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There are not many circuits where Ham is not in 10/10ths form. I wonder what is it about Monaco that takes him down a notch?

ChrisDanger wrote:

Chuckjr wrote:...nice seeing Rosburg showing strong form in quali of late. I can't remember a team mate since Alonso that consistently challenged Ham

Wouldn't Rosberg have an advantage since he is much more familiar with the car? Or would Hamilton already be used to it's characteristics?

Tbh, I don't think with Hamilton there's a lot of merit to his team mate having advantage due to being "more familiar" with the car. Ham is a racer at heart, and he seems to be able to extract all avail speed in the car that that car can offer. Now how well he works with the engineers, knows the changes needed, and guides and directs the development of the car over the weekend I'm guessing is an entirely different skill set which Ros may very well have advantage. Slight difference yes, but not so slight when the top ten are within a second of one another as we have seen of late...Maybe Ros is simply better at working with people and therefore pulling a car into focus thats lost? Hams advantage being to "get in it and drive the s&@t out of it" ... but if the car just does not have the better set up, there's only so much one can do polishing a terd.

fiohaa wrote:i think Hamilton's getting too old, he should call it an end to his career - after all he got comprehensively beaten by Rosberg in Spain and dropped out the points.
hes clearly past it.

By that logic Alonso, kimi, Button, Massa, Rosberg and Webber (agree with that one) should all retire to. Vettel would have it so easy.
Predictions on the race anyone? Mercedes may pull it together, Webber should be strong too.

I'm pretty sure he was being sarcastic/trolling

GrizzleBoy wrote:I'm pretty sure he was being sarcastic/trolling

well i wasn't trolling. it was obviously a jab at people who, if schumi had finished 12th on Sunday, would have said those exact words.
but when Hamilton is in the car.....Ooooooh its all the cars fault isn't it?
(and im not dissing Ham at all, hes an awesome driver who cannot use ANY of his primary skills in this current racing, which is driving flat out at all times)

hamilton did say he was completely lost with the setup that weekend... he'll do better in monaco for sure!

fiohaa wrote:

GrizzleBoy wrote:I'm pretty sure he was being sarcastic/trolling

well i wasn't trolling. it was obviously a jab at people who, if schumi had finished 12th on Sunday, would have said those exact words.
but when Hamilton is in the car.....Ooooooh its all the cars fault isn't it?
(and im not dissing Ham at all, hes an awesome driver who cannot use ANY of his primary skills in this current racing, which is driving flat out at all times)

So are you suggesting that the myth about Hamilton not being able to look after his tyres in the race still exists?

Because if so, that's absolute rubbish.

Dyanxx wrote:

fiohaa wrote: well i wasn't trolling. it was obviously a jab at people who, if schumi had finished 12th on Sunday, would have said those exact words.
but when Hamilton is in the car.....Ooooooh its all the cars fault isn't it?
(and im not dissing Ham at all, hes an awesome driver who cannot use ANY of his primary skills in this current racing, which is driving flat out at all times)

So are you suggesting that the myth about Hamilton not being able to look after his tyres in the race still exists?

Because if so, that's absolute rubbish.

No he isn't

beelsebob wrote:I can see Rosberg beating Hamilton to pole here to be honest. Hamilton loves the circuit, but has never really gone particularly well here.

At Canada though, I'd expect Hamilton to blow Rosberg out of the water.

It's a mix of bad luck and driver mistake;

He did have 2 good years in 2007 and 2008.

He took himself out in Q in 2009 with a potentially pole-and-race-winning car, like Alonso did in 2010.

In 2010, the car had --- mechanical grip, and he just maximised position; likewise in 2012 (at least the Monaco-spec MP4-27).

In 2011, I think he was the only one that could have challenged Vettel for pole but the team made a huge mistake in Q3 and he never recovered - Jenson had pace in the race, suggesting that Lewis could have definitely won it had he started from the front row.

He just never had a clean GP when the car was under him (2009 - 2011).

Half a second is coming for Spa.
You heard it here first!

beelsebob wrote: The thing is, there are many who don't think Schumacher really deserves the "great" title that much either (don't get me wrong, he's clearly a talented driver). Instead, he just hit the sport at a time when there weren't that many great drivers (at least after 94), and got lucky with cars.

