F1technical.net

lauromoura wrote:FYI, a rather long article on the development of the Delta Wing car:

http://www.gordonkirby.com/categories/c ... no222.html

Definitely callin BS on some of the stuff in that article.

And c'mon.. they made an RC car and that was the validation of their sim results??

autogyro wrote:They should bring in some British technology from the late Barnes Wallis as used on the F15.
Make the thing 'swing wing' hahahaha.

the F15 is not a swing-wing aircraft - the F14 and F111 are tho.

last time I checked and F14, F15 and F111 aren't in the running for Indycar 2012

Does anyone know if the cars are having a shakedown any time soon?

http://deltawingracing.com/2010/02/next ... ianapolis/

DeltaWing LLC will design, engineer and supply a running prototype by August, 2010.

America designing something to be more efficient?
Na, I cant get my head around that.

Am I alone in finding the whole DeltaWing concept quite appealing??

RH1300S wrote:Am I alone in finding the whole DeltaWing concept quite appealing??

To be fair the idea grows on you.
I would need a lot more convincing though.

As it's own new series, a video game car, a movie car, sure, it has appeal.

As a new Indy car, no it doesn't for me. I do like cars, and I do like airplanes as well.

Just as I like women, and I like body building, the two combined is ugly and just fundamentally wrong in my eyes.

it is a very simply design for air drag, but..... can it turn?

autogyro wrote:America designing something to be more efficient?
Na, I cant get my head around that.

lol... maybe we'll club baby seals and have a big bonfire from virgin forest wood before every race just to keep the natural order of things...

Be careful about altering the open wheel formula from the CART era....

It was the beauty and versatility of the Champ car that kept many drivers in F1 wanting to experience 240mph around the American super speedways, the road courses and the street circuits. The Champ car was the real OW racing driver's car.

The fluctuating tide [and fortunes] of F1 drivers complemented the American born very well in one very unique series.

Bat wings and kooky designs might generate short term media interest but then it will become yesterday's news. You may as well reposition the sport to compete with NHRA Top Fuel Dragsters.

Formula One needs a real competitor that CART was. The formula of adapting the same chassis with various wing packages, engine power, and suspension to run on on the California Speedway, the IMS, Milwaukee Mile, Cleveland Airport, Road America, Surfers Paradise, Long Beach etc.... could never be copied with such success - IRL has proven that. Had CART and the IMS kept it together in 1996, it is possible that CART may have gained the ascendency over F1 particularly in light of recent problems between the F1 teams and the establishment.

The sole "Power-that-be" in Indycar knows what really has to happen. Indycar needs to turn back the clock - in order to recapture the essence of what it was. I am referring to Lolas, Swifts, etc.... all powered by turbo charged V8 engines from a number of suppliers with different tyre manufacturers etc. It cannot be a spec series.

CART competition for F1?
Nah. cant get my head around that either.

autogyro wrote:CART competition for F1?
Nah. cant get my head around that either.

I don't think it would have beat F1 in viewership, but the competition was enought for Bernie to to restrict CART access to any track that F1 ran on for many many years.

Rev Limiter wrote:The sole "Power-that-be" in Indycar knows what really has to happen. Indycar needs to turn back the clock - in order to recapture the essence of what it was. I am referring to Lolas, Swifts, etc.... all powered by turbo charged V8 engines from a number of suppliers with different tyre manufacturers etc. It cannot be a spec series.

I agree Rev... but....

Gordon Kirby ...

Of course, the tiny TV audience reached by Versus is a major factor in the struggle to sell sponsorship. So too is the sad fact that the IRL's combined print media/Internet press corps has dwindled to barely half a dozen people. The current value of the series based on TV, publicity and media space generated is reckoned to be no more than $2.5 million and a season costs a minimum of $5 million and more like $7 million. Everyone, including Penske, is struggling to fill the shortfall.

link to full article...http://www.gordonkirby.com/categories/c ... no224.html (good read, by the way)

Like I said, I can't agree with you more, but the money that fueled that era was built over time. Nobody is willing to invest the $100M's to any "build it and they will come" idea. Tony George was practically disowned over his vision (or lack there-of). And I seriously doubt anybody would have predicted that watching identical rental cars, some advertising male enhancement and/or erectile disfunction drugs, running around in circles would be one of the biggest sports in the US.

Gordon says there's a $2.5M to $4.5M PER CAR miss in cost vs. sponsorship potential. It's past time for the all in, one roll of the dice gamble. If something wild doesn't happen in the next 6 months, and I mean wild enough for the mainstream media to pop up with a "WHAT THE F***!", which will at least generate attention, we won't have anything to worry about for the 2011 season. I honestly think it's that bad. The Brickyard 400 will become the Indy 500, NASCAR will buy the track from Mary Hulman George's grandkids, and open wheel as we have known it will be gone.

Hell, we just lost Formula Atlantics. Graham Rahal doesn't have a ride but Milka Duno does!!! The face of the series sponsor (Ryan Hunter Reay for Izod) only has a deal for the first 5 races!!! and, worst of all, I (and a LOT of other people) don't get VERSUS anymore since DirecTV and Comcast (owner of Versus) decided to piss in each other's pocket.

Like I said, I agree with you on what the racing should be. ... but this patient is flat-lining.

Countersteer, all valid points...no arguments from me, and I too, have always said that the Brickyard 400 IS the Indy 500.... and you are right if I read between the lines - nobody has even noticed....

However, the media is fickle. Why spend megabucks creating a new car -batmobile or F-15 Strike Eagle- when the media will create "ooh and ahh" headlines one day, and drop the subject the next? We all know how the media works... it is cash for comment and the cash would dry up in no time. Innovations in engineering and experiments might only create interest in the IRL 500, as it did for the Indy 500 in the distant past. It will do virtually nothing for the rest of the series.

My posts here and elsewhere for a long time, have urged decision makers to cut losses - SWALLOW THEIR PRIDE- and not wait until 2011 or 2012 or 2020 or whatever...to act... no matter what contractual arrangements are in place.

Take the carbon fibre moulds out of Lola's storage, same for Swifts, source legacy Reynards, the Panoz [whatever the hell Penske and the like could get their hands on], and get Cosworth and Honda to resupply their 2.65Lt. The best time to have done this was when CART was liquidated, or at worst, when Champcar "merged" into the IRL. At that time, if the IRL itself went into voluntary liquidation to form a new truly united series with Champcar based upon best practice, then US OW would not be flatlining. At worst, it would be very sick. At best, it might have offered leverage to the Formula One teams wanting to break away.... I honestly believe that they would have prefered to join US Open Wheel [CART] rather than form a new series -particularly if they were still running races in Germany and the UK. No such thought with the IRL.

Is sponsorship overrated? Was it so important in the economic troughs of yesteryear when enthusiasts could collect enough donations or even empty out their own pockets to do what they love? In my mind - if this happened, sponsors would be falling over themselves to throw money... To do that however, the product has to be good to begin with...