Mercedes AMG F1 W06

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W06 Speculation

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CmdrVOODOO wrote:
turbof1 wrote:I'm trying to bend my head around how those camera pods are legal. This is the rule that has been specifically changed to this year:
20.3.4 When viewed from the side of the car, the entire camera or camera housing in position 2
shown in Drawing 6 must lie within a box formed by two vertical lines 150mm and 450mm forward of the front wheel centre line and two horizontal lines 325mm and 525mm above the reference plane. Furthermore, the entire camera or camera housing in position 2 must be mounted more than 150mm from car centre line.
Yes, exactly, what McLaren did with the MP4-30's cameras seems to be what's at the maximum height and minimum width allowed based on 20.3.4.
Cameras are not bodywork.
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astracrazy
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W06 Speculation

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is it also worth (maybe) comparing the rake angle of the w06 against the w05 at the last races of the season, because these first shots of the w05 had fric?

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turbof1
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W06 Speculation

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CmdrVOODOO wrote:
turbof1 wrote:I'm trying to bend my head around how those camera pods are legal. This is the rule that has been specifically changed to this year:
20.3.4 When viewed from the side of the car, the entire camera or camera housing in position 2
shown in Drawing 6 must lie within a box formed by two vertical lines 150mm and 450mm forward of the front wheel centre line and two horizontal lines 325mm and 525mm above the reference plane. Furthermore, the entire camera or camera housing in position 2 must be mounted more than 150mm from car centre line.
Yes, exactly, what McLaren did with the MP4-30's cameras seems to be what's at the maximum height and minimum width allowed based on 20.3.4.
I think I got it.

The 20.3.4 describes a 3 dimensional box where the camera should be located. Note that this is completely seperate from the nose and as the regulated dimensions will not change along different nose cones.

The 3 dimensional box describes in which width and height you can place the camera pod including its pylon. As said, its height is fixed because of this. Very crucially though, the depth, distance from the car's centreline, is unlimited in its maximum length. It has a minimum length going from the car centreline, which was added to forbid the camera housing inside the nosecone, but not a maximum one.

This means that while you are not allowed to tower the pylons high above the nose, you can stretch the pylons without restrictions. I'm surely missing a rule somewhere else that limits any and all bodywork from going to unlimited, but this might be why the mercedes solution is still very much allowed. Mercedes simply has less room to manueuvre with the pods, but they can still apply it.

I quickly mocked up a diagram to show this. Note I only made a graphical aproximation to give people an idea.
http://u.cubeupload.com/turbof1/camerap ... lowedr.jpg

It's curious that last year the mercedes design was said to be outlawed in 2015. However, despite the new rules it's still open to have such a design. Another screwup from the fia?
#AeroFrodo

Just_a_fan
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W06 Speculation

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turbof1 wrote: I'm surely missing a rule somewhere else that limits any and all bodywork from going to unlimited, but this might be why the mercedes solution is still very much allowed.
Camera mounts are not bodywork...
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CmdrVOODOO
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W06 Speculation

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turbof1 wrote: I think I got it.

The 20.3.4 describes a 3 dimensional box where the camera should be located. Note that this is completely seperate from the nose and as the regulated dimensions will not change along different nose cones.

The 3 dimensional box describes in which width and height you can place the camera pod including its pylon. As said, its height is fixed because of this. Very crucially though, the depth, distance from the car's centreline, is unlimited in its maximum length. It has a minimum length going from the car centreline, which was added to forbid the camera housing inside the nosecone, but not a maximum one.

This means that while you are not allowed to tower the pylons high above the nose, you can stretch the pylons without restrictions. I'm surely missing a rule somewhere else that limits any and all bodywork from going to unlimited, but this might be why the mercedes solution is still very much allowed. Mercedes simply has less room to manueuvre with the pods, but they can still apply it.

I quickly mocked up a diagram to show this. Note I only made a graphical aproximation to give people an idea.
http://u.cubeupload.com/turbof1/camerap ... lowedr.jpg

It's curious that last year the mercedes design was said to be outlawed in 2015. However, despite the new rules it's still open to have such a design. Another screwup from the fia?
I believe you do have it, yes.

