Mercedes AMG F1 W08 EQ Power +

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tranquility2k4
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W08 EQ Power +

Post by tranquility2k4 » Sat Sep 09, 2017 8:08 am

Bill_Kar wrote:
Fri Sep 08, 2017 4:23 pm
Apparently Merc will introduce some upgrades to improve high-downforce performance, but Bottas says only after Singapore. It occurs to me that when they are giving interviews they are really confident for the Championship battle, like OK we know we will suffer in Singapore, but after that it's spot on.
I have been thinking for a while when was the last time Merc introduced a big upgrade? I thought they must be waiting to bring a big high downforce package to Singapore so I'm surprised if they don't get it there. You would have thought they'd at least bring a few new parts to trial it out on the highest downforce track remaining on the calender. The only reason I would see them not bringing anything to Singapore is if they are planning a really big overhaul for high downforce tracks and the parts will only work all in unison.

cplchanb
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W08 EQ Power +

Post by cplchanb » Sat Sep 09, 2017 3:31 pm

tranquility2k4 wrote:
Sat Sep 09, 2017 8:08 am
Bill_Kar wrote:
Fri Sep 08, 2017 4:23 pm
Apparently Merc will introduce some upgrades to improve high-downforce performance, but Bottas says only after Singapore. It occurs to me that when they are giving interviews they are really confident for the Championship battle, like OK we know we will suffer in Singapore, but after that it's spot on.
I have been thinking for a while when was the last time Merc introduced a big upgrade? I thought they must be waiting to bring a big high downforce package to Singapore so I'm surprised if they don't get it there. You would have thought they'd at least bring a few new parts to trial it out on the highest downforce track remaining on the calender. The only reason I would see them not bringing anything to Singapore is if they are planning a really big overhaul for high downforce tracks and the parts will only work all in unison.
apart from their spain upgrade most of their changes were track specific...there was a small update in canada iirc but apart from that nothing much surprisingly...

GPR-A
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W08 EQ Power +

Post by GPR-A » Sat Sep 09, 2017 4:53 pm

cplchanb wrote:
Sat Sep 09, 2017 3:31 pm
tranquility2k4 wrote:
Sat Sep 09, 2017 8:08 am
Bill_Kar wrote:
Fri Sep 08, 2017 4:23 pm
Apparently Merc will introduce some upgrades to improve high-downforce performance, but Bottas says only after Singapore. It occurs to me that when they are giving interviews they are really confident for the Championship battle, like OK we know we will suffer in Singapore, but after that it's spot on.
I have been thinking for a while when was the last time Merc introduced a big upgrade? I thought they must be waiting to bring a big high downforce package to Singapore so I'm surprised if they don't get it there. You would have thought they'd at least bring a few new parts to trial it out on the highest downforce track remaining on the calender. The only reason I would see them not bringing anything to Singapore is if they are planning a really big overhaul for high downforce tracks and the parts will only work all in unison.
apart from their spain upgrade most of their changes were track specific...there was a small update in canada iirc but apart from that nothing much surprisingly...
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/merc ... ms-941700/
James Allison wrote:"From after Monaco we haven't really had a weak race so far," he said. "And that race after Monaco was Canada and we didn't bring any upgrades there."

bill shoe
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W08 EQ Power +

Post by bill shoe » Sat Sep 09, 2017 11:30 pm

Bill_Kar wrote:
Fri Sep 08, 2017 4:23 pm
Apparently Merc will introduce some upgrades to improve high-downforce performance, but Bottas says only after Singapore. It occurs to me that when they are giving interviews they are really confident for the Championship battle, like OK we know we will suffer in Singapore, but after that it's spot on.
This tells me that Merc are happy with where their 2018 car is in terms of aero (wind tunnel & CFD) performance, so they are taking some of their limited/capped aero tokens to improve the max-downforce package of their current car.

