F1technical.net

they make the time same as FR2.0 in Donington in the pre season test, but don't forget FE is not using slick tires, it is a full season race tire, it is a huge disadvantage

I think FE got it wrong by setting itself up too slow.

They got it wrong by going for a high drag configuration with conventional wings rather than full under body tunnels
They got the tyres all wrong, don't see what the current configuration achieves. Even local club racers have better tyres
They went for a 200 kg battery which certainly does not seem adequate, maybe a 400kg battery would have added more to the car performance

And the tracks though they are located in cities the layouts are just awful.

WilliamsF1 wrote:I think FE got it wrong by setting itself up too slow.
And the tracks though they are located in cities the layouts are just awful.

Agreed, how many high speed sweeping bends seen so far? One?

Give 'em a turn at Phillip Island on the high speed Moto G.P. circuit, that'd sort 'em out..

Formula E is about sustainability. The tyres are as they are so that teams don't have to cart large numbers of spare tyres and wheels around the world. That costs money and burns fuel in the transport planes. A 400kg battery would make the cars very heavy (they're already too heavy), which is why they've used a 400kg battery split over two cars to get the performance they wanted for the whole race length they wanted without having to swap batteries or recharge. Personally, I'd have rather seen two shorter races though.

On the subject of tracks, they have to be slow so that the cars can last the race distance. As great as it would be so see them doing 190mph, the batteries would be dead in moments. That's why the courses have such low average speeds - less than 80mph in Beijing.

andylaurence wrote:Formula E is about sustainability. The tyres are as they are so that teams don't have to cart large numbers of spare tyres and wheels around the world. That costs money and burns fuel in the transport planes. A 400kg battery would make the cars very heavy (they're already too heavy), which is why they've used a 400kg battery split over two cars to get the performance they wanted for the whole race length they wanted without having to swap batteries or recharge. Personally, I'd have rather seen two shorter races though.

Michelin are great in making endurance tyres; they can probably make dry tyres that last all the races (considering 10 races 90 km each) without any issue. and lugging around 1 spare set of wet weather tyres is not an issue (which hey probably are).

400 KG battery:
- The current car weighs 890 kgs with a driver.
- current car has a 200 kg battery
- a 26 kg motor
- 15 kg of power electronics
- probably a 30kg gearbox
- some cooling equipment (which is not much)

So why does the car weigh 890 kgs

A typical formula race car is around 400-500 kgs with a 100 kg engine

WilliamsF1 wrote:Michelin are great in making endurance tyres; they can probably make dry tyres that last all the races (considering 10 races 90 km each) without any issue. and lugging around 1 spare set of wet weather tyres is not an issue (which hey probably are).

Lugging around wet tyres as well as dry means twice the number of tyres being transported. Most of my spares package is wheels and I suspect it accounts for a large proportion of most teams' spares package.

WilliamsF1 wrote:400 KG battery:
- The current car weighs 890 kgs with a driver.
- current car has a 200 kg battery
- a 26 kg motor
- 15 kg of power electronics
- probably a 30kg gearbox
- some cooling equipment (which is not much)

So why does the car weigh 890 kgs

A typical formula race car is around 400-500 kgs with a 100 kg engine

That's a good question. I don't know, but let's compare with an F3 car. An F3 car is 550kg with driver, whilst the Formula E car is 888kg with driver. That's a difference of 338kg. Comparatively, the engine, exhaust and fuel system won't be needed, saving perhaps 120kg. There's bigger wheels (and tyres) and bigger brakes (to slow a heavier car and fill those big wheels), which might account for an extra 20kg. The cooling system might well be heavier, given it has to cool the motor, electronics and batteries. I'm not sure where you got the figures for the motor/electronics from, but that's 41kg to add, most likely with about 10kg of wiring loom and mountings to fit it all. The Formula E website lists 320kg for the batteries. List just those elements and we're at 821kg, which is only 67kg (7.5%) from the listed figure.

