F1technical.net

ncx wrote: ↑

06 Jul 2020, 12:39

I am fairly confident that, when it is said 50% efficiency with ICE and 55% including the recovery system, they include the MGU-H only, not the MGU-K. If these figures and those in the Taffin's quote provided by Blackout are all about correct ....

afaik and fwiw ....
the magic 50% isn't for anyone's ICE - it's for the PU in sustainable running
ie based on the combined crankshaft output from pistons and the steady state K power using electricity generated by the H

also - (presumably) this 50% is at full sustainable PU power - not something else more headline-convenient

2014 Turbo


2017: https://i.imgur.com/WOee04q.jpg

2017

Tommy Cookers wrote: ↑

06 Jul 2020, 12:57

ncx wrote: ↑

06 Jul 2020, 12:39

I am fairly confident that, when it is said 50% efficiency with ICE and 55% including the recovery system, they include the MGU-H only, not the MGU-K. If these figures and those in the Taffin's quote provided by Blackout are all about correct ....

afaik and fwiw ....
the magic 50% isn't for anyone's ICE - it's for the PU in sustainable running
ie based on the combined crankshaft output from pistons and the steady state K power using electricity generated by the H

also - (presumably) this 50% is at full sustainable PU power - not something else more headline-convenient

Nope. 50% is for ICE only for Merc and Renault.

Now that Renault engine really has got beans. Definitely not far behind Mercedes but clear ahead of Honda. I wonder if that rumour about information on optimizing their engine from partner Mercedes is true.......

toraabe wrote:Now that Renault engine really has got beans. Definitely not far behind Mercedes but clear ahead of Honda. I wonder if that rumour about information on optimizing their engine from partner Mercedes is true.......

Even if it would have been true... It wouldn’t have had an effect this one, furthermore, the spec has to remain the same for the rest of the season, so any information (which I doubt has been shared and is just a conspiracy theory) that Mercedes may have given Renault wouldn’t have an impact in their performance this season.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

as ive been sayibg from last year renault engine has been quite powerful for some time now.
Just as i said the same for ferrari in 2018.
The problem was the Renault engine was in some really poor chassis last year .
I dont think they are depending on mercedes knowhow.

I think that this engine is pretty good last two years, but it was and still is installed in not so good chassis. Nothing dramatic has happened to RBR when they shifted to Honda. Yes they had some reliability issues in 2017, but that was gone from last year Bahrain. I think that Merc is just amazing in aero divison. This year they gained in downforce but reduce overall drag. They are extremely aero efficient. That is why we see good performance in low downforce levels and not so good performance in high downforce levels also from others teams. Also Renault made some gains with new mechanical updates. I do not think that there was knowledge transfer from Mercedes to Renault.

SmallSoldier wrote: ↑

05 Sep 2020, 18:10

toraabe wrote:Now that Renault engine really has got beans. Definitely not far behind Mercedes but clear ahead of Honda. I wonder if that rumour about information on optimizing their engine from partner Mercedes is true.......

Even if it would have been true... It wouldn’t have had an effect this one, furthermore, the spec has to remain the same for the rest of the season, so any information (which I doubt has been shared and is just a conspiracy theory) that Mercedes may have given Renault wouldn’t have an impact in their performance this season.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

Only software

bucker wrote: ↑

05 Sep 2020, 17:19

Tommy Cookers wrote: ↑

06 Jul 2020, 12:57

ncx wrote: ↑

06 Jul 2020, 12:39

I am fairly confident that, when it is said 50% efficiency with ICE and 55% including the recovery system, they include the MGU-H only, not the MGU-K. If these figures and those in the Taffin's quote provided by Blackout are all about correct ....

afaik and fwiw ....
the magic 50% isn't for anyone's ICE - it's for the PU in sustainable running
ie based on the combined crankshaft output from pistons and the steady state K power using electricity generated by the H

also - (presumably) this 50% is at full sustainable PU power - not something else more headline-convenient

Nope. 50% is for ICE only for Merc and Renault.

Not true. They wouldn't measure it that way. You have to dig through these engine threads to see those calculations unfortunately. Lol.

The MGUH and MUGK is part of the thermal efficiency calculations with the battery at a steady state of charge. Only input energy is the fuel just like a regular calculation.

PlatinumZealot wrote: ↑

07 Sep 2020, 23:33

bucker wrote: ↑

05 Sep 2020, 17:19

Tommy Cookers wrote: ↑

06 Jul 2020, 12:57

afaik and fwiw ....
the magic 50% isn't for anyone's ICE - it's for the PU in sustainable running
ie based on the combined crankshaft output from pistons and the steady state K power using electricity generated by the H

also - (presumably) this 50% is at full sustainable PU power - not something else more headline-convenient

Nope. 50% is for ICE only for Merc and Renault.

Not true. They wouldn't measure it that way. You have to dig through these engine threads to see those calculations unfortunately. Lol.

The MGUH and MUGK is part of the thermal efficiency calculations with the battery at a steady state of charge. Only input energy is the fuel just like a regular calculation.

Yes you are right. I was wrong all that time. Just did little research.

Is it me or this is looks like a split-turbo engine
Pic is from Alonso's tour in Viry.
Looks like a Honda-Merc-like compressor airbox in front of the engine - with an upside down V-shaped air-filter (+a 2019-2018-Renault style intake manifold behind)
Air is provided by that aluminium box.
And it seems there is two aluminium pipes on each side of the airbox (intake air pipes?)
The big cylindrical pipe at the back is probably there to evacuate the exhaust gases as usual.
https://i.imgur.com/EWO2N3A.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D6RJxyUW4AASf_e.jpg:large

Some other Viry test dynos, the engine always faces the engineers room and the combustion air supply is in between...
https://i.imgur.com/b8c2fGX.jpg

toraabe wrote: ↑

05 Sep 2020, 18:02

Now that Renault engine really has got beans. Definitely not far behind Mercedes but clear ahead of Honda. I wonder if that rumour about information on optimising their engine from partner Mercedes is true.......

Since when are Mercedes and Renault partners? Have I missed something? Mercedes and Renault's engines are different concepts and if there was any inkling of this happening there would be issues with Ferrari and Red Bull. Every time a manufacturer makes a gain we always hear the rumours how Mercedes gave them a heads up. Complete stupidity and time to give the engineers at Renault some praise for finally fixing their engine and making it reliable and powerful.

I'm really enjoying watching Daniel up the top of the grid instead of somewhere in the middle.