[ 2020 ] Aston Martin RedBull Racing F1 Team - Honda

[Big Tea]

It would be a risk for Russell to go to Red Bull, and for Red Bull too, given what both Gasly and Albon showed, but it certainly wouldn't be a crazy choice for either side (just like going for Verstappen into F1 was a risk for driver and team, but clearly paid off)

It would be a risk but I think he's better prepared for it than Albon was. Russell has been in the paddock, doing the interviews, facing the questions, feeling the hype e.g. from his Q2 qualifying results etc. He's shown his ability so there is less pressure to hit the ground running when moving to somewhere like RedBull.

The issue for Russell, or any other driver going to RedBull whilst Max is there, is that the team are fully focused on Max. Any other driver is going to be the defacto Number 2. That can allow them to quietly get on with learning the ropes, but it does potentially limit how far they will be allowed to go. I don't see RedBull doing to Max what Ferrari appear to have done to Seb, for example.

But if Russell went to RedBull and qualified / finished near to Max through the season, that would be very good for his career. If he managed to qualify ahead of Max once or twice, that wouldn't hurt him either. It would certainly give Max something to think about.

I also see Russell as more concise and definite on the radio and more likely to get the attention he is asking for .
Albon comes over nice guy asking politely to do it if you feel like, but of course we do not know how things are behind closed doors.

I do feel that if Russell was not happy with things we, and they would know about it. He would not just shut up and put up with it.
As you say, more prepared to be in that position

[godlameroso]

Perez seems like a reasonable choice. I put him somewhere close to Ric's level, maybe just a bit below that, which is more or less perfect for Red bull. He won't be bothering Verstappen too much and will be able to put that car where it actually belongs much more so than Albon.
Albon is as good as gone by this point. Abysmal and completely unacceptable performance last few races. I'm 100% convinced decision has already been made and they're just waiting for the right moment to announce it, whenever that may be.
I've seen numerous cracks last year already even on his good days, but given him benefit of doubt as he was a rookie after all. This year he should pick up his performances as the year got on, but instead he seems to be standing still at best, if not moving backwards.

perez close to ric? noway even in the pluto planet

I disagree, but ok. He's close if nothing else and certainly miles better than albon/gasly.

Perez doesn't focus on qualifying, he sets up for the race, when he and Ocon raced at Force India, pace wise him and Ocon were very close, but generally got the better of him in qualifying. Similar to Riccardo's record vs him, do you use this to judge whether Perez is similar to Ricciardo?

[godlameroso]

It would be a risk for Russell to go to Red Bull, and for Red Bull too, given what both Gasly and Albon showed, but it certainly wouldn't be a crazy choice for either side (just like going for Verstappen into F1 was a risk for driver and team, but clearly paid off)

It would be a risk but I think he's better prepared for it than Albon was. Russell has been in the paddock, doing the interviews, facing the questions, feeling the hype e.g. from his Q2 qualifying results etc. He's shown his ability so there is less pressure to hit the ground running when moving to somewhere like RedBull.

The issue for Russell, or any other driver going to RedBull whilst Max is there, is that the team are fully focused on Max. Any other driver is going to be the defacto Number 2. That can allow them to quietly get on with learning the ropes, but it does potentially limit how far they will be allowed to go. I don't see RedBull doing to Max what Ferrari appear to have done to Seb, for example.

But if Russell went to RedBull and qualified / finished near to Max through the season, that would be very good for his career. If he managed to qualify ahead of Max once or twice, that wouldn't hurt him either. It would certainly give Max something to think about.

Do you think that Max gets a better car than Albon? If Max is getting all the results, while the other driver is just trying to score points, who would you focus on? Do you remember when Kvyat tried his hand at the Red Bull? His qualifying performances were also midfield at best, but the pace of the car was there in the race. Same as now, except the Red Bull isn't miles ahead of the cars it's racing in the mid field, so it's stuck in traffic. That alone is destroying Albon's pace, and he can't tie everything together for a proper qualifying lap like Verstappen can. Furthermore, any mistakes are severely punished because everything in the midfield is so tight. A tenth or two is the difference between 5th and 9th. You make one mistake, one tire flat spot, one unwarranted pit stop, that's 24 seconds you have to recover in traffic, while your teammate is flying in free air.

