Voting system updates - Call for suggestions

Everything about this website and its content. Here you will find update announcements or requests for feedback. Questions about layout, functionality, content, and your suggestions are welcome.
SimRacer
SimRacer
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Re: Voting system updates - Call for suggestions

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I'm pretty new around here and so far in my short trip to this forum all I see regarding this "voting system" are people voting solely based upon their agreeing and liking to your stated opinions, nothing more, nothing less.

"Ahhh, you think Hamilton is a god of speed and carry Mercedes' cars on his back? Here have as many up votes as I can provide you!"

"You dislike Pirelli's tires? How dare you! Down vote!!!!"

"Anybody would take the championship in the W05 and W06 cars regardless. You're a fool: down vote!"

"Oh, you agree with what I've just said? How nice of you: up vote! Up, up, up!"

Pretty silly gimmick for adult men to care about if you ask me. :lol:

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Ciro Pabón
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Re: Voting system updates - Call for suggestions

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SimRacer wrote:Pretty silly gimmick for adult men to care about if you ask me. :lol:
Well, Don Ciro says there is an explanation, Simracer.

Simple: if anyone upvote this post, I'll upvote yours. Corretto?

Some day, and that day may never come, I`ll call upon you to do a service for me
Image

Btw, benvenuto al forum, mio cara.
Ciro

SimRacer
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Re: Voting system updates - Call for suggestions

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Thanks Ciro!! But I've had enough of this forum already. When you have its own moderators siding with bullies who down vote your opinion and try to shut you down just because they don't like what they hear you know you're on the wrong place. Especially when the moderator himself tells you to stop expressing opinion unless it reflects theirs... Wow!

Thanks all and enjoy this silly little ego game of yours.

BanMeToo
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Re: Voting system updates - Call for suggestions

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lmao if the voting system is going to stop you from enjoying the good parts this forum. Seems like you actually care a ton about the votes & points :roll: :roll:

J.A.W.
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Re: Voting system updates - Call for suggestions

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BanMeToo wrote:lmao if the voting system is going to stop you from enjoying the good parts this forum. Seems like you actually care a ton about the votes & points :roll: :roll:

Well, when the voting system for so-called reputation is supposed to be based on technical contribution,
but is in fact - clearly being abused by bullies who abuse the voting system for purely emotive ego-sensitivity reasons..

So yeah, for sure, that mode of SOP - does tend to debase it, & bring it into the contempt of fair-minded forum members..
Dr Moreau sez..
"Who breaks the law... goes back to the House of Pain!"

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Steven
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Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2002 5:32 pm
Location: Belgium

Re: Voting system updates - Call for suggestions

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People who are found to use the system the wrong way are notified or will get their permissions revoked.

Misuse however is usually because people do not realise enough that the system is intended to value technical and informative posts, instead of an "I agree" system. While things are properly described in the FAQ, it should possibly be more obvious to new members that the system is for this purpose, it's only a matter of how to do this.

One thing that can be considered it to add a popup on the upvote, similar to the popup you now get on the downvote. We could add a short bit of information there, plus a link to the FAQ. Would that help?

As for the downvotes on some of your posts, I can say that some of these posts have raised a few eyebrows among the moderators as well...

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Phil
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Re: Voting system updates - Call for suggestions

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I'm amazed any moderator or even site administrators are willing to stay with the current system and "moderate" the votes despite the majority of users probably using it the wrong way.

Personally, I'd just use the "upvotes". In theory, the down votes are a good idea, but they hardly get used for the right reasons and for post that really warrant a downvote, there's a report button right next to it which is probably more important.

I would appreciate a "i like / i agree" button and then make that one public and not anonymous. I think the anonymity with voting [downvotes] is its biggest downfall. Does it really need a system to downvote?
Not for nothing, Rosberg's Championship is the only thing that lends credibility to Hamilton's recent success. Otherwise, he'd just be the guy who's had the best car. — bhall II
#Team44 supporter

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Steven
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Re: Voting system updates - Call for suggestions

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Indeed Phil, downvotes are misused and abused more often that we would like.

I admit that its current use is going against the intention, which was to signal incorrect posts to other members. This has worked in some threads, but obviously it's used more frequently to rate down rants and spam, something that could probably be better handled by reporting it to the mods instead.