It's because the Mercedes' nose is so low and short (compared to the MP4-30), so the "3 dimensional box" compared to the body rather than the nose where the cameras must be mounted is actually higher than the W06's nose is. So in order for them to get the cameras into that 3 dimensional box they have to raise them up off of the nose.

20.3.2 Any part provided by the Competitor for the purpose of aligning a camera or camera housing in positions 2 or 3 correctly will be considered part of the camera or housing provided it is being fitted for that sole purpose.

So, yes, technically the mounts sole purpose is to get the cameras into the 3 dimensional box specified in 20.3.4.

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turbof1
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W06 Speculation

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Just_a_fan wrote:
turbof1 wrote: I'm surely missing a rule somewhere else that limits any and all bodywork from going to unlimited, but this might be why the mercedes solution is still very much allowed.
Camera mounts are not bodywork...
I know the exception regulation. What I'm getting at, is that there probably be a rule that will forbid anything outside a certain distance from the car centreline. else you'd be able to stretch the camera housing, and its pylon, to in front of the tyre so to speak.

@CmdrVOODOO: I think it's pretty clear, but I just want to repeat this to avoid confusion: the camera mounts are part of the housing (as you said and quoted the regulations). In mercedes' case they have lowered the upper edge of the nose cone right beneath that box, meaning the mounts can start at the minimum height and stretch them to the maximum height, utilizing the full 200mm height.

If we look at the side view pictures of both the W05 and W06, we can indeed see that the W06 has a slightly stronger downwards slope in the nosecone, meaning it'll be definitely be low at the point where the camera housing should be. Given they specifically shaped the nose cone structure for such a camera construction, one can conclude this is a very significant aero solution.
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Ferraripilot
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W06 Speculation

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It looks like the area under the nose inlet actually directs air under the car, or at least directly to the tea tray. Anyone else notice this?

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Afterburner
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W06 Speculation

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Interesting, it seems W06 has a shorter wheelbase, W05 packaging was impressive already, with W06 it's even more impressive!

frosty125
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W06 Speculation

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Mercedes will probably have less room for optimisation on cooling. Last year they had an optimal package where as other teams were in the dark with outdated data on cooling requirements until the last second.

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KingHamilton01
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W06 Speculation

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I expect teams will visit this with charlie whiting if they feel that mercedes are gaining an aero advantage, team's will be constantly trying to push what is legal and find extra downforce and performance. Either way sure Mercedes aren't bothered as it is easy to fix.
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ringo
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W06 Speculation

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What ever happened to the the mickey mouse intakes on the side of the engine intake?

I notice this car also has winglets at the front of the sidepods and also different mirrors. So far the mclaren is looking to be the most advanced chassis out of those revealed.
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poolboy67
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W06 Speculation

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to me this looks like w05 with some new parts and the new nose put onto it. if this really is the w06 the they sure haven't done alot of changes to the bodywork.

i wouldn't be surprised if a real w06 would be first seen when the tests start.
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diego.liv
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W06 Speculation

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Personally, i'm not that much disappointed with the colour scheme regarding the use of black..from a front view, you can't see the silver in the section of the tires, and this, along with black camera mountings, let you focus more on the other silver areas.
But, yes, a bit less-serious livery would have pleased the most of us more, a bit of white, changes with the Petronas green; maybe they're 'too focused with the elegant look they want to show for the brand's sake'

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Ferraripilot
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W06 Speculation

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Afterburner wrote:Interesting, it seems W06 has a shorter wheelbase, W05 packaging was impressive already, with W06 it's even more impressive!

It does indeed seem a tiny bit shorter doesn't it. That might make the front end a bit sharper as W05 and just about every car on the field appeared to have some level of understeer.

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MercedesAMGSpy
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Re: Mercedes AMG F1 W06 Speculation

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diego.liv wrote:Personally, i'm not that much disappointed with the colour scheme regarding the use of black..from a front view, you can't see the silver in the section of the tires, and this, along with black camera mountings, let you focus more on the other silver areas.
But, yes, a bit less-serious livery would have pleased the most of us more, a bit of white, changes with the Petronas green; maybe they're 'too focused with the elegant look they want to show for the brand's sake'
A Ferrari is red, a Mercedes is silver. That won't change, only small details.