2021 AMG Mercedes F1 Team

[nacho]

Hamilton's previos laps were
1.20.9
1.21.2 (At the end of this lap Lewis was under 1 second behind and in turbulent air)

then the lap he passed Bottas
1.22.6

So looking at the was around 1.4 - 1.7 seconds comparing to the previous 2 laps.

How much did Bottas lose?

[dans79]

The last couple of races Pirelli has brought the hardest three compounds of tyres and Mercedes performance has been very good, does anyone think that when softer compounds are brought Mercedes will struggle with them?

I don't think so, as they saw the C4 in Bahrain and Imola, and did ok with them when they had substantially less experience with the tires. The only compound they haven't already seen is the C5. They will get their first taste of the C5 in Monaco, and I think they will do fine with them given how much they have learned about the tires since testing, and how much they have improved their set-up.

[Marty_Y]

The last couple of races Pirelli has brought the hardest three compounds of tyres and Mercedes performance has been very good, does anyone think that when softer compounds are brought Mercedes will struggle with them?

I don't think so, as they saw the C4 in Bahrain and Imola, and did ok with them when they had substantially less experience with the tires. The only compound they haven't already seen is the C5. They will get their first taste of the C5 in Monaco, and I think they will do fine with them given how much they have learned about the tires since testing, and how much they have improved their set-up.

Thanks, yes it seems that they have a much better understanding of how to set up the W12 since testing, the improvement is remarkable. It will be good to see the W12 in Monaco this year, it's a shame that we never got to see the W11 there.

[dans79]

Thanks, yes it seems that they have a much better understanding of how to set up the W12 since testing, the improvement is remarkable. It will be good to see the W12 in Monaco this year, it's a shame that we never got to see the W11 there.

I'd add that if the working temperature range is as it was in 2019 & 2020 they should be fine, as the working range of the C5 is only slightly lower than the C4s that they ran in Bahrain and Imola.

[NathanOlder]

How do we think the Merc drivers will do at Monaco, underdogs?

[dans79]

How do we think the Merc drivers will do at Monaco, underdogs?

I'd say favorites or even.


Horner's comments seem to hint at the same.
https://www.bbc.com/sport/formula1/57050646

Horner said: "We have to take the positives to the next race in Monaco, that we have managed to push them so close at this circuit, a track where they were a long way ahead last year and which has been a strong point for them.

"Every Grand Prix apart from Bahrain there has been less than 0.1secs between us and pole, so it has been phenomenally close. We need to make sure we beat Mercedes in Monaco, but it will be incredibly tough."

[godlameroso]

Hamilton is truly incredible, he has this effect on people

[mkay]

How do we think the Merc drivers will do at Monaco, underdogs?

For what it's worth, in Barcelona, VER was faster in S3 in both quali and race, particularly through and out of the last chicane, and T5 (the second slowest corner now).

Also, we don't know how Merc will cope with the C5s yet.

I reserve judgment until free practices, but I think it'll be down to whoever has the best run in Q3. Also, important to note that Monaco hasn't been a happy hunting ground for Max historically.

[PlatinumZealot]

How much time did Hamilton lose, it was a couple of corners unless Bottas really slowed down like being lapped?

2 Seconds in one sector.

[PlatinumZealot]

How much time did Hamilton lose, it was a couple of corners unless Bottas really slowed down like being lapped?

It wasn't too much, maybe 1 second overall. Lewis passed him before T10 and really only caught him around Turn2-3.

Arround 2 seconds.

It should have been a -1.5 to Max on current pace but ended up being a + 0.5 by the end of the lap.

[Spacepace]

Something that could be being overlooked is that MBAMG would have understood the car in Bahrain if they would have had 8 days of testing. This is the first time teams have had only 3 days and Mercedes really only had 2 days with the work they had to do on day one.

[Mr.S]

For me personally, I thought Hamilton proved his skill when he went head to head against Alonso in his Rookie Year. Also, bagging all those podiums in his first races with McLaren (no matter how dominant McLaren may have been at the time) got my attention. Here's a rookie, bringing the fight to the great Fernando Alonso. Ever since then, I was convinced that given the right machinery, this driver was going to dominate in the same way Michael Schumacher did.

While he was in a dominant car in the Mercedes, I think it is also important to note his accomplishments outside dominating cars. I do not count the McLaren of 2008 as a dominant car because Ferrari got the WCC that year.

Also, I think Rosberg was an underrated driver. He had an excellent record prior to driving against Lewis. He is at least much much better than Bottas IMO. The outlier I think was where Button outperformed Lewis, but that can be due to distractions in Lewis' personal life too.

One last thing, I think Lewis improves after every major challenge. He's a much different driver to what we saw in 2016 and in my opinion he just keeps improving. I do not think he still possesses the single lap pace he did when he was younger, but I do think he is a more complete racing driver now.

The 2008 thing is not right. Mclaren had a quick car capable of winning. They should have won the Constructors Championship as well but their 2nd Driver Kovalanein was an absolute joke IMO who did terrible. On pace, Mclaren was IMO a winning car. The highest number of poles in 2008 went to Hamilton. He has 7 to Massa's 6. Mclaren had 8 poles to Ferrari's 8. Japan & Brazil were bad races for Hamilton & Mclaren. It should never have been this close.