Maybe we can reduce downvote reasons and in the popup add a button to report the post, replacing the "ranting", and "spam" reasons.

I'm not ruling out removing the downvotes though. I'm curious what other people think as well...

As for transparency, the main reason for keeping voters hidden is to avoid reciprocating votes. If we'd make all that public (I agree that would be nice), how are we going to prevent this?

bhall II
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Re: Voting system updates - Call for suggestions

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Phil wrote:Does it really need a system to downvote?
Just do what I do, which is not vote. Ever.

It makes things so much easier when it's not even an option.

Besides, it doesn't take very long to discern between those whose posts are worthwhile and those whose input can probably be taken with a grain of salt, and "reputation" doesn't necessarily reflect what experience makes obvious.

My contributions, for instance, aren't even remotely worth the absurd number underneath my name.

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turbof1
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Re: Voting system updates - Call for suggestions

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I also feel the upvote part of the system could be reworked. For example a couple of days ago I put quite a bit of effort in a post where I mapped out Mclaren's front wing evolution throughout the season. I had to go through 250 pages to find out where which updates were introduced. I received one upvote for that post (which for the record I do appreciate; I didn't do it for upvotes either).

What makes this silly, is the contrast with an other post from me in the Red Bull team thread where I made quite a dry joke about their CASIO sponsor. Effort? 10s. It received 4 upvotes. It gives me the feeling people value the package much higher then the content.

Maybe the system should be more inviting to use in the technical threads, and less inviting in the other threads. I do think that in team threads, posts about the managerial/economic part of the sports should be open to receive upvotes. Is it perhaps possible to work with 0.5 or 0.25 reputation points in those threads? That way we can underline the technical threads better.

I'd also propose that moderators have their reputation visible? I don't see any reason why moderators should have the privilege to have their reputation hidden. I always valued playing open card a lot.

I was also thinking: is it possible for moderators to approve downvotes before they become effective? That would solve the issue. We have to check the mod control panel daily anyway, so if we can get a category in there, it would solve that issue at the cost of a little bit of extra moderation time.
#AeroFrodo

santos
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Re: Voting system updates - Call for suggestions

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turbof1 wrote:I also feel the upvote part of the system could be reworked. For example a couple of days ago I put quite a bit of effort in a post where I mapped out Mclaren's front wing evolution throughout the season. I had to go through 250 pages to find out where which updates were introduced. I received one upvote for that post (which for the record I do appreciate; I didn't do it for upvotes either).

What makes this silly, is the contrast with an other post from me in the Red Bull team thread where I made quite a dry joke about their CASIO sponsor. Effort? 10s. It received 4 upvotes. It gives me the feeling people value the package much higher then the content.

Maybe the system should be more inviting to use in the technical threads, and less inviting in the other threads. I do think that in team threads, posts about the managerial/economic part of the sports should be open to receive upvotes. Is it perhaps possible to work with 0.5 or 0.25 reputation points in those threads? That way we can underline the technical threads better.

I'd also propose that moderators have their reputation visible? I don't see any reason why moderators should have the privilege to have their reputation hidden. I always valued playing open card a lot.

I was also thinking: is it possible for moderators to approve downvotes before they become effective? That would solve the issue. We have to check the mod control panel daily anyway, so if we can get a category in there, it would solve that issue at the cost of a little bit of extra moderation time.
I don't care about the votes. I write my opinion not hoping it will be upvoted or downvoted. But because i express my opinion about the situation of Red Bull not getting an engine for 2016 and that the FIA should do something about it... i had a downvote. And the reason was because it was fan frenzy... It is very easy to downvote someone just beacause you don't like what he wrote.

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Phil
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Re: Voting system updates - Call for suggestions

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Steven wrote:Maybe we can reduce downvote reasons and in the popup add a button to report the post, replacing the "ranting", and "spam" reasons.
The way I see it, is that the majority of posters here perhaps are not as technically minded as F1T once started out as. I freely admit I'm not really knowledgeable enough to be posting anything with any form of authority in the more technical orientated topics, but what I lack in knowledge, I try to make up with common-sense and logical thinking (emphasis on try :D ).