I'd be interested to see a BOM for either an F3 car or the Spark-Renault SRT_01E FOrmula E car.

WilliamsF1 wrote:I think FE got it wrong by setting itself up too slow.

They got it wrong by going for a high drag configuration with conventional wings rather than full under body tunnels

Agree, I think once they start with car development the only rule regarding aerodynamics should be: wings are banned.

If this is about efficiency, wings are a contradiction. Yes tons of downforce, but also tons of drag, wich drains the battery quite fast. With more slippery cars they could be much faster in the straights, the races could be much longer.... everything would be much better, except the cornering speed obviously, but the benefits would be more than the drawbacks

This makes me think.... what percentage of current F1 downforce could be achieved with free aero development and no wings? Any guess someone?

WilliamsF1 wrote:They got the tyres all wrong, don't see what the current configuration achieves. Even local club racers have better tyres

I love this rule, it provides real competition, I´m a bit tired of F1 overtakings, 90% of them are not driver related, but DRS, or different tires

And if it starts raining no red flags, no accidents due to drivers overstating his tires capabilities before switching to wet tires....

Also what andy said, they´re a big factor for cost cutting

WilliamsF1 wrote:They went for a 200 kg battery which certainly does not seem adequate, maybe a 400kg battery would have added more to the car performance

I also would love to see cars with more endurance even if they´re heavier, but as a drone pilot I can tell you battery weight can´t be increased infinitely. Double battery capacity does equal double battery endurance, the added weight makes you drain the battery faster, so at some point it´s not worth to increase battery capacity any further.

I don´t know what are the numbers for FE, but considering FE cars, without battery and driver, are around 600kg, 200kg of added battery weight looks like a really big battery

WilliamsF1 wrote:And the tracks though they are located in cities the layouts are just awful.

I love the idea of urban tracks to improve visibility for the championship, but the layouts are just awful, that´s true

Putrajaya ePrix was fun, victory for Sam Bird but there was two drivers who made an asthonishing recover, Lucas DiGrassi from 18th grid position to 2nd, and Jerome D´Ambrosio from last 20th to 5th. And they didn´t need DRS or crappy tires on an urban track

Nick Heidfeld was pushed to the wall again, this time by Franck Montagny. Prost was the fastest on qualifying, but started from 11th place because he had a 10 position grid penalty for his crash with Heidfeld in China on the last corner





Full results

Those highlights looked quite allright to me! I can't wait to see where this is going in one or two seasons as the cars improve. But, why, oh why? That was DRS allright at the 1:30 mark.

I was talking about D´Ambrosio and DiGrassi´s recovers, they did it with same car, same tires, etc. than the rest of the grid

Yes fan boost is some sort of DRS, but only for 3 drivers (Heidfeld, Legge and Senna this time) and only for 5 seconds, same as if in F1 they could use DRS only two times in the whole GP


IMO that´s a simple marketing exercice to atract young people, so they can think they´re interacting with the race, but the real influence is quite limited

Andres125sx wrote:I was talking about D´Ambrosio and DiGrassi´s recovers, they did it with same car, same tires, etc. than the rest of the grid

Yes fan boost is some sort of DRS, but only for 3 drivers (Heidfeld, Legge and Senna this time) and only for 5 seconds, same as if in F1 they could use DRS only two times in the whole GP


IMO that´s a simple marketing exercice to atract young people, so they can think they´re interacting with the race, but the real influence is quite limited

It was watchable. Wasn't special. Whoever came up with the safety car procedure deserves a bullet. (whoever came up with the safety car too actually) 20% of the race was safety car again.
The noise wasn't as irritating as last time, probably better mixing. It's still a little bland with the low powers and speeds.

Scarbs about FE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9L-DAdR ... MnVLKB-3VA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIskD3V ... VA&index=1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jr8ouxl ... VA&index=7

Putrajaya Extended (19 minutes) Highlights, almost full race

Third EPrix in two days



Punta del Este, Uruguay - Round 3

"The 3rd world Monaco"