2018 McLaren F1 Team - Renault

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Thunder
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Re: 2018 McLaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by Thunder » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:18 am

Eric saying they are running more Downforce than they would want to under optimal Circumstances doesn't mean they automatically have to have the steepest RW in the Field. It's just that, more than they (McLaren) wanted. He never said they run more DF than any other Team and sure as hell he did not say they have a shallower RW than the others. But hey, let's call for his Head again because it's been a week already... :roll:

mclaren111
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Re: 2018 McLaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by mclaren111 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:34 am

techman wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 2:27 am
You're still stuck on last year, they've changed that tune or aren't you listening? Zak has come out and said he doesn't think they'll compete for wins this year or next. They've fallen on their sword, they said "mea culpa" by firing someone whom I presume they think was to blame. It isn't a great situation but it is what it is.
well i agree zak has changed tune in a recent interview. but you have to remember you have thank renault for them to change their tune. if that scapegoat engine was still in that mclaren car, the finger pointing towards that scapegoat engine would have still continue probably even harder. thank goodness its a different engine now.

Totally agree. Nowhere to hide anymore.

Now they have the rest of the year to work and fix the Rear Suspension (I like the concept), and carry it over to 2019.

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Re: 2018 McLaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by turbof1 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:01 pm

Thunder wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:18 am
Eric saying they are running more Downforce than they would want to under optimal Circumstances doesn't mean they automatically have to have the steepest RW in the Field. It's just that, more than they (McLaren) wanted. He never said they run more DF than any other Team and sure as hell he did not say they have a shallower RW than the others. But hey, let's call for his Head again because it's been a week already... :roll:
Oh dear, look at the time, it's Lynch Boullier o'clock :lol: .

dren
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Re: 2018 McLaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by dren » Wed Jun 13, 2018 12:18 pm

The Vandoorne pitstop was a massive blunder.
Honda!

diffuser
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Re: 2018 McLaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by diffuser » Wed Jun 13, 2018 1:17 pm

kasio wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:49 am
Juzh wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 7:45 am
What I noticed is that on his PB lap alonso was 7 kmh down on the long straight compared to his previous run in Q2. What's that supposed to mean? Both laps below.

First q2 lap
https://streamable.com/8ier7

Second q2 lap (PB)
https://streamable.com/f382f


Vs hamilton's q3 lap
https://streamable.com/pmx24
from live timing (for a reference).
20.110(258), 23.501(279), 29.376(289) 1:12.987(speedtrap 323)
20.015(257), 23.353(278), 29.488(286) 1:12.856(speedtrap 316)
hmm its really interesting. i will try to find some markers
If you look carefully at the speed in the curves in the side-by-side video, you'll notice that in most of the curves ALO has to slow down 5 - 10KPH more.
turn Ham ALO 
1  - 155 151
2  -  85  72
3  - 142 143
4  - 179 177
5  - 130 111
6  - 153 155 
7  - 128 118
8  - 151 148
9  -  62  63 
10 - 139 134
11 - 153 152
Another interesting piece is that we see that out of the last turn and the hair pin ALO accelerates faster than Hamilton.

Benii6
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Re: 2018 McLaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by Benii6 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 1:47 pm

Hamilton did lock up in the hair pin, could that compromise his exit?

Also, its quite interesting how differently they took the last chicane. Did Alonso mess up with hitting the high kerb or is it faster that way?

kasio
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Re: 2018 McLaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by kasio » Wed Jun 13, 2018 2:06 pm

kasio wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:49 am
Juzh wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 7:45 am
What I noticed is that on his PB lap alonso was 7 kmh down on the long straight compared to his previous run in Q2. What's that supposed to mean? Both laps below.

First q2 lap
https://streamable.com/8ier7

Second q2 lap (PB)
https://streamable.com/f382f


Vs hamilton's q3 lap
https://streamable.com/pmx24
from live timing (for a reference).
20.110(258), 23.501(279), 29.376(289) 1:12.987(speedtrap 323)
20.015(257), 23.353(278), 29.488(286) 1:12.856(speedtrap 316)
hmm its really interesting. i will try to find some markers
Looks like just driving (but might be a bit of more wing)

on second run
he lost in cornering speed at turn 2.
was much better on braking and cornering/exit speed turns 3/4
later braking before turn 6
much better exit from turn 7 (i would suggest its with mguk assist? or much better tracition) same cornering speed just acceleration out of corner much beter.
Lost on top speed in aproach to turn 8 and
lost due to more early braking into 8.
but almost 10kmh more apex(119 compared to 110) speed in 8.
lost a bit on exit from 9.
better apex speed 61 to 59 at turn 10 (hairpin)
320 to 327 topspeed on stright to turn 13. (i guess has spent all electric energy earlier in lap)
worse cornering and apex speed into turn 13
better exit of turn 13 and better apex speed in turn 14
better exit out of turn 14.
thats it.
p.s. track Image

