2018 Monaco Grand Prix, Monte Carlo, May 24-27

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dans79
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Re: 2018 Monaco Grand Prix, Monte Carlo, May 24-27

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zibby43 wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 9:39 am
This is likely relevant for this weekend . . .

Mercedes asking for clarification on oil burning. Another oil burning loophole closed as a result . . .

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/merc ... e-1040317/
Does anyone know if a team has ever had 2 formal protests filed against them at the same race? It looms like it's a possibility for Ferrari, one for the MGU-K questions and one now for special oil in the turbo.
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foxmulder_ms
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Re: 2018 Monaco Grand Prix, Monte Carlo, May 24-27

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ian_s wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 1:47 pm
ricciardo pole, vestappen 2nd, 1st corner vestappen takes out ricciardo, double RB DNF
I prefer Ves taking out Vettel. Kimi should be winner again asap.

TheFluffy
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Re: 2018 Monaco Grand Prix, Monte Carlo, May 24-27

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foxmulder_ms wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 3:10 pm
ian_s wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 1:47 pm
ricciardo pole, vestappen 2nd, 1st corner vestappen takes out ricciardo, double RB DNF
I prefer Ves taking out Vettel. Kimi should be winner again asap.
So you essentially want the championship to be over? Before even half way in the season. Let's be honest Ferrari will not outdevelop Mercedes, and as seen from last time out there is already a huge gap. So the championship is essentially over. If you remember even last year in Spain, the performance between Ferrari and Mercedes were a lot closer.

LM10
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Re: 2018 Monaco Grand Prix, Monte Carlo, May 24-27

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TheFluffy wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 3:27 pm
foxmulder_ms wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 3:10 pm
ian_s wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 1:47 pm
ricciardo pole, vestappen 2nd, 1st corner vestappen takes out ricciardo, double RB DNF
I prefer Ves taking out Vettel. Kimi should be winner again asap.
So you essentially want the championship to be over? Before even half way in the season. Let's be honest Ferrari will not outdevelop Mercedes, and as seen from last time out there is already a huge gap. So the championship is essentially over. If you remember even last year in Spain, the performance between Ferrari and Mercedes were a lot closer.
Have you also told that there was a gap between Ferrari and Mercedes in the last couple of races?
"Already a huge gap" because Ferrari pretty obviously was massively struggling with tyres (Mary Hughes wrote an article regarding that - he assumes it was due to the new rear suspension pick-up point)?
How can you even tell that the championship is over? :)
And how are you so sure that Ferrari won't outdevelop Mercedes when the SF71H theoretically has much potential in it since it's clearly different to it's predecessor?

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dans79
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Re: 2018 Monaco Grand Prix, Monte Carlo, May 24-27

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LM10 wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 3:44 pm
And how are you so sure that Ferrari won't outdevelop Mercedes when the SF71H theoretically has much potential in it since it's clearly different to it's predecessor?
Since the end of unlimited in season testing, Ferrari's development rate has not been very impressive.
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TheFluffy
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Re: 2018 Monaco Grand Prix, Monte Carlo, May 24-27

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LM10 wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 3:44 pm
TheFluffy wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 3:27 pm
foxmulder_ms wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 3:10 pm


I prefer Ves taking out Vettel. Kimi should be winner again asap.
So you essentially want the championship to be over? Before even half way in the season. Let's be honest Ferrari will not outdevelop Mercedes, and as seen from last time out there is already a huge gap. So the championship is essentially over. If you remember even last year in Spain, the performance between Ferrari and Mercedes were a lot closer.
Have you also told that there was a gap between Ferrari and Mercedes in the last couple of races?
"Already a huge gap" because Ferrari pretty obviously was massively struggling with tyres (Mary Hughes wrote an article regarding that - he assumes it was due to the new rear suspension pick-up point)?
How can you even tell that the championship is over? :)
And how are you so sure that Ferrari won't outdevelop Mercedes when the SF71H theoretically has much potential in it since it's clearly different to it's predecessor?
I doubt it was because of the new rear suspension, which I believe was only used in Vettel's car so if so then Kimi should have exploited the car and tyres to the maximum potential. Potentially Ferrari's car has a lot of potential but the point is that the Ferrari team still seems to be making mistakes. From drivers (Kimi not fast enough) to strategists (not boxing Seb immediately in China leading to Bottas undercut to work) to factory workers (Kimi's engine failure TWICE in a weekend) and mechanics (failing to change Kimi's tyres appropriately TWICE in Bahrain). You could even argue that Ferrari were wrong to pit Vettel under the VSC in Australia despite most people knowing a safety car would come out (but I guess the result concealed that potential error)