[Just_a_fan]

It would be a risk for Russell to go to Red Bull, and for Red Bull too, given what both Gasly and Albon showed, but it certainly wouldn't be a crazy choice for either side (just like going for Verstappen into F1 was a risk for driver and team, but clearly paid off)

It would be a risk but I think he's better prepared for it than Albon was. Russell has been in the paddock, doing the interviews, facing the questions, feeling the hype e.g. from his Q2 qualifying results etc. He's shown his ability so there is less pressure to hit the ground running when moving to somewhere like RedBull.

The issue for Russell, or any other driver going to RedBull whilst Max is there, is that the team are fully focused on Max. Any other driver is going to be the defacto Number 2. That can allow them to quietly get on with learning the ropes, but it does potentially limit how far they will be allowed to go. I don't see RedBull doing to Max what Ferrari appear to have done to Seb, for example.

But if Russell went to RedBull and qualified / finished near to Max through the season, that would be very good for his career. If he managed to qualify ahead of Max once or twice, that wouldn't hurt him either. It would certainly give Max something to think about.

Do you think that Max gets a better car than Albon? If Max is getting all the results, while the other driver is just trying to score points, who would you focus on? Do you remember when Kvyat tried his hand at the Red Bull? His qualifying performances were also midfield at best, but the pace of the car was there in the race. Same as now, except the Red Bull isn't miles ahead of the cars it's racing in the mid field, so it's stuck in traffic. That alone is destroying Albon's pace, and he can't tie everything together for a proper qualifying lap like Verstappen can. Furthermore, any mistakes are severely punished because everything in the midfield is so tight. A tenth or two is the difference between 5th and 9th. You make one mistake, one tire flat spot, one unwarranted pit stop, that's 24 seconds you have to recover in traffic, while your teammate is flying in free air.

You make the point well. Albon was thrown in the deepend and hasn't figured out how to string it all together yet because he's still learning the game. Being under pressure - he's Max's team mate after all which is about as much pressure as you can get in F1. Being next to Max means you're being judged against the vaunted "next big thing". That's going to be difficult for any driver.

F1 driver performance is as much about the head as it is about the hands and feet. Any driver has a bad day when their head isn't right and we see them under-perform. Happens to them all. I think Albon has been unlucky in getting such a top seat so quickly. Sadly, I don't think RedBull are prepared to develop him in that seat nor will they use their other team to do so.

[diffuser]

Not a problem. The medium was the fastest qualify tire as well.

Two reasons. I think 1 do something else as Merc and hope it works. No cigar. 2 have an advantage in the opening lap and see if you can keep them behind. No cigar.

Option 2 did have some success as Max got Bottas at the start but (as could be seen in the ziggo post race analysis) 2020 Max is very carefull in the opening lap and he gave Bottas plenty of space who aggresively put it next to him and even fully forced Max of track. A point not being mentioned anywhere. Forcing a driver off track. Opening lap of course but still. It caused the Perez jump attempt, which caused the mclaren attack, the charles and kimi attack etc. The point, Max is very carefull with others these days but that did negate the opening lap advantage.

WRONG
1:16:4 was the fastest lap in Quali by Bottas in Q2 ON SOFTS.


I think you just say whatever, with out looking at any data.

[Juzh]

perez close to ric? noway even in the pluto planet

I disagree, but ok. He's close if nothing else and certainly miles better than albon/gasly.

Perez doesn't focus on qualifying, he sets up for the race, when he and Ocon raced at Force India, pace wise him and Ocon were very close, but generally got the better of him in qualifying. Similar to Riccardo's record vs him, do you use this to judge whether Perez is similar to Ricciardo?

I'm basing it off of him beating every teammate apart from button in 2013 and his overall pretty good performances this year so far. As I said, not quite on ric's level, but close.

