecht

Re: New race car build

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Because of the fairly low speeds you will have to be quite "crude" if you want downforce. In F1 the normal downforce doesn't really come in to play below 100km/h (the blown diffuser was an exception because it works bit like the fan car from brabbam) and that's why everybody is having such massive wings on top of the drivers head.

What you'll need is low pressure under the car, so, Lotus style ground effect with lots of area and some good skirts to seal everything off

ChrisDanger
26
Joined: 30 Mar 2011, 09:59

Re: New race car build

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Can you have a duct that gets blocked by some actuator when the throttle is applied, but opens to the diffuser when releasing the throttle?

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Vyssion
Moderator / Writer
Joined: 10 Jun 2012, 14:40

Re: New race car build

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Tim.Wright wrote:I don't really see the point of the F1 diffuser as its one of the most heavily restricted aero components. Also, that diffuser was designed to be fed by a vertical opening in the floor to get around a loophole in the 2009 regs. If you aren't working to the same regs and/or your upstream geometry isn't the same as the original car I can't see the diffuser working well at all.
^ This...

I would be conservative in my expectations as to how "well" the F1 aero will actually perform. Of course the little kid inside me would be screaming out in excitement and happiness at the idea of using actual F1 parts in my very own race car, but the aerodynamicist in me would quickly have something to say about it #-o ...

My opinion is pretty much an echo of what has already been said aerodynamically speaking - the parts are optimized so meticulously for the unique F1 car that whilst I have no doubt that there will be "some" gain in downforce due to them being there, the system as a whole wont be functioning to its best potential.

From my quick scan of the regulations, it seems as though the only restrictions that are present which could affect aero are that there cant be any "active aero" systems, and that the car can't be more than 3300mm long and 1675mm wide... but it says nothing about a maximum height... I did find this list on a different website though - do these sound about right?
Wings:
Rear wing:
Foils are to be no higher than the highest point of the roll cage.
No further rearward than the rear of the car.
Not to exceed in width past the centre of the rear tyres.
Side plates maximum 300mm above the highest point of the roll cage and not to exceed 1500mm from the ground with the car in its normal racing position.
Side plates not to extend forward past the rear arch and not exceed 0.80 square metres in area.

Front wing:
Not to be mounted higher than top of the front tyre.
In general though, if the main issue of this series is that there is a lack of grip when cornering, then aero will only help you a little bit - most of that comes down to vehicle dynamics and suspension etc (which is out of my area of expertise!!) If the tracks are ovals though, I suppose then aero would play a better part in that - I would start with an underbody+diffuser with side skirts and a flat floor extension plate out to the maximum track width.

Following on from the list above of the rules, Since there is the most room to play with the front wing, I would start by designing that with as much planform area as possible in order to help offset the large rearward bias that you might have due to the engine and driver being at the back - you will be "somewhat" limited by your engine power, but if the speeds you are going at are somewhere in the region of 150-200km/hr then you may find that you can tune your aero to give you your drag-limited top speed based on the fastest you will go on some track. The rear wing will be trickier to just guess, but if you're after a quick solution to carry you through until you can design it properly based on all the upstream components, then I would grab a single (or double) element wing with a relatively high efficiency for a decent CL and just make it huge with a gurney flap and endplates which extend as far down as the regulations allow to help seal off the diffuser outflow and magnify the pressure drop on the suction side of the aerofoil(s). It may also be an idea to look into partially shrouding the wheels from the front and rear... Often open wheel formulas stipulate a maximum angle/distance of the top of the wheel which must be left uncovered, so depending on how specific that is, that will definitely help.
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sebring67
1
Joined: 14 Aug 2016, 14:15

Re: New race car build

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Thanks for the above reply i really appreciate it, the above regs regarding wing size and position are not for this cars championship. For this car they are totally free.

I also agree you cannot just buy F1 parts bolt them on and expect them to give you huge gains.

Im going with essentially the largest flat floor i can, side skirts (not sure what material to use for those yet?) and a pretty large front and rear wing. From the 2 wings i bought, i will be using parts of them and fabricating the rest. The rear for example, i am using the horizontal plane as looking at the specs it should be about right, i am then fabricating the end plates that will extend down towards the diffusor at the rear or the car, which i am also fabricating. Its a similar situation with the front wing, using part of the horizontal planes, fabricating the mounting points under the pretty high nose and making up a flatter section of wing to sit under the nose, then make some end plates.

None of the bits will be rushed and alot of thought will go into each part and how it interacts with the rest of the body.

I would be interested to know if in theory people think the idea above using fans and the blown diffusor may prove beneficial?

Thanks again and have a good day

Jolle
132
Joined: 29 Jan 2014, 22:58
Location: Dordrecht

Re: New race car build

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I would start odd with making the floor and skirts from plywood or plexiglas to prototype and when you'll find some results with it, make it out of some more durable and lighter material like aluminium and carbon sheets.

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JonoNic
4
Joined: 05 Mar 2015, 15:54

Re: New race car build

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Good luck with this project. Have you considered a super bike engine that is chain driven? The rear axle will be like a 100% locked LSD, but you will save weight that could be used to optimise aero... The rear suspension can be independent too.
Always find the gap then use it.

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Tim.Wright
330
Joined: 13 Feb 2009, 06:29

Re: New race car build

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What's the minimum weight?
Not the engineer at Force India

sebring67
1
Joined: 14 Aug 2016, 14:15

Re: New race car build

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Minimum weight is 375kg for the class, our car may be just under that allowing us to use some weight to balance the car.

The engine has to be an inline 4 cylinder engine up to 1.4L from an approved list of engines all of which are car engines.

From the list we chose the vauxhall 1.4 16 valve ecotec it will be running a vauxhall box and tran-x LSD.

Thanks

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andylaurence
123
Joined: 19 Jul 2011, 15:35
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Re: New race car build

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From what I've seen of ovals, they are slippery because of all the fluids on the track from banger racing and horrendously bumpy meaning a proper floor is going to give you massively variable downforce as the car skips over the bumps. The speeds are similar to Solo II in the USA. Have a look at the aero on A-Mod cars, which are similarly small and lightweight but often bike powered.