Do we see Mercedes make these small mistakes almost every weekend? The thing is Ferrari is not a well oiled machine and even though some weekends they were faster than Mercedes car pace wise, they are either just in front (ie in Bahrain) or behind (like in China). Mercedes is a machine that cant be stopped!!

santos
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Re: 2018 Monaco Grand Prix, Monte Carlo, May 24-27

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☝ loool

Just_a_fan
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Re: 2018 Monaco Grand Prix, Monte Carlo, May 24-27

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LM10 wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 3:44 pm

And how are you so sure that Ferrari won't outdevelop Mercedes when the SF71H theoretically has much potential in it since it's clearly different to it's predecessor?
That might be determined by whether the latest oil/turbo clarification affects their car more than Mercedes. If Mercedes asked about it, then we can assume it was aimed at Ferrari. How much performance loss is felt from obeying the clarification will determine their development route and rate.
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TAG
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Re: 2018 Monaco Grand Prix, Monte Carlo, May 24-27

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foxmulder_ms wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 3:10 pm
ian_s wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 1:47 pm
ricciardo pole, vestappen 2nd, 1st corner vestappen takes out ricciardo, double RB DNF
I prefer Ves taking out Vettel. Kimi should be winner again asap.
There is an alternate universe in which Kimi wins a race again before he's put out to pasture.
माकडाच्या हाती कोलीत

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Vettel165
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Re: 2018 Monaco Grand Prix, Monte Carlo, May 24-27

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In Baku Mercedes struggle with the tyres and you saw Ferrari dominating the Q3, and also in the race. In Spain it was the opposite with Mercedes dominating, because of Ferrari problems with the tyres. You see now that the tyres are more important than ever, and getting them to the optimal temperature, and that they work is really crucial. The team (Mercedes, Ferrari) who will get it right in most races will win the WDC. So everything is open, I still see Ferrari as the fastest car (but a fix with better reliability, strategy should really be welcome) on the grid out there, Montreal will tell a lot. In Monaco on paper it should be RBR as the best team, with Ferrari closely behind and Mercedes as a third best team.

saviour stivala
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Re: 2018 Monaco Grand Prix, Monte Carlo, May 24-27

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foxmulder_ms wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 3:10 pm
ian_s wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 1:47 pm
ricciardo pole, vestappen 2nd, 1st corner vestappen takes out ricciardo, double RB DNF
I prefer Ves taking out Vettel. Kimi should be winner again asap.
Just imagine max threesixty having a sudden 150hp spike in Monaco.

LM10
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Re: 2018 Monaco Grand Prix, Monte Carlo, May 24-27

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TheFluffy wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 3:57 pm
LM10 wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 3:44 pm
TheFluffy wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 3:27 pm


So you essentially want the championship to be over? Before even half way in the season. Let's be honest Ferrari will not outdevelop Mercedes, and as seen from last time out there is already a huge gap. So the championship is essentially over. If you remember even last year in Spain, the performance between Ferrari and Mercedes were a lot closer.
Have you also told that there was a gap between Ferrari and Mercedes in the last couple of races?
"Already a huge gap" because Ferrari pretty obviously was massively struggling with tyres (Mary Hughes wrote an article regarding that - he assumes it was due to the new rear suspension pick-up point)?
How can you even tell that the championship is over? :)
And how are you so sure that Ferrari won't outdevelop Mercedes when the SF71H theoretically has much potential in it since it's clearly different to it's predecessor?
I doubt it was because of the new rear suspension, which I believe was only used in Vettel's car so if so then Kimi should have exploited the car and tyres to the maximum potential.
From Mark Hughe's article:

"Sebastian Vettel tried this revised version in practice and after his feedback it was fitted to both his car and that of Kimi Raikkonen’s for qualifying and race. However, the team have since been trying to assess whether this change may have inadvertently contributed towards the car’s greater appetite for rear rubber since February testing. How? Because the change in articulation of the suspension may have been enough to induce more heat in the outer shoulder of the tyre, taking it past the threshold at which blistering will be initiated."

