F1technical.net

Tommy Cookers wrote: ↑

22 Mar 2020, 00:35

ENGINE TUNER wrote: ↑

21 Mar 2020, 23:01

....But electromechanical(Freevalve) or rotary valve actuation, should be something F1 opens up in the upcoming(hopefully) regs for 2025 ....

doesn't the footage show hydraulic valve actuation with pneumatic return ? - not the electromechanical 'Freevalve'
electromechanical won't cut it in F1

I remember some type of electrical coil in there, or I'm forgetting stuff again.

The video guy says "electro hydraulic/pneumatic" but freevalve's own video has a mechanical spring in there too.

The engine formula doenst end after this year, so why the topic name?

I remember some type of electrical coil in there, or I'm forgetting stuff again.

I believe you are remembering a trial by Renault F1.
I think if memory serves there was a problem with the weight and the fact that being on top of the engine it raised the center of gravity.

Pyrone89 wrote: ↑

22 Mar 2020, 02:43

The engine formula doenst end after this year, so why the topic name?

There was supposed to be reg changes to the engines for 2021, but they wisely decided against it. Next major PU reg changes shifted to 2025, but corona may effect that.

strad wrote: ↑

22 Mar 2020, 02:57

I remember some type of electrical coil in there, or I'm forgetting stuff again.

I believe you are remembering a trial by Renault F1.
I think if memory serves there was a problem with the weight and the fact that being on top of the engine it raised the center of gravity.

Nope, definitely not remembering that. Every freevalve video shows something different, so I just don't know which is the actual system.

What's "hot vee"?

Blackout wrote: ↑

22 Mar 2020, 11:21

What's "hot vee"?

Exhaust coming out in to the V rather than out either side. The turbo is then sat between the cylinder banks. Makes for a more compact overall design.

Thanks. Reminds me of the Ferrari 126C

In a “hot vee” the intake will replace the exhaust and the exhaust + turbocharger will make the engine a lot more top-heavy.

ENGINE TUNER wrote: ↑

22 Mar 2020, 03:16

strad wrote: ↑

22 Mar 2020, 02:57

I remember some type of electrical coil in there, or I'm forgetting stuff again.

I believe you are remembering a trial by Renault F1.
I think if memory serves there was a problem with the weight and the fact that being on top of the engine it raised the center of gravity.

Nope, definitely not remembering that. Every freevalve video shows something different, so I just don't know which is the actual system.

A ‘cam-less engine’ no matter the fancy name will have the valves solenoid (electric) operated.

saviour stivala wrote: ↑

22 Mar 2020, 13:44

... A ‘cam-less engine’ no matter the fancy name will have the valves solenoid (electric) operated.

a solenoid is an inductive device - so somewhat limited in response/controllability (and efficiency)
non-solenoidal electric actuation eg by a 'motor action'/'voice coil' type device is less limited
(yes it might look like a solenoid)

hydraulic actuation (eg Moog's stuff) is of course the least limited - and so the best able to compete directly with cams

At around 2009 both Renault and BMW were reported to be experimenting with a computer controlled electro-hydraulic valve actuating system using no camshafts. The system back than is said to have had pressure in the upper part of the valve piston controlled with electro actuated solenoid valve (EVA), a way which made it possible to control exact time of valve opening. Oil for actuating valve movement was contained in a pressurised tank, pressuring the lower part of valve piston (constant pressure to ensure fast closing of valve). Because such a system have variable valve timing possibilities, it was never used in F1.

ENGINE TUNER wrote: ↑

22 Mar 2020, 01:37

Tommy Cookers wrote: ↑

22 Mar 2020, 00:35

ENGINE TUNER wrote: ↑

21 Mar 2020, 23:01

....But electromechanical(Freevalve) or rotary valve actuation, should be something F1 opens up in the upcoming(hopefully) regs for 2025 ....

doesn't the footage show hydraulic valve actuation with pneumatic return ? - not the electromechanical 'Freevalve'
electromechanical won't cut it in F1

I remember some type of electrical coil in there, or I'm forgetting stuff again.

The video guy says "electro hydraulic/pneumatic" but freevalve's own video has a mechanical spring in there too.

Yes there is a spring. Even formula one pneumatic valve system had it when it was first used. The spring serves as a safety net in case of actuating system failure to prevent the vales dropping down and hitting piston top.

saviour stivala wrote: ↑

23 Mar 2020, 12:49

ENGINE TUNER wrote: ↑

22 Mar 2020, 01:37

Tommy Cookers wrote: ↑

22 Mar 2020, 00:35

doesn't the footage show hydraulic valve actuation with pneumatic return ? - not the electromechanical 'Freevalve'
electromechanical won't cut it in F1

I remember some type of electrical coil in there, or I'm forgetting stuff again.

The video guy says "electro hydraulic/pneumatic" but freevalve's own video has a mechanical spring in there too.

Yes there is a spring. Even formula one pneumatic valve system had it when it was first used. The spring serves as a safety net in case of actuating system failure to prevent the vales dropping down and hitting piston top.

No. The spring was there to keep the valves in the right position if the pneumatic system was "switched off". So basically when the engine wasn't running.That's the only reason the spring is there.
If the camshaft fails in any way, the airpressure would keep the valves close. If you have loss of airpressure, the spring wouldn't be strong enough to close the valve fast enough befor the piston hits the valve.

If any of the four camshafts of a formula one engine fails in any which way either while the engine is running or prior to the engine being fired-up the engine is scrap wire-coil spring or not. But some road going engines valve left and combustion space is such that the valve will not hit the piston top while the engine is rotating and either the camshaft is not rotating or the return system has failed. Repeat:- the spring is meant to prevent the valve dropping down and hitting the top of piston when stationary and the return system (whatever return system is used) fails, especially if the engine needs to be rotated on engines that the valve lift and combustion space makes it possible for valves and pistons to clash.