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Re: 2022 Aero Thread
Posted: 05 Jan 2021, 00:20
by jjn9128
jacobianminkowski wrote: ↑04 Jan 2021, 23:33
the 2022 rv profile volume in the pdf I downloaded a few weeks ago is 960. I think its the October 2020 published date
Oh FFS. Trying to make another car for the front page now I have to go back through the damn appendix
Re: 2022 Aero Thread
Posted: 05 Jan 2021, 01:37
by Zynerji
jjn9128 wrote: ↑05 Jan 2021, 00:20
jacobianminkowski wrote: ↑04 Jan 2021, 23:33
the 2022 rv profile volume in the pdf I downloaded a few weeks ago is 960. I think its the October 2020 published date
Oh FFS. Trying to make another car for the front page now I have to go back through the damn appendix
First world problems...
Re: 2022 Aero Thread
Posted: 05 Jan 2021, 01:46
by jjn9128
Zynerji wrote: ↑05 Jan 2021, 01:37
jjn9128 wrote: ↑05 Jan 2021, 00:20
jacobianminkowski wrote: ↑04 Jan 2021, 23:33
the 2022 rv profile volume in the pdf I downloaded a few weeks ago is 960. I think its the October 2020 published date
Oh FFS. Trying to make another car for the front page now I have to go back through the damn appendix
First world problems...
And they're such minor changes too
Luckily the front wing is the same - we're working on some CFD of different variations.
Re: 2022 Aero Thread
Posted: 05 Jan 2021, 03:30
by jacobianminkowski
ÿeah it sucks. the two versions of the rules I have different reference planes to. hopefully you only have to change dimensions.
Re: 2022 Aero Thread
Posted: 05 Jan 2021, 03:39
by Zynerji
jjn9128 wrote: ↑05 Jan 2021, 01:46
Zynerji wrote: ↑05 Jan 2021, 01:37
First world problems...
And they're such minor changes too
Luckily the front wing is the same - we're working on some CFD of different variations.
I'd be interested in some initial impressions of the wheel cover blade.
Re: 2022 Aero Thread
Posted: 05 Jan 2021, 10:42
by jjn9128
Zynerji wrote: ↑05 Jan 2021, 03:39
I'd be interested in some initial impressions of the wheel cover blade.
The "drum deflectors" are standard parts which unfortunately are not described at all in the rules so we've had to approximate something close. That said I'm sure it's something we can look them - they're an interesting new feature in the rules and having a with/without CFD might be interesting.
Re: 2022 Aero Thread
Posted: 05 Jan 2021, 12:34
by mzso
jjn9128 wrote: ↑04 Jan 2021, 22:55
and the keel has been moved forward (the planks front edge is now 430mm behind the front axle not 710mm).
Do I read that right, so it means near 0.3m more floor (venturi tunnel)? It seems like a huge change.
Umm. What the hell does this mean?
Re: 2022 Aero Thread
Posted: 05 Jan 2021, 13:32
by jjn9128
mzso wrote: ↑05 Jan 2021, 12:34
jjn9128 wrote: ↑04 Jan 2021, 22:55
and the keel has been moved forward (the planks front edge is now 430mm behind the front axle not 710mm).
Do I read that right, so it means near 0.3m more floor (venturi tunnel)? It seems like a huge change.
No the venturi is the same length (assuming a constant wheelbase) but the pod in the centre of the floor starts further forward. It moves the plank front to the same place as now. This will force them to run a higher front ride height than would be possible before and probably less rake as a result.
mzso wrote: ↑05 Jan 2021, 12:34
Umm. What the hell does this mean?
The rear wing in the rules is split into 5 volumes - (1) profiles, (2) endplate, (3) tip, (4) beam, & (5) pylons. The profiles volume contains the 2 element wing, while the endplate is a single section, so the "tip" is used to blend the 2 wing profiles into the endplate. Interestingly it's not necessary to blend the beam wing into the endplate like the 2022 wind tunnel model they showed in Austin 2019.
There have been 4 versions of these 2022 regs so far that I've now seen 6/11/19, 6/3/20, 30/3/20, and 30/10/20 and still they're not complete. There are still comments like this:
[To be defined by the FIA after team consultation and final decision on how the forwards floor structure will be regulated]
Re: 2022 Aero Thread
Posted: 05 Jan 2021, 17:53
by mzso
jjn9128 wrote: ↑05 Jan 2021, 13:32
No the venturi is the same length (assuming a constant wheelbase) but the pod in the centre of the floor starts further forward.