You are right that Hamilton keeps improving. He is a much more refined & complete driver than the one who lost in points to Button over 3 seasons & got beaten convincingly in 2011. He is better than what he was in 2016 as well

But he has had 3 seasons where he couldn't beat his team-mate in his prime. But Lewis is one of the best ever especially earlier in raw pace & now also in race craft. But he is beatable.

[zibby43]

How do we think the Merc drivers will do at Monaco, underdogs?

For what it's worth, in Barcelona, VER was faster in S3 in both quali and race, particularly through and out of the last chicane, and T5 (the second slowest corner now).

Also, we don't know how Merc will cope with the C5s yet.

I reserve judgment until free practices, but I think it'll be down to whoever has the best run in Q3. Also, important to note that Monaco hasn't been a happy hunting ground for Max historically.

Merc as a team, however, were on average faster than RB as a team through S3 in qualifying.

I haven't seen all of the S3 times in the race, aside from the fastest sectors, which were obviously skewed by both Verstappen and Perez going for fastest lap (something Hamilton did not do).

In Portimao, Merc were about 0.3s faster than RBR in the slow corners. In Monaco, Merc can pile on as much dirty downforce as they want, which expands their setup window because it eliminates the rear instability problem. Should help them work the softer compounds as well.

Very little deg in Monaco, too, which should help Merc capitalize upon their strength of good degradation.

Also agree re: Max's track record in Monaco.

[mkay]

How do we think the Merc drivers will do at Monaco, underdogs?

For what it's worth, in Barcelona, VER was faster in S3 in both quali and race, particularly through and out of the last chicane, and T5 (the second slowest corner now).

Also, we don't know how Merc will cope with the C5s yet.

I reserve judgment until free practices, but I think it'll be down to whoever has the best run in Q3. Also, important to note that Monaco hasn't been a happy hunting ground for Max historically.

Merc as a team, however, were on average faster than RB as a team through S3 in qualifying.

I haven't seen all of the S3 times in the race, aside from the fastest sectors, which were obviously skewed by both Verstappen and Perez going for fastest lap (something Hamilton did not do).

In Portimao, Merc were about 0.3s faster than RBR in the slow corners. In Monaco, Merc can pile on as much dirty downforce as they want, which expands their setup window because it eliminates the rear instability problem. Should help them work the softer compounds as well.

Very little deg in Monaco, too, which should help Merc capitalize upon their strength of good degradation.

Also agree re: Max's track record in Monaco.

During the race, not sure if it's due to the chicane, but Merc (HAM) was definitely slower through the chicane than VER.

Even on their best Q3 laps, VER carried 5-6kph extra through the last chicane than HAM.

Let's hope the full downforce package helps with softer tyres. I don't agree with you, however, on the deg. No deg in Monaco neutralises Merc's advantage; Monaco is an easy 1-stopper where track position is everything. Working the tyres hard doesn't get penalised, it gets rewarded if anything (see Merc in 2013).

[NathanOlder]

For what it's worth, in Barcelona, VER was faster in S3 in both quali and race, particularly through and out of the last chicane, and T5 (the second slowest corner now).

Also, we don't know how Merc will cope with the C5s yet.

I reserve judgment until free practices, but I think it'll be down to whoever has the best run in Q3. Also, important to note that Monaco hasn't been a happy hunting ground for Max historically.

Merc as a team, however, were on average faster than RB as a team through S3 in qualifying.

I haven't seen all of the S3 times in the race, aside from the fastest sectors, which were obviously skewed by both Verstappen and Perez going for fastest lap (something Hamilton did not do).

In Portimao, Merc were about 0.3s faster than RBR in the slow corners. In Monaco, Merc can pile on as much dirty downforce as they want, which expands their setup window because it eliminates the rear instability problem. Should help them work the softer compounds as well.

Very little deg in Monaco, too, which should help Merc capitalize upon their strength of good degradation.

Also agree re: Max's track record in Monaco.

During the race, not sure if it's due to the chicane, but Merc (HAM) was definitely slower through the chicane than VER.

Even on their best Q3 laps, VER carried 5-6kph extra through the last chicane than HAM.

Let's hope the full downforce package helps with softer tyres. I don't agree with you, however, on the deg. No deg in Monaco neutralises Merc's advantage; Monaco is an easy 1-stopper where track position is everything. Working the tyres hard doesn't get penalised, it gets rewarded if anything (see Merc in 2013).

Yeah I agree the RedBull appeared faster, but 2 things that have skewed the view was, on their best runs in Q3, Lewis took a comprimised line in to turn 13 where Perez spun as Lewis avoided the gravel out there. Not sure if he needed to but he did just to be safe. Then during the race, the whole time they were on equal tyres, Lewis was stuck behind Max. He would close up a little on the back straight, then fall back in turn 10, 12 and 13 with the dirty air. So his sector times were showing this. I dont think we got a true picture of the S3 times in the race .