[etusch]

Do you think that Max gets a better car than Albon? If Max is getting all the results, while the other driver is just trying to score points, who would you focus on? Do you remember when Kvyat tried his hand at the Red Bull? His qualifying performances were also midfield at best, but the pace of the car was there in the race. Same as now, except the Red Bull isn't miles ahead of the cars it's racing in the mid field, so it's stuck in traffic. That alone is destroying Albon's pace, and he can't tie everything together for a proper qualifying lap like Verstappen can. Furthermore, any mistakes are severely punished because everything in the midfield is so tight. A tenth or two is the difference between 5th and 9th. You make one mistake, one tire flat spot, one unwarranted pit stop, that's 24 seconds you have to recover in traffic, while your teammate is flying in free air.

Albon has no excuse after last race. When he stuck with second best car behind drivers who overtook by Gasly with midfield car. Even something went wrong he has to make overtakes. I am not trying to say he is not a good driver but he can't handle the team and the car so he need to develop himself at AT like GAsly.

[diffuser]

Do you think that Max gets a better car than Albon? If Max is getting all the results, while the other driver is just trying to score points, who would you focus on? Do you remember when Kvyat tried his hand at the Red Bull? His qualifying performances were also midfield at best, but the pace of the car was there in the race. Same as now, except the Red Bull isn't miles ahead of the cars it's racing in the mid field, so it's stuck in traffic. That alone is destroying Albon's pace, and he can't tie everything together for a proper qualifying lap like Verstappen can. Furthermore, any mistakes are severely punished because everything in the midfield is so tight. A tenth or two is the difference between 5th and 9th. You make one mistake, one tire flat spot, one unwarranted pit stop, that's 24 seconds you have to recover in traffic, while your teammate is flying in free air.

Albon has no excuse after last race. When he stuck with second best car behind drivers who overtook by Gasly with midfield car. Even something went wrong he has to make overtakes. I am not trying to say he is not a good driver but he can't handle the team and the car so he need to develop himself at AT like GAsly.

Wonder what RBR saw in Gasley that didn''t like. I mean if they'er looking outside the organisation ...

[Big Tea]

Do you think that Max gets a better car than Albon? If Max is getting all the results, while the other driver is just trying to score points, who would you focus on? Do you remember when Kvyat tried his hand at the Red Bull? His qualifying performances were also midfield at best, but the pace of the car was there in the race. Same as now, except the Red Bull isn't miles ahead of the cars it's racing in the mid field, so it's stuck in traffic. That alone is destroying Albon's pace, and he can't tie everything together for a proper qualifying lap like Verstappen can. Furthermore, any mistakes are severely punished because everything in the midfield is so tight. A tenth or two is the difference between 5th and 9th. You make one mistake, one tire flat spot, one unwarranted pit stop, that's 24 seconds you have to recover in traffic, while your teammate is flying in free air.

Albon has no excuse after last race. When he stuck with second best car behind drivers who overtook by Gasly with midfield car. Even something went wrong he has to make overtakes. I am not trying to say he is not a good driver but he can't handle the team and the car so he need to develop himself at AT like GAsly.

Wonder what RBR saw in Gasley that didn''t like. I mean if they'er looking outside the organisation ...

It could just be that they know he will not get on with that car. They seem happy to keep him in AT, and even praise him when he does well.

[zibby43]

any words about the pu meeting happened yesterday?

"RaceFans understands the possibility of a freeze on engine development was discussed during yesterday’s F1 Commissions meeting but no decision was taken and the subject of a Balance of Performance was not tabled.

Speaking ahead of the meeting, Ferrari team principal Mattia Binotto said an engine development freeze is not a priority for F1.

“I think that before starting discussing the freezing it’s more important to discuss 2026,” he said in response to a question from RaceFans. “What’s the new technical format for the new power units in the future, where costs need to be address, where the technology needs to be addressed. So I see that as a first priority and freezing, it’s only a second priority for the discussion.”

https://www.racefans.net/2020/10/27/red ... ne-freeze/

The "Balance of Performance" proposal was also introduced (in addition to the freeze, which Toto is in support of, but Mattia is not), which basically would mean Merc and its customer teams would be given less fuel to use to curb their performance.