Per
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Re: 2018 McLaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by Per » Wed Jun 13, 2018 2:32 pm

godlameroso wrote:
Mon Jun 11, 2018 5:07 pm
It's not a fix all solution, it's an area that needs fixing to get the most from the chassis. I know they have really good braking stability and downforce in the mid high speed corners. What's lacking is diffuser instability at low speeds, so they have to compromise by running more wing which hurts top speed. When their diffuser is more stable at low speeds it lets them run less rear wing and the car will work better at low speeds. Whatever chassis or platform deficiency doesn't help, however I maintain, the aero is a big reason they struggle in low speed.
I've seen you make this claim several times in this topic now, but you've never answered the question which has been asked before by others: do you actually have any source for this whatsoever? Because if not, you're just speculating (a lot) and presenting it as fact.

All the elements the public has access to, point to a mechanical (suspension) issue. Anyone with a bit of engineering knowledge could see that the rear suspension design was highly questionable even before it hit the track. All of the symptoms we see today confirm this.

techman
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Re: 2018 McLaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by techman » Wed Jun 13, 2018 2:46 pm

this issue mclaren having is a combination of the rear suspension and aero. aero definetly is not effcient, and that rear suspension is still not sorted

PhillipM
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Re: 2018 McLaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by PhillipM » Wed Jun 13, 2018 2:54 pm

It's not just a single issue, that's the problem. But they really need to sort out the issue with working the hypersoft, that's whats punishing them hard at the moment.

radosav
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Re: 2018 McLaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by radosav » Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:05 pm

That guy Roldan , from McLaren, tweeted that they at factory are working their skin off to solve it, but isn't easy he says.

mclaren111
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Re: 2018 McLaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by mclaren111 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:26 pm

techman wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 2:46 pm
this issue mclaren having is a combination of the rear suspension and aero. aero definetly is not effcient, and that rear suspension is still not sorted
I agree.

Last year their suspension handled any and all curbs 2nd to RBR only.

This year not. Brundle have mentioned a few times that McLaren's Rear End is not stable and handles curbs badly.

nirvaand
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Re: 2018 McLaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by nirvaand » Wed Jun 13, 2018 8:29 pm

BTW for anyone wondering about McLaren's RACE PACE in Canada:

After Fernando undercut and got past Lelerc for the second stint ---- Fernando was on average 0.176 seconds a lap QUICKER than Nico Hulkenberg. Although he was still 1.155 seconds a lap slower than Max.

So McLaren look to be the 4th quickest car in the race, but they have a huge gap between themselves and Red Bull.

godlameroso
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Re: 2018 McLaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by godlameroso » Wed Jun 13, 2018 8:56 pm

Per wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 2:32 pm
godlameroso wrote:
Mon Jun 11, 2018 5:07 pm
It's not a fix all solution, it's an area that needs fixing to get the most from the chassis. I know they have really good braking stability and downforce in the mid high speed corners. What's lacking is diffuser instability at low speeds, so they have to compromise by running more wing which hurts top speed. When their diffuser is more stable at low speeds it lets them run less rear wing and the car will work better at low speeds. Whatever chassis or platform deficiency doesn't help, however I maintain, the aero is a big reason they struggle in low speed.
I've seen you make this claim several times in this topic now, but you've never answered the question which has been asked before by others: do you actually have any source for this whatsoever? Because if not, you're just speculating (a lot) and presenting it as fact.

All the elements the public has access to, point to a mechanical (suspension) issue. Anyone with a bit of engineering knowledge could see that the rear suspension design was highly questionable even before it hit the track. All of the symptoms we see today confirm this.
I don't give away IP, sorry buddy, I frankly don't care if you take my word for it or not, I'll just say I've seen something similar before.
The height of cultivation is really nothing special. It is merely simplicity; the ability to express the utmost with the minimum. Mr.Lee

mwillems
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Re: 2018 McLaren F1 Team - Renault

Post by mwillems » Wed Jun 13, 2018 9:27 pm

Juzh wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 7:45 am
What I noticed is that on his PB lap alonso was 7 kmh down on the long straight compared to his previous run in Q2. What's that supposed to mean? Both laps below.

First q2 lap
https://streamable.com/8ier7

Second q2 lap (PB)
https://streamable.com/f382f


Vs hamilton's q3 lap
https://streamable.com/pmx24
I just watched Ham v Alo, what was really interesting was how rough the Mclaren was over the kerbs. You can see the car struggling and bouncing around a lot more. It looks like the car is really bouncing up off the kerbs, much higher than Ham, particularly at 9 and 14. In fact 14 requires a lot of adjustment to keep the car out of the wall, looks like the left side is in the air for a little while. Anyone else see that?

It's interesting to remember Landos remarks about the car being more unforgiving, can't recall if it was between the noses, or this and last years car, I think it was between noses. There may be a low speed issue with the diffuser, but that car looks unstable at times. It looks like it is running a fair bit stiffer than they would like, but having no choice but to use the kerbs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dBdgEL0trzo