F1technical.net

Anyone has an idea what the peak cyl pressures are in the 1.6 turbo units? I recently read that the 1.0 liter Ford Ecoboost has 100 bar peak pressures, and modern common rail diesels have around 200 bar pressures. I guess the 1.6 liter F1 engine has more than 120 bar peak pressure.

Calculate the estimated unit power output per piston unit area - of the recip' mill & work it out from there?

Have a link or calculation assist?

Suggest you check the current F1 engine info - at the top of this section - for those metrics..

Could you do some home-work on BMEP & etc?

What interests me is peak pressures, not BMEP.

peak pressure is about 320 bar. Temperatures about 3,400 Kelvin. From my calculations at least.

That is very high. Perhaps you could share your calculations?

Peak cycle pressures in a modern production turbodiesel auto engine probably don't get much higher than 200 bar. Turbo SI gas engines probably have peak cycle pressures a bit lower than that.

riff_raff wrote:Peak cycle pressures in a modern production turbodiesel auto engine probably don't get much higher than 200 bar. Turbo SI gas engines probably have peak cycle pressures a bit lower than that.

"...probably... ...a bit..." r-r?
Surely a higher level of quantitative confidence (& expressed numerically) is do-able for a man of your expertise..

OK at 18:1 AFR
10:1 CR
0.5 kg/s airflow
0.0277 kg/s fuel flow
CAT = 70*C
Air standard Otto cycle gives 377 bar and T = 3600*K

So, not far from Ringo's numbers. Real numbers of course are much lower than air standard due to heat loss, longer burn duration etc. I would guess 250 bar and 2600 K (plus or minus quite a lot)

http://www-old.me.gatech.edu/energy/ICE ... alysis.pdf

gruntguru wrote:OK at 18:1 AFR
10:1 CR
0.5 kg/s airflow
0.0277 kg/s fuel flow
CAT = 70*C
Air standard Otto cycle gives 377 bar and T = 3600*K

So, not far from Ringo's numbers. Real numbers of course are much lower than air standard due to heat loss, longer burn duration etc. I would guess 250 bar and 2600 K (plus or minus quite a lot)

http://www-old.me.gatech.edu/energy/ICE ... alysis.pdf

CAT=Compressor Air Temperature (outlet)???

CAT = charge air temperature. Air temp entering the engine (i.e. intercooler exit)

J.A.W. wrote:"...probably... ...a bit..." r-r?
Surely a higher level of quantitative confidence (& expressed numerically) is do-able for a man of your expertise..

Worst case peak cycle pressures in any IC engine during its entire operational life can vary greatly. As for the peak cycle pressures the engine is designed to handle during typical operating conditions, these will be close to what I noted.

The 500kW turbocharged Honda RA-168E 1.5L V6 F1 engine at 2.5bar boost had peak cycle pressures below 170bar (see fig. 6):

http://www.k20a.org/upload/HondaRA168EEngine.pdf

Ok r-r, but how many races did that old Honda have to manage between strip-down/overhauls?

The swingeing constraints on current F1 mills mean the need to handle pressures sans strain..
..is higher than back then, surely?

Which is of course a factor in them being built so heavily & expensively..

Can I please revise my estimate from 250 bar (plus or minus quite a lot) to 200 bar (plus or minus quite a lot)?