I think this is a sure sign that the 2018 Merc will launch will much more refinement and detail than any other 2018 car. It's a bit of a pattern...

mmred
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W08 EQ Power +

Post by mmred » Sun Sep 10, 2017 12:22 am

bill shoe wrote:
Sat Sep 09, 2017 11:30 pm
Bill_Kar wrote:
Fri Sep 08, 2017 4:23 pm
Apparently Merc will introduce some upgrades to improve high-downforce performance, but Bottas says only after Singapore. It occurs to me that when they are giving interviews they are really confident for the Championship battle, like OK we know we will suffer in Singapore, but after that it's spot on.
This tells me that Merc are happy with where their 2018 car is in terms of aero (wind tunnel & CFD) performance, so they are taking some of their limited/capped aero tokens to improve the max-downforce package of their current car.

I think this is a sure sign that the 2018 Merc will launch will much more refinement and detail than any other 2018 car. It's a bit of a pattern...
with the engine performance delivered so far they can also keep this car for the 2018, they will still win in many circuits
it has been a silly season best car ferrari from mechanical and aero performance ( beside on fast tracks ) obviously sometime more, sometimes less, but the best engine subverts the outcome
dont like this season so much, i am not a big fan of straights ( of course my alias tells also the real reason eh)

Morteza
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W08 EQ Power +

Post by Morteza » Wed Sep 13, 2017 9:31 am

"A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool."~William Shakespeare

TAG
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W08 EQ Power +

Post by TAG » Wed Sep 13, 2017 1:10 pm

Have to wonder about these types of press releases, some of it is for general media consumption, but some has to be intended for the competition.

Motorsport -Mercedes' Formula 1 engine has hit a landmark achievement on the dyno at its Brixworth factory after breaking the 50 percent thermal efficiency barrier for the first time.

The achievement is evidence of the huge strides that have been taken by the German car manufacturer in making improvements to its power unit, which is the most efficient racing engine in history.

Thermal efficiency has become a key target for modern engine builders, and is calculated on the amount of useful energy that can be produced from a given amount of heat input.

In modern F1 it has become particularly important because there is a strict fuel flow limit rate of 100kg per hour.

The 50 percent efficiency of the Mercedes F1 engine makes it one of the best internal combustion in the world too.

It is now approaching levels of thermal efficiency reached by diesel engines used in large container ships – although gas turbines can deliver more than 60 percent efficiency.

The 50 percent mark, which has not yet been reached on track, is much higher than the 30 percent efficiency that old normally aspirated engines produced.

When F1's new turbo hybrid formula arrived in 2014, Mercedes engines had a conversion rate of 44% - and it has delivered gains since then too.

In a column on Mercedes' official F1 website, the team said: "The old-fashioned, naturally aspirated engines peaked at 29 percent thermal efficiency during the V8 era - while the last time we saw these levels of power in Formula 1 was back in 2005, with a V10 that guzzled fuel at a whopping 194kg/hr. To halve the fuel flow rate for the same amount of power is quite something."

"Three and a half years after making its debut, the Mercedes-AMG F1 power unit has now achieved a conversion efficiency of more than 50 percent during dyno testing in Brixworth.

"In other words, it now produces more power than waste energy - a remarkable milestone for any hybrid, and especially a flat-out racing engine. Compared to 2014, the power output is 109 horsepower greater using the same amount of fuel."

Mercedes has used a version of its F1 engine in its new Project ONE road car, which has a thermal efficiency of 40 percent.
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Big Mangalhit
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W08 EQ Power +

Post by Big Mangalhit » Wed Sep 13, 2017 2:25 pm

TAG wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 1:10 pm
Have to wonder about these types of press releases, some of it is for general media consumption, but some has to be intended for the competition.
I think with the timing of this news. It is just an advertising for Mercedes hypercar. I think they already reached 50% efficiency previously.
And if not, logically it can only mean that either they reached it in testing, or not at all. Both of which I doubt they would talk openly about it

garyjpaterson
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W08 EQ Power +