Basically, the greatest talents that Schumacher faced were Senna (who probably would have beaten him several more times, given the performance of the williams in subsequent years), Hakinnen (who beat him as often as got beaten), and well... no one else really very talented after 1994. Add to that the the Ferrari was the bomb between 2000 and 2005 and he pretty much had everything sewn up before he even started.

Senna would have probably get beaten a few more times as well:
In 1992 his first full season Schumacher beat Senna.
In 1993 Senna beat Schumacher.
In 1994 it was 20-0 before Imola happened.

As for Hakkinen and Schumacher, the title went to wire in 1998 when McLaren was a much better car. And in 1999 Shumacher broke his leg mid season. When roles were reversed a bit, Schumacher destroyed the competition.

It is also funny that people always credit Newey for Vettel's title. In that respect Schumacher pretty much earned all his 7 titles against this Newey guy....

LionKing wrote: Senna would have probably get beaten a few more times as well:
In 1992 his first full season Schumacher beat Senna.
In 1993 Senna beat Schumacher.
In 1994 it was 20-0 before Imola happened.

Careful now, remember that the Williams in 1994 was dodgy at the start, and improved greatly later on to a point where Hill was challenging for the title closely, it is not unreasonable to think that Senna would have done a better job than Hill and won the title that year. We will never know what would have happened though.

I will leave out my analysis of 1992 and 1993, as I do not want to annoy the mods with fanboy ying/yang. I do agree with your points about Schumi later on though. 1999 even I forget he was well on his way to the title before Silverstone.

n smikle wrote:
Nico needs to get sponsors and FAST! The Siroktin Gutierrez cash combo is just too much for Peter Sauber to refuse.

This is what I was sort of getting at, I was not sure how much money Hulky had in his pocket to sway teams. I am not big Hulky fan, I have no opinion of him as a person, but as a driver I think he deserves a chance with a biggish team. Heck, he defo deserves a seat in F1.

Sauber may survive of those drivers, but they will be a joke of a team if that is there line up.

sennafan24 wrote:

LionKing wrote: Senna would have probably get beaten a few more times as well:
In 1992 his first full season Schumacher beat Senna.
In 1993 Senna beat Schumacher.
In 1994 it was 20-0 before Imola happened.

Careful now, remember that the Williams in 1994 was dodgy at the start, and improved greatly later on to a point where Hill was challenging for the title closely, it is not unreasonable to think that Senna would have done a better job than Hill and won the title that year. We will never know what would have happened though.

I will leave out my analysis of 1992 and 1993, as I do not want to annoy the mods with fanboy ying/yang. I do agree with your points about Schumi later on though. 1999 even I forget he was well on his way to the title before Silverstone.

Senna claimed 3 pole positions with 1994 car at the beginning of the season. At Brasil he spun out towards the end of the race when 5 secs behind. At the second race, he was passed by Schumacher at the start and was out due to contact. At Imola he was a few seconds in front. So definitely Williams was also very good car at the start as well.

Hill's challenge for the title was partly due to administrative decisions:
Out of 16 races Schumacher basically ended up competing in 12 because of 2 DSQs and 2 race ban. How many points did Hill get in these 4 races? 40 points! In other words, like a 12 race season with a guy starting with 4 race headstart.

Schumacher collected 92 points in 12 races. Schumacher's teams mates got 11 points in 18 races....

Yes, there is no doubt that Sebastien Vettel is a fabulous driver. I was there when he raced for the first time at Indianapolis and was delighted to see this brash youngster storm into the sport and score a point in his first race. In fact, I have been a Vettel fan all along the way.

But over the weekend at Monza, Team Red Bull held a small celebration for Webber's last Grand Prix in Europe. The entire team was present. Jenson Button showed up. And even Sir Frank Williams was in attendance. Sir Frank had to be carried up 16 steps in his wheel chair to get to the location.

But Vettel stayed downstairs, playing with his iPhone.

And so, Sebastien, I have to tell you, who have just won the Italian Grand Prix at Monza for the third time, I think your decision to boycott the Webber shindig was classless and, frankly, my opinion of you as a person has slipped several notches as a result. He told the press "Webber and I are no longer friends. We respect each other, but we are not friends."

As I am typing this, the fans are booing Vettel on the podium at Monza. I'm beginning to understand why.

I was starting to sleep through this one, never made it to last round of pit stops. Boring Race!
Sort of a good thing as I didn't have to watch Vettel and that darstardly Horner celebrate