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Re: Mercedes Power Unit
Posted: 03 Sep 2017, 05:44
by J.A.W.
NoDivergence wrote: ↑02 Sep 2017, 19:41
J.A.W. wrote: ↑28 Aug 2017, 03:24
Never-the-less, the M-B's ability to 'spool-up' & extend away, via prodigious power-over-drag capability..
relative to the Ferrari, including all energy utilization ( per visible flame from ICE, as tell-tale) is clear..
The Mercedes has less drag than the Ferrari
Less drag? Really?
Its my understanding, that cars run an optimum level of downforce induced drag, so top speed @ drag limit=max power..
& if Vettel had the power to stay close enough within Hamilton's 'slipstream' - 'til DRS was available, a pass could be on..
..but in the event,the M-B rapidly showed a 'clean pair of heels' ( & even a rich flame 'fart' - to 'add insult to injury') & won..
Re: Mercedes Power Unit
Posted: 03 Sep 2017, 07:37
by GPR-A duplicate2
GPR-A wrote: ↑27 Aug 2017, 17:52
Coming into the Spa Race weekend, it was widely expected that Mercedes would run away with the GP due to the power sensitive nature of the circuit.
They brought a new spec engine (which wasn't expected) and still could barely manage to get ahead of Ferrari, who were on the older spec engine. Based on what was on display in Silverstone, the expectation was Mercedes to dominate even with older spec. That did not happen.
And here is a news of FIA enforcing the new rules on Mercedes PU also.
https://it.motorsport.com/f1/news/consu ... za-945275/
I am having a theory.
1. Did Mercedes know, the new rules are going to affect them, regardless of their early introduction of the latest spec PU in Spa, instead of Monza?
2. With their new Spec, are they compliant to new rules and that is why the new Spec was just a match to Ferrari''s current spec? Because, on the power sensitive Silverstone, the old spec Mercedes PU was miles ahead of Ferrari's current spec.
3. Is this what is going to happen to Ferrari too, when they have to introduce their FIA OIl Directive compliant PU for Monza?
https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/1315 ... e-strategy
Sources have suggested that Mercedes' Spa engines ran below the 0.9l per 100km level during the Belgian GP, so would have complied with the new restriction anyway.
Not a bad theory of mine.
Re: Mercedes Power Unit
Posted: 06 Sep 2017, 23:08
by lio007
Cool comparison pic from this and last years PU:
Re: Mercedes Power Unit
Posted: 08 Sep 2017, 22:39
by lio007
There is quite a lot made inhouse in Brixworth: Valves, cams, crankshaft, cylinder heads+blocks, tc+compressor,...
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=2uGLf05eO ... u_xL2J3IoB
Re: Mercedes Power Unit
Posted: 09 Sep 2017, 01:11
by Zynerji
Re: Mercedes Power Unit
Posted: 09 Sep 2017, 12:55
by 63l8qrrfy6
It's not that surprising - Cosworth even had their own foundry a few decades ago.
By contrast, from what I gather Renault is the manufacturer that farms out most of their components (both design and manufacture).
Re: Mercedes Power Unit
Posted: 09 Sep 2017, 13:00
by gruntguru
Renault race team or Renault engines?
Re: Mercedes Power Unit
Posted: 09 Sep 2017, 13:14
by 63l8qrrfy6
Renault engines.
They were using Mecachrome in the past for much of the manufacture and assembly, then I understand they had some sort of dispute and ended up replacing them with multiple suppliers/ contractors.
Re: Mercedes Power Unit
Posted: 09 Sep 2017, 17:33
by ringo
energy recovery and deployment "schedules"..
Can someone elaborate on that?
Re: Mercedes Power Unit
Posted: 09 Sep 2017, 19:32
by Edax
ringo wrote: ↑09 Sep 2017, 17:33
energy recovery and deployment "schedules"..
Can someone elaborate on that?
As I understand the car knows where it is on track based on driver inputs, and energy harvesting and deployment is scheduled to maximize efficiency.
Re: Mercedes Power Unit
Posted: 09 Sep 2017, 23:18
by Maritimer
ringo wrote: ↑09 Sep 2017, 17:33
energy recovery and deployment "schedules"..
Can someone elaborate on that?
Based on when the driver hits each pedal and how hard, the car figures out which corner it just went through. This is what Alonso fooled at Spa causing his car to not give him hybrid boost at one point in qualifying.
Re: Mercedes Power Unit
Posted: 10 Sep 2017, 08:22
by ringo
Hmm kinds of makes racing more orchestrated than anything. Once the car goes off track it may take some time for the computers to figure out where on track the car is again. The driver would have to come up to racing speed first before deployment is synchronized.The driver who plays the pedals right and sticks to the script gets the most out of the car. the car seems more like a musical instrument now.
Re: Mercedes Power Unit
Posted: 10 Sep 2017, 15:27
by Zynerji
This is why I don't like the variable gps maps.
It is a driver aid, plain and simple.
Re: Mercedes Power Unit
Posted: 10 Sep 2017, 16:11
by PhillipM
They're not GPS, it uses the onboard sensors, which is why it's easy to fool. If it actually had GPS it'd be more foolproof.
Re: Mercedes Power Unit
Posted: 11 Sep 2017, 00:41
by ringo
Zynerji wrote: ↑10 Sep 2017, 15:27
This is why I don't like the variable gps maps.
It is a driver aid, plain and simple.
It's probably the opposite of a driver aid. The drivers have to concentrate more to eliminate any "noise" ie unnecessary and arbitrary presses of the pedals, and steering movements to get the most out of the electrical energy deployment strategy.
For example if the simulation needs the car to be 100% throttle for 5 seconds after a particular turn then it starts some kind of deployment, then the driver has to make sure he sticks to the script and not let off the pedal or turn the steering wheel nonchalantly. He has to play the "musical notes" just right to take advantage of the "tune".
This deployment schedule is like an extreme case of nursing a car.