Anyway, what I wanted to point out with this, is that the whole +1/-1 is rather limited for posters like me/us. If it's a tool to reward posts with technical insight, it takes one with a basic technical understanding in the first place. As a 'layman' therefore, the only use I have for the voting system is to reward posts that I feel are constructive and add to the quality of this forum, even if the contents may not be technically focused. It's also far easier to use it as a means to say "i agree". Inadvertently, this then makes the -1 on the opposite scale a "I do not agree' function, which is how many are using it. It's just too attractive not to.

The other problem I see is that the number, the sum of all up- and downvotes, is attached to the users identity, as if to portray how valuable that member is to the community. So voting has an effect on how we are portrayed, even if most users decide to put little emphasis on it or simply ignore it. Which is also why we have so many in here complaining about downvotes and the need to moderate the votes in the first place. :| Perhaps it would be better to have a system where one can freely up and down vote posts and that each are shown separately; I.e. 12 downvotes, 16 upvotes as a means to portray how many agreed with it and how many disagreed. Then I would remove the sum of all votes from the users name - perhaps make it visible when one clicks on someones detailed profile page, but not have it attached to the identity visible at all times.

Another system on another site that I felt works quite nicely too is simply a "I agree" button. What it does is simply adds the users name below the post (i.e. X, Y and N others agreed with this post). It's not anonymous, so any voting is done with more responsibility which in theory should prevent misuse. And it's not a big deal either way.

I think it's the combination that perhaps makes the current system rather problematic. Either make the votes public, so each can see who votes who, or simply make it officially a "i agree / I disagree" function, also public, but not attach the sum to the name. Disagreement shouldn't be bad. What is a pity currently is that because of its often misuse, it's sometimes demotivating to post anything that is regarded an "unpopular view" - as it potentially usually results in downvotes, even if one puts in a lot of work, time and effort into a lengthy reply. And without the "opposite view" we wouldn't have much to talk or discuss, other than perhaps the more factual orientated technical topics, which would be IMO a pity.


@Btw Turbo - I know how you feel. In fact, I feel a bit guilty, I actually upvoted that Casio post. :oops: :lol: Ehm, what I wanted to say too, is that there was a time when I didn't upvote any moderators posts, because I didn't think you/they saw them anyway (given that moderators and admins don't have their vote count portrayed next to their name). Maybe some other posters feel the same, even if only on a subconcious level, which is why they rarely upvote? ... Just a thought.
Not for nothing, Rosberg's Championship is the only thing that lends credibility to Hamilton's recent success. Otherwise, he'd just be the guy who's had the best car. — bhall II
#Team44 supporter

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turbof1
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Re: Voting system updates - Call for suggestions

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@Btw Turbo - I know how you feel. In fact, I feel a bit guilty, I actually upvoted that Casio post.
Well, don't feel guilty. I only wanted to show how silly things can become in some casio's... ehh cases :lol: (luckily people can't upvote that).

We do have a reputation counter just like you guys. It is visible to us on the user control panel, but not to the other members. It does not really matter for me since I actually have a high reputation, which I don't really think to deserve. I simply don't like the impression it gives that we have to hide that.
#AeroFrodo

notsofast
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Re: Voting system updates - Call for suggestions

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For upvoting, use a much bigger button that says "This is an informative technical post".

For downvoting, disallow it if the current number of votes is zero. There's no value in negative votes.

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bauc
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Re: Voting system updates - Call for suggestions

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turbof1 wrote:What makes this silly, is the contrast with an other post from me in the Red Bull team thread where I made quite a dry joke about their CASIO sponsor. Effort? 10s. It received 4 upvotes. It gives me the feeling people value the package much higher then the content.
This is true,I was one of those who give thumbs up on your CASIO joke simply coz it was funny. The point here is that you/we need to understand that in today's world, wherever we look when we are using our PC's, or Mobile devices on all of the social media platforms we have the like & dislike buttons and we have become so familiar to them that we simple press it without giving it too much thought. For this type of forum, were people give great effort to create a post which includes tons of different data & analysis you cant just go with thumbs up or down option in order to have a respectful feedback from the readers and fellow forum members. Maybe a 1-5 scale option with fully disagree -> fully agree options can work better, what do you think?

Thanks.
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