While Toto is in support of an engine freeze, he and his Merc customers will not be supporting the "Balance of Performance" proposal.

[Sieper]

Not a problem. The medium was the fastest qualify tire as well.

Two reasons. I think 1 do something else as Merc and hope it works. No cigar. 2 have an advantage in the opening lap and see if you can keep them behind. No cigar.

Option 2 did have some success as Max got Bottas at the start but (as could be seen in the ziggo post race analysis) 2020 Max is very carefull in the opening lap and he gave Bottas plenty of space who aggresively put it next to him and even fully forced Max of track. A point not being mentioned anywhere. Forcing a driver off track. Opening lap of course but still. It caused the Perez jump attempt, which caused the mclaren attack, the charles and kimi attack etc. The point, Max is very carefull with others these days but that did negate the opening lap advantage.

WRONG
1:16:4 was the fastest lap in Quali by Bottas in Q2 ON SOFTS.


I think you just say whatever, with out looking at any data.

What . Point 1, leclerc qualified on mediums In Q2 while he was 4 tenths slower than Max in Q3 when both were on softs. So it would have been EASY for Max as well. The mercs did Q3 on mediums. What on earth for if this wasn’t the fastest tire? Max set the fastest time in FP3 on mediums By a margin, then taken away due to track limits and then set the almost fastest time on this same set, Just a few hundredths off. Mercs did their fp3 run on red.

And you seem to think Bottas fastest time in Q2 was set on softs. And then you say I say whatever. Bottas qualified on mediums man, not on softs at all!

I am really angry about this personal attack. I do put a lot of thought in my posts. I hope you come back with a more fair reply. Goodday sir

[Sieper]

Do you think that Max gets a better car than Albon? If Max is getting all the results, while the other driver is just trying to score points, who would you focus on? Do you remember when Kvyat tried his hand at the Red Bull? His qualifying performances were also midfield at best, but the pace of the car was there in the race. Same as now, except the Red Bull isn't miles ahead of the cars it's racing in the mid field, so it's stuck in traffic. That alone is destroying Albon's pace, and he can't tie everything together for a proper qualifying lap like Verstappen can. Furthermore, any mistakes are severely punished because everything in the midfield is so tight. A tenth or two is the difference between 5th and 9th. You make one mistake, one tire flat spot, one unwarranted pit stop, that's 24 seconds you have to recover in traffic, while your teammate is flying in free air.

Albon has no excuse after last race. When he stuck with second best car behind drivers who overtook by Gasly with midfield car. Even something went wrong he has to make overtakes. I am not trying to say he is not a good driver but he can't handle the team and the car so he need to develop himself at AT like GAsly.

Wonder what RBR saw in Gasley that didn''t like. I mean if they'er looking outside the organisation ...

Gasly.

[godlameroso]

Ferrari will NEVER agree to an engine freeze as long as their engine is uncompetitive. Therefore such an agreement cannot be reached this year, only next year when they can introduce their new power unit will they be able to have that conversation.

[godlameroso]

Albon has no excuse after last race. When he stuck with second best car behind drivers who overtook by Gasly with midfield car. Even something went wrong he has to make overtakes. I am not trying to say he is not a good driver but he can't handle the team and the car so he need to develop himself at AT like GAsly.

Wonder what RBR saw in Gasley that didn''t like. I mean if they'er looking outside the organisation ...

Gasly.

You guys aren't thinking long term, if the performance of the two cars is going to converge anyway it doesn't make sense to have Gasly next to Verstappen.

[diffuser]

Albon has no excuse after last race. When he stuck with second best car behind drivers who overtook by Gasly with midfield car. Even something went wrong he has to make overtakes. I am not trying to say he is not a good driver but he can't handle the team and the car so he need to develop himself at AT like GAsly.

Wonder what RBR saw in Gasley that didn''t like. I mean if they'er looking outside the organisation ...

Gasly.

LOL