Post by garyjpaterson » Wed Sep 13, 2017 2:27 pm

Big Mangalhit wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 2:25 pm
TAG wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 1:10 pm
Have to wonder about these types of press releases, some of it is for general media consumption, but some has to be intended for the competition.
I think with the timing of this news. It is just an advertising for Mercedes hypercar. I think they already reached 50% efficiency previously.
And if not, logically it can only mean that either they reached it in testing, or not at all. Both of which I doubt they would talk openly about it
Were they not going on about the 50% efficiency thing ages ago, start of last year I think? Now were getting articles about how Merc have just managed to reach new heights...

designf1
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W08 EQ Power +

Post by designf1 » Wed Sep 13, 2017 4:21 pm


Sevach
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W08 EQ Power +

Post by Sevach » Thu Sep 14, 2017 9:12 am

garyjpaterson wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 2:27 pm
Big Mangalhit wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 2:25 pm
TAG wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 1:10 pm
Have to wonder about these types of press releases, some of it is for general media consumption, but some has to be intended for the competition.
I think with the timing of this news. It is just an advertising for Mercedes hypercar. I think they already reached 50% efficiency previously.
And if not, logically it can only mean that either they reached it in testing, or not at all. Both of which I doubt they would talk openly about it
Were they not going on about the 50% efficiency thing ages ago, start of last year I think? Now were getting articles about how Merc have just managed to reach new heights...
Over 50% leaves a lot of room for speculation.

What's interesting is that they quoted the 2014 spec at 44% and said the current version has 109 horses more, someone could do the maths around those numbers.

zibby43
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W08 EQ Power +

Post by zibby43 » Thu Sep 14, 2017 9:20 am

An additional photo of the new shark fin:
A new monkey seat as well:

e30ernest
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W08 EQ Power +

Post by e30ernest » Thu Sep 14, 2017 9:50 am

garyjpaterson wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 2:27 pm
Big Mangalhit wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 2:25 pm
TAG wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 1:10 pm
Have to wonder about these types of press releases, some of it is for general media consumption, but some has to be intended for the competition.
I think with the timing of this news. It is just an advertising for Mercedes hypercar. I think they already reached 50% efficiency previously.
And if not, logically it can only mean that either they reached it in testing, or not at all. Both of which I doubt they would talk openly about it
Were they not going on about the 50% efficiency thing ages ago, start of last year I think? Now were getting articles about how Merc have just managed to reach new heights...
There is an accompanying video to that, I'm not sure if this is a proper place to post it, but they claim this is a current 2017 engine:

https://youtu.be/rGDJqTDXgtg

Also some views of the chassis and various components in their Monza to Singapore Series:

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=P ... sUogun2uTq

Chene_Mostert
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W08 EQ Power +

Post by Chene_Mostert » Thu Sep 14, 2017 7:07 pm

garyjpaterson wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 2:27 pm
Big Mangalhit wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 2:25 pm
TAG wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 1:10 pm
Have to wonder about these types of press releases, some of it is for general media consumption, but some has to be intended for the competition.
I think with the timing of this news. It is just an advertising for Mercedes hypercar. I think they already reached 50% efficiency previously.
And if not, logically it can only mean that either they reached it in testing, or not at all. Both of which I doubt they would talk openly about it
Were they not going on about the 50% efficiency thing ages ago, start of last year I think? Now were getting articles about how Merc have just managed to reach new heights...
Does the calculation include energy from oil?
"Science at its best is an open-minded method of inquiry, not a belief system." - Rupert Sheldrake

Just_a_fan
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W08 EQ Power +

Post by Just_a_fan » Thu Sep 14, 2017 8:26 pm

Chene_Mostert wrote:
Thu Sep 14, 2017 7:07 pm
garyjpaterson wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 2:27 pm
Big Mangalhit wrote:
Wed Sep 13, 2017 2:25 pm


I think with the timing of this news. It is just an advertising for Mercedes hypercar. I think they already reached 50% efficiency previously.
And if not, logically it can only mean that either they reached it in testing, or not at all. Both of which I doubt they would talk openly about it
Were they not going on about the 50% efficiency thing ages ago, start of last year I think? Now were getting articles about how Merc have just managed to reach new heights...
Does the calculation include energy from oil?
Yes, but less than the same calculation for the Ferrari PU... :roll:
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