I thought that would disappear with the lowering of the nose. Is a keel actually enforced by regulations?
By the way. I get the impression that you guys work with 3D models. Can't you put it up on the website via webgl? (With or without CFD)
jjn9128 wrote: ↑05 Jan 2021, 13:32
The rear wing in the rules is split into 5 volumes - (1) profiles, (2) endplate, (3) tip, (4) beam, & (5) pylons. The profiles volume contains the 2 element wing, while the endplate is a single section, so the "tip" is used to blend the 2 wing profiles into the endplate. Interestingly it's not necessary to blend the beam wing into the endplate like the 2022 wind tunnel model they showed in Austin 2019.
Thanks for the explanation.
Re: 2022 Aero Thread
Posted: 05 Jan 2021, 18:23
by jjn9128
mzso wrote: ↑05 Jan 2021, 17:53
jjn9128 wrote: ↑05 Jan 2021, 13:32
No the venturi is the same length (assuming a constant wheelbase) but the pod in the centre of the floor starts further forward.
I thought that would disappear with the lowering of the nose. Is a keel actually enforced by regulations?
By the way. I get the impression that you guys work with 3D models. Can't you put it up on the website via webgl? (With or without CFD)
The nose itself isn't all that much lower than now. The tub section is actually a bit higher as is the cockpit and rollhoop. The keel splits the flow around the drivers hips/bum and will also provide some impact protection I think.
We made a decision that we wouldn't share our cad with anyone which keeps things fair, or do you mean something where the model can be viewed but not downloaded?
Re: 2022 Aero Thread
Posted: 05 Jan 2021, 20:37
by mzso
jjn9128 wrote: ↑05 Jan 2021, 18:23
or do you mean something where the model can be viewed but not downloaded?
Yeah. So one can watch the car any way one wants.
Re: 2022 Aero Thread
Posted: 06 Jan 2021, 12:19
by toraabe
jjn9128 wrote: ↑05 Jan 2021, 13:32
mzso wrote: ↑05 Jan 2021, 12:34
jjn9128 wrote: ↑04 Jan 2021, 22:55
and the keel has been moved forward (the planks front edge is now 430mm behind the front axle not 710mm).
Do I read that right, so it means near 0.3m more floor (venturi tunnel)? It seems like a huge change.
No the venturi is the same length (assuming a constant wheelbase) but the pod in the centre of the floor starts further forward. It moves the plank front to the same place as now. This will force them to run a higher front ride height than would be possible before and probably less rake as a result.
mzso wrote: ↑05 Jan 2021, 12:34
Umm. What the hell does this mean?
The rear wing in the rules is split into 5 volumes - (1) profiles, (2) endplate, (3) tip, (4) beam, & (5) pylons. The profiles volume contains the 2 element wing, while the endplate is a single section, so the "tip" is used to blend the 2 wing profiles into the endplate. Interestingly it's not necessary to blend the beam wing into the endplate like the 2022 wind tunnel model they showed in Austin 2019.
There have been 4 versions of these 2022 regs so far that I've now seen 6/11/19, 6/3/20, 30/3/20, and 30/10/20 and still they're not complete. There are still comments like this:
[To be defined by the FIA after team consultation and final decision on how the forwards floor structure will be regulated]
As low rake as possible to seal the floor.
Re: 2022 Aero Thread
Posted: 11 Jan 2021, 21:28
by jjn9128
Working on some CAD (as ever) for CFD which may never see the light of day. Thought I'd share a visual representation of how much longer the noses on the 2022 cars are than 2019-21, and how much bigger the 2022 tyres are. It's rather shocking when seen side-by-side.
Re: 2022 Aero Thread
Posted: 12 Jan 2021, 04:43
by jacobianminkowski
does the nose have to go out beyond the wing like that?
Re: 2022 Aero Thread
Posted: 12 Jan 2021, 09:08
by Stu
When viewed like that it makes me wonder why they do not put a limit on front overhang, it would naturally limit the front wing aero & the front floor aero as the nose structure (and therefore the forward chassis structure would need to be lower - particularly as the nose height is mandated).
The increase in height of the tyres is ridiculous!!
