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After the Indycars showed what could be done by going wide I believe we may see something similar in F1 this year. Why not?

See, I see it as exactly why F1 needs to get it's act together and enforce track limits everwhere.

These Indycar drivers are idiots. If track limits were abandoned, obviously you just need to do about a hundred donuts over the start/finish line and voila: race won. I could have entered on a bicycle and smashed all the track records, all while being applauded for using sustainable energy.

roon wrote: ↑

27 Mar 2019, 18:40

These Indycar drivers are idiots. If track limits were abandoned, obviously you just need to do about a hundred donuts over the start/finish line and voila: race won. I could have entered on a bicycle and smashed all the track records, all while being applauded for using sustainable energy.

Bit off topic... Many years ago a car dropped out early from a race in the Infiniti Pro Series (what IRL called Indy Lights at the time). The team owner needed to complete something like 90% of the laps in the race for it to count as a finish, so he pulled the transponder from the car, stuck it in his pocket, and began casually walking over the start/finish transponder line that extended into the pit lane every time the pack of cars crossed on the track. Timing and scoring didn't notice for a long time, then they went crazy for many laps trying to see where the car was...

Just with the comparison of lap times is the main issue power or aero with these cars compared to f1. Wiki tells me they are around 750hp so they have quite a deficit to f1

strad wrote: ↑

27 Mar 2019, 18:30

After the Indycars showed what could be done by going wide I believe we may see something similar in F1 this year. Why not?

See, I see it as exactly why F1 needs to get it's act together and enforce track limits everwhere.

Agreed.

marmer wrote: ↑

29 Mar 2019, 00:19

Just with the comparison of lap times is the main issue power or aero with these cars compared to f1. Wiki tells me they are around 750hp so they have quite a deficit to f1

Around 10% power, 90% aero

marmer wrote: ↑

29 Mar 2019, 00:19

Just with the comparison of lap times is the main issue power or aero with these cars compared to f1. Wiki tells me they are around 750hp so they have quite a deficit to f1

There is a weight difference of about 75kg, the power is lower but also no ERS-H to spool up the turbo so less lower rev torque, on aero downforce is about the same but drag is higher, there's no driver assistance...

I haven't followed Indycar lately (last decade or two ) but I think the brakes are much better in a F1 car. That alone would make a big difference in lap time.

I remember JPM saying something about the (lack of) brakes being a big difference when he went to Indycars.

nokivasara wrote: ↑

29 Mar 2019, 17:04

I haven't followed Indycar lately (last decade or two ) but I think the brakes are much better in a F1 car. That alone would make a big difference in lap time.

I remember JPM saying something about the (lack of) brakes being a big difference when he went to Indycars.

Lack of brakes is due to lack of grip, wich comes from lack of downforce

And materials I believe.

While the brakes are carbon, they are specially made for indycar. They are also able to be used for several races so the design is not as aggressive as say an F1 brake system. The lack of downforce definitely plays a role also.

strad wrote: ↑

29 Mar 2019, 19:08

And materials I believe.

Much less relevant than you may think, that´s what I did learn in this forum some time ago when someone (bhall?) told me HRT did race with steel brakes for several GPs due to lack of money, and nobody noticed any significant difference in braking perfomance. Weight penalty was obvious, but materials are much less relevant for braking perfomance than most of us usually thik

Edit: There are other series with carbon brakes wich only must last one GP, but perfomance is still light years back compared to F1. It´s grip wich comes from the high downforce loads what makes the difference

End of the day as long as you have enough force to lock the wheels up at whatever the cars top speed is you have enough braking force. Providing this is meet by the material all the choice of materials makes is weight and how long they will last for.

Ideally you would want brakes that would start to get overheated at the end of a qualification lap but manageable during the race and last the race distance.

marmer wrote: ↑

30 Mar 2019, 16:40

End of the day as long as you have enough force to lock the wheels up at whatever the cars top speed is you have enough braking force. Providing this is meet by the material all the choice of materials makes is weight and how long they will last for.

Ideally you would want brakes that would start to get overheated at the end of a qualification lap but manageable during the race and last the race distance.

One word mate...Fade

Just_a_fan wrote: ↑

29 Mar 2019, 02:12

strad wrote: ↑

27 Mar 2019, 18:30

After the Indycars showed what could be done by going wide I believe we may see something similar in F1 this year. Why not?

See, I see it as exactly why F1 needs to get it's act together and enforce track limits everwhere.

Agreed.

Agreed also! After Bahrain qualifying and race there were several cars with all 4 over the line with no track limits enforced.

The company that does the nascar pit lane marshaling should put something together for F1. That system seems mm perfect for enforcing out of bounds on at least pit road. I don't know how well it would scale but the technology is used in court sports (ie. tennis) and scaled good to the pit lane.