TheFluffy
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Re: 2018 Monaco Grand Prix, Monte Carlo, May 24-27

Post

LM10 wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 5:59 pm
TheFluffy wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 3:57 pm
LM10 wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 3:44 pm


Have you also told that there was a gap between Ferrari and Mercedes in the last couple of races?
"Already a huge gap" because Ferrari pretty obviously was massively struggling with tyres (Mary Hughes wrote an article regarding that - he assumes it was due to the new rear suspension pick-up point)?
How can you even tell that the championship is over? :)
And how are you so sure that Ferrari won't outdevelop Mercedes when the SF71H theoretically has much potential in it since it's clearly different to it's predecessor?
I doubt it was because of the new rear suspension, which I believe was only used in Vettel's car so if so then Kimi should have exploited the car and tyres to the maximum potential.
From Mark Hughe's article:

"Sebastian Vettel tried this revised version in practice and after his feedback it was fitted to both his car and that of Kimi Raikkonen’s for qualifying and race. However, the team have since been trying to assess whether this change may have inadvertently contributed towards the car’s greater appetite for rear rubber since February testing. How? Because the change in articulation of the suspension may have been enough to induce more heat in the outer shoulder of the tyre, taking it past the threshold at which blistering will be initiated."
Thanks for giving me the quote. I did not read the article. :) But when I first look at the pictures I thought it was more an aero guided change instead of an mechanical change. But I guess it could be both ways. But what i was saying still applies, there were errors on Ferrari's behalf and cannot be fully pointed to the change of tyres or suspension change. They had the quickest car in 4/5 races and somehow are behind in drivers and constructors and Kimi is a distant 4th in the championship. It's not great as history dictates they cannot develop as quickly as others. Case in point last year, started the year about the same as Merc and ended with 2/4 tenths slower than Merc

LM10
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Re: 2018 Monaco Grand Prix, Monte Carlo, May 24-27

Post

TheFluffy wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 6:05 pm
LM10 wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 5:59 pm
TheFluffy wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 3:57 pm


I doubt it was because of the new rear suspension, which I believe was only used in Vettel's car so if so then Kimi should have exploited the car and tyres to the maximum potential.
From Mark Hughe's article:

"Sebastian Vettel tried this revised version in practice and after his feedback it was fitted to both his car and that of Kimi Raikkonen’s for qualifying and race. However, the team have since been trying to assess whether this change may have inadvertently contributed towards the car’s greater appetite for rear rubber since February testing. How? Because the change in articulation of the suspension may have been enough to induce more heat in the outer shoulder of the tyre, taking it past the threshold at which blistering will be initiated."
Thanks for giving me the quote. I did not read the article. :) But when I first look at the pictures I thought it was more an aero guided change instead of an mechanical change. But I guess it could be both ways. But what i was saying still applies, there were errors on Ferrari's behalf and cannot be fully pointed to the change of tyres or suspension change. They had the quickest car in 4/5 races and somehow are behind in drivers and constructors and Kimi is a distant 4th in the championship. It's not great as history dictates they cannot develop as quickly as others. Case in point last year, started the year about the same as Merc and ended with 2/4 tenths slower than Merc
You're welcome. :) Well, I agree with you that there are errors on Ferrari side way too often.

zibby43
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Re: 2018 Monaco Grand Prix, Monte Carlo, May 24-27

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dans79 wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 2:21 pm
zibby43 wrote:
Tue May 22, 2018 9:39 am
This is likely relevant for this weekend . . .

Mercedes asking for clarification on oil burning. Another oil burning loophole closed as a result . . .

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/merc ... e-1040317/
Does anyone know if a team has ever had 2 formal protests filed against them at the same race? It looms like it's a possibility for Ferrari, one for the MGU-K questions and one now for special oil in the turbo.
That's a great question